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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
What do you guys think?


I have seen the HC5500 for $1400 refurbished and the Pro 8100 for $1300 new. I am more leaning towards the Pro8100. What do you guys suggest? I like the HC5500 but the refurbished part gets me, The 8100 is a tad cheaper, but the bulb life isnt as great. Its this or the HD70 but the contrast is only 500:1 so i would think the blacks on either of the other two would be so much better.


The good is that the viewsonic has a 36month warranty, where as the hc5500 has only a year. Also i can get $157 cash back on the pro8100 with microsoft bringing it down to $1143? Sounds like a good deal? or should i pay the additional $257 for the hc5500?
 

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You mean the HD20. The 500:1 is ANSI contrast (500:1 is very good). Which meansure the difference between between dark and light in a single image. The 2000:1 + ratios are on/off contrast which is completely different and measures the difference between a pure white image and a pure black image.


I would read the reviews of the other two at www.projectorreviews.com
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by gwlaw99 /forum/post/16915629


You mean the HD20. The 500:1 is ANSI contrast (500:1 is very good). Which meansure the difference between between dark and light in a single image. The 2000:1 + ratios are on/off contrast which is completely different and measures the difference between a pure white image and a pure black image.


I would read the reviews of the other two at www.projectorreviews.com

Wait, so what your saying is the HD20 has better contrast than the hc5500 or the pro8100?


I dont quit understand contrast ratio's I thought the higher it was, the better it is. So you saying the 500:1 is better than the 13000:1 stated on the specs of the pro8100?
 

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They are two completely different measurements. They measure two totally different things. 500:1 is very good for ANSI contrast(the ANSI contrast of the HC5500 is 260:1 and the pro8100 is 268). No one knows the on/off contrast of the HD20, but I suspect it will be in the 2500-3000:1 range. The 20000:1 and 50000:1 contrast ratios are somwhat misleading as they are obtained by restricting light output with an Iris.


A Projector can be better than another projector in on/off contrast and worse in ANSI contrast.


ANSI measures the difference in the same scene. So for example, in a scene with a large black boat on a bright sunny day, the projector with the higher ANSI contrast will have darker black levels .


On/off contrast affects the black levels in a dark scene. So for example, the projector with the higher on/off contrast will have darker blacks in a scene in which someone is walking through a dark dungeon.


The best way to determine how a projector looks in the real world is to ignore manufactuer specs and read reviews at sites like www.projectorreviews.com
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by gwlaw99 /forum/post/16919597


They are two completely different measurements. They measure two totally different things. 500:1 is very good for ANSI contrast(the ANSI contrast of the HC5500 is 260:1 and the pro8100 is 268). No one knows the on/off contrast of the HD20, but I suspect it will be in the 2500-3000:1 range. The 20000:1 and 50000:1 contrast ratios are somwhat misleading as they are obtained by restricting light output with an Iris.


A Projector can be better than another projector in on/off contrast and worse in ANSI contrast.


ANSI measures the difference in the same scene. So for example, in a scene with a large black boat on a bright sunny day, the projector with the higher ANSI contrast will have darker black levels .


On/off contrast affects the black levels in a dark scene. So for example, the projector with the higher on/off contrast will have darker blacks in a scene in which someone is walking through a dark dungeon.


The best way to determine how a projector looks in the real world is to ignore manufactuer specs and read reviews at sites like www.projectorreviews.com

Thanks for clearing that up. I thought the higher the better. So it looks like i need to decide between the HD20 or the new Vivitech These are the specs. Is the vivitek 5000:1 ansi like the optima is 4000:1?


