[Cal68]

My Mitsubishi RPTV appears to be dying and I would like to replace it with a 1080p projector. I will be sitting approximately 14 feet from the screen in a room that is semi dark. The room is in my basement, and there is an opening at the back of my room to my rear yard. However, most of my TV/movie watching will be done either early in the morning or late at night when the room is completely dark. I also have curtains on the doors leading to the rear yard that block out most of the light even during the day.


What projector would you recommend for me at a budget of $5000-7000? I am guessing that my screen size will be approximately 108 inches. And what type (manufacturer) of screen would you recommend I purchase along with the projector.


I have never owned a projector before, so I am a newbie when it comes to projectors and screens.


Your suggestions will be most appreciated.


Cal68

 

[umr]

I would suggest you carefully consider light control before you go with a front projector. It takes very little light to ruin the picture. I would try and take a look at a few systems with no light and a little ambient light before you purchase one.

 

[RobZ]



Quote:
Originally Posted by umr /forum/post/15512771


I would suggest you carefully consider light control before you go with a front projector. It takes very little light to ruin the picture. I would try and take a look at a few systems with no light and a little ambient light before you purchase one.

Very good advice and absolutely true.



You are probably going to get many recommendations because there are many great projectors available in your price range and well below. You'll likely be blown away by either of the current RS series from JVC (RS10 or RS20). Honestly, you'd probably be amazed at the results you'd get from a previous generation (used of course) 1080p like the Sony VW60, RS1 or RS2, Epson 1080UB, ...... (most of which you can find with "low" hours for nearly 1/3 your budget).

 

[Daniel Hutnicki]

When you say your screen will be 108 inches, do you mean wide or diag? The reason I ask is because it could make a difference on what projector you go with. Like it was mentioned before, you can go with the JVC line, the Sony line and the Epson line. All three make great projectors that will definitely blow your socks off (assuming you wearing some)

 

[Denophile]

jvc or sony lcos pj

as for screens--i have an elitescreens cinetension II--as far as i am concerned best for the money--make sure whatever you get is TENSIONED!! youll regtet it if you dont as the screen can have very visible and annoying waves or contours if you dont. VERY happy with mine[


ATTACH]129189[/ATTACH]--mine is 106 diag.

 

[Cal68]

Hi All


Thanks for the advice you have given me so far. My screen will be 108inches diaganol.


UMR: I know what you mean about light control. It is one of the things that I have been worried about regarding a projector. I am not sure that I can completely darken my home theater during the day, but I can certainly dampen the amount of light that gets into the room.


Are there any specific model numbers of projectors and screens that you would recommend for my needs? If I get some actual numbers, I will check them out on line as well as at a distributor's store.


Thanks again for your help.


Cal68

 

[umr]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Cal68 /forum/post/15513814


Hi All


Thanks for the advice you have given me so far. My screen will be 108inches diaganol.


UMR: I know what you