Optoma HD20 $999.00

Type DLP

Resolution: 1080

Contrast: 4000:1

Lumens: 1700


Vivitek H1080FD $999.00

Type DLP

Resolution: 1080

Contrast: 5000:1

Lumens: 1800

jgw1973 is online now Reply With Quote
 

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the hc 5500 has more sharp image and more film like picture than the viewsonic pro8100

also it has butterfly iris techniqe its better than the slide door iris techniqe used in the viewsonic , considering the colour viewsonic is much more vivd and dark is much better than the hc 5500. both uses 0.74 x3 lcd , both uses hqv engine, the remote and the design of the viewsonic is superior to the mitsubishi, the warrenty of the viewsonic is better, the hc 5500 has a limited placment. so if you like the sharp image and tend to watch movies alot go for the mitsubishi and if you like vivd colour slightly less sharp but like to play video games more go for the viewsonic.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by bouda78 /forum/post/16925820


the hc 5500 has more sharp image and more film like picture than the viewsonic pro8100

also it has butterfly iris techniqe its better than the slide door iris techniqe used in the viewsonic , considering the colour viewsonic is much more vivd and dark is much better than the hc 5500. both uses 0.74 x3 lcd , both uses hqv engine, the remote and the design of the viewsonic is superior to the mitsubishi, the warrenty of the viewsonic is better, the hc 5500 has a limited placment. so if you like the sharp image and tend to watch movies alot go for the mitsubishi and if you like vivd colour slightly less sharp but like to play video games more go for the viewsonic.

Thanks I've actually decided to go with the new Optoma HD20 I just hope its as good as it sounds.
 

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i advice you not to go, first of all hd20 is dlp 2nd the hd20 have single 0.65 lens , the viewsonic and the hc5500 have 3 lens 0.74 which predict a better sharpness and throw range , 3rd hd 20 dosent have hqv image processing which the viewsonic have hqv 210, the hc5500 have hqv 200, also the hd20 have manual foucs which a bit premitive and low cost for the company, the viewsonic have horizental and vertical motorized control.

so i advice you to pay 400$ more and get all that with classy look good luck
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by bouda78 /forum/post/16930297


i advice you not to go, first of all hd20 is dlp 2nd the hd20 have single 0.65 lens , the viewsonic and the hc5500 have 3 lens 0.74 which predict a better sharpness and throw range , 3rd hd 20 dosent have hqv image processing which the viewsonic have hqv 210, the hc5500 have hqv 200, also the hd20 have manual foucs which a bit premitive and low cost for the company, the viewsonic have horizental and vertical motorized control.

so i advice you to pay 400$ more and get all that with classy look good luck

I had a HD200x and returned it after seeing no difference between it and my Epson 720. In fact I preferred the Epson in some cases. Not only that but my Epson is much much brighter and the HD200x bright mode is very loud. If the HD20 is anything like the HD200x, don't get it over the Viewsonic or Mitsubishi. They are both excellent machines and would have one already if they weren't so expensive in Canada.


The Mitsubishi is sharper, otherwise the Viewsonic is a better machine, IMO.
 

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The Mitsubishi is very Dim. I have a Pro8100. It is great. I prefer it to the Epson 6100, and returned the Epson due mostly to the defocussing issues.


Also, I am not sure I agree the Mitsu is sharper, I could have bought the HC6500 for the same price as the Pro8100, and have seen both machines. The HC6500 is the demo unit at our BB Magnolia.


Image-wise, the Viewsonic was better. I even talked BB into putting up a Firehawk to get a real comparison (I have the Firehawk G2 at home.) It is brighter and colors just look better. I do not feel either one has very good black levels. I have seen the JVCs. Big mistake! Now everything looks poor by comparison.


The Viewsonic is quiet, but the Mitsubishi is silent.


I had an Optima HD80 prior to the Viewsonic. Both are better machines than the older DLP. I love the quiet, and will never own another roaring projector. Power everything is a nice touch!
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by bouda78 /forum/post/16930297


i advice you not to go, first of all hd20 is dlp 2nd the hd20 have single 0.65 lens , the viewsonic and the hc5500 have 3 lens 0.74 which predict a better sharpness and throw range , 3rd hd 20 dosent have hqv image processing which the viewsonic have hqv 210, the hc5500 have hqv 200, also the hd20 have manual foucs which a bit premitive and low cost for the company, the viewsonic have horizental and vertical motorized control.

so i advice you to pay 400$ more and get all that with classy look good luck

Bouda78, not to be rude but what you posted was all false information. For starters, the ANSI contrast on a DLP is much higher then that of the LCD units. A higher ANSI contrast will result in a picture that has a lot of pop and vibrance. Secondly, the .65 and the .74 and the 3 chip and 1 chip dont have ANYTHING to do with the lens. When they talk about 1 .65, they mean that there is a single DMD chip that measures .65 inches diagonally. When they say 3 .74 LCD, they mean there are 3 .74 inch diagonal LCD panels inside. One for each color, red, green, and blue. The fill factor for a DLP chip is somthing like 90% (cant remember off the top of my head), and the fill factor for the LCD panels is somthing like 43%. That means that over 50% of the LCD is space inbetween pixels. This causes the infamous SDE problem with LCD projectors. DLP projectors do not suffer this problem because the pixels are much closer together, eliminating SDE. Also, DLP projector are much more reliable then LCD. An LCD projector will yellow and fade within a few hundred hours, where as a DLP projector will look the same as the day you bought it a few years from now. I am not trying to start a DLP vs. LCD argument, I am just stating the true facts. I would have definently gone with a DLP. I have owned the mitsubishi HC6000, but I much prefer a nice 720P DLP over a LCD 1080p any day. Digital cinemas are not using LCD technology, they are using DLP, and its not by any accident. My local cinema is an all digital cinema and uses extremely nice DLP projectors made by Christie, and processing by technicolor.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by *UFO* /forum/post/16938891


Bouda78, not to be rude but what you posted was all false information. For starters, the ANSI contrast on a DLP is much higher then that of the LCD units. A higher ANSI contrast will result in a picture that has a lot of pop and vibrance. Secondly, the .65 and the .74 and the 3 chip and 1 chip dont have ANYTHING to do with the lens. When they talk about 1 .65, they mean that there is a single DMD chip that measures .65 inches diagonally. When they say 3 .74 LCD, they mean there are 3 .74 inch diagonal LCD panels inside. One for each color, red, green, and blue. The fill factor for a DLP chip is somthing like 90% (cant remember off the top of my head), and the fill factor for the LCD panels is somthing like 43%. That means that over 50% of the LCD is space inbetween pixels. This causes the infamous SDE problem with LCD projectors. DLP projectors do not suffer this problem because the pixels are much closer together, eliminating SDE. Also, DLP projector are much more reliable then LCD. An LCD projector will yellow and fade within a few hundred hours, where as a DLP projector will look the same as the day you bought it a few years from now. I am not trying to start a DLP vs. LCD argument, I am just stating the true facts. I would have definently gone with a DLP. I have owned the mitsubishi HC6000, but I much prefer a nice 720P DLP over a LCD 1080p any day. Digital cinemas are not using LCD technology, they are using DLP, and its not by any accident. My local cinema is an all digital cinema and uses extremely nice DLP projectors made by Christie, and processing by technicolor.

Thanks for that update, What do you think is better the HD20 or the Infocus X10? I know the HD20 is 500ansi, but i couldnt see anything on the Infocus on what the ANSI is. It did say it was 7500 contrast on and off, but thats not what i was looking for. What do you think?
 

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ufo after i read your thread i noticed that you have a limited knowledge about the projectors and prefer the old fashion dlp that been replaced by 2 generation lcd and lcos systems to most companies, i was trying to simplify information to not distract people in how to choose projectors so here things to start with and correct your information and to know that lcd is far better than dlp ,first about your static measurement ansi all projector manufacturer uses the dynamic measurment of contrast that came with the invention of iris so you dont have as old times black and whites at the same time "ANIS" they uses dynamic measurment thats give totally diffrenent results , considering the screen door effect was only not important issue that was fixed in early lcd projectors and to understand the lens concepts There are two broad categories of LCoS displays: three-panel and single-panel. In three-panel designs, there is one display chip per color, and the images are combined optically. In single-panel designs, one display chip shows the red, green, and blue components in succession with the observer's eyes relied upon to combine the color stream. As each color is presented, a color wheel (or an RGB LED array) illuminates the display with only red, green or blue light. If the frequency of the color fields is lower than about 540 Hz, an effect called color breakup is seen, where false colors are briefly perceived when either the image or the observer's eye is in motion. While less expensive; single-panel projectors require higher-speed display elements to process all three colors during a single frame time, and the need to avoid color breakup makes further demands on the speed of the display technology , In a DLP device the light is separated into three components and then combined back: Two beam splitters are needed. In LCoS devices the light is additionally polarized and then analyzed; four beam splitters are needed. In most DLP sets a color wheel separates colors from a lamp, using one chip for all three colors; SXRD sets use three separate chips, one for each color ,so when you have wide color range lens for each color thats means vivd proccessing , and when you have .74 thats means compact light through outputting a pixel color accuracy and thats projects a total of sharper , cripier image. so its so ignorant to choose dlp over lcd , like choosing windows98 over windows vista.

of course with respect to your taste.
 

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Where are you finding the Pro8100 for $1150? (feel free to PM with the info...).


I've been looking around, and haven't been too impressed with the features and specs on the new $1k 1080P projectors, so I think I'm going to go with the Pro8100. Given the current global economic situation, I just don't think that the projector manufacturers are going to be coming out with radically new and improved mid-level offerings. Instead, they'll probably roughly maintain the current price/performance structure...and if that's the case, I might as well get myself a Pro8100.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by nmuntean /forum/post/16965761


Where are you finding the Pro8100 for $1150? (feel free to PM with the info...).


I've been looking around, and haven't been too impressed with the features and specs on the new $1k 1080P projectors, so I think I'm going to go with the Pro8100. Given the current global economic situation, I just don't think that the projector manufacturers are going to be coming out with radically new and improved mid-level offerings. Instead, they'll probably roughly maintain the current price/performance structure...and if that's the case, I might as well get myself a Pro8100.

Just go to http://www.bing.com search for "tiger direct" click on the 12% cashback sponsor link at the top then search for "pro8100" add to cart and buy!


Let me know if you have any questions.

Here is a screen shot of what it looks like
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by slickdealmike /forum/post/16966095


Just go to http://www.bing.com search for "tiger direct" click on the 12% cashback sponsor link at the top then search for "pro8100" add to cart and buy!


Let me know if you have any questions.

Here is a screen shot of what it looks like

OK Slickdeal, I went for it! Thanks for the link, I could only find a 5% link before. You da man, Dude!
 

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Ok, I have been working my butt off for the last three months (it just turned midnight here in Nor Cal) but it should start winding down for me in about a month.


I built a 20' wide x 22' long HT room in my new house, bought 5 ht chairs and ran out of money for the Sony VPL-HW10 that I wanted last September.


I hadn't looked at this site in a while, and was cruising around it while waiting for some files to pdf when I saw some of the discussions for the Viewsonic Pro8100!


I am thinking this might be a good starter pj as I dont have anything to compare it to and especially for the Bing/Tiger price. I love my Sony TVs, but a $2.3k savings over the Sony is a chunk of change these days!


Some questions that I have:

1) Does this PJ need much calibration?

2) If so, can I do it myself? (I am not any kind of specialist)

3) I will be using a drop down screen and would like it to be 120" or bigger - any suggestions?

4) Any place in the North SF Bay Area that I could see the Viewsonic Pro8100? - I have been waiting for my local BB to get a new bulb for thier Sony for two months!


Thanks for any help. Eric
 
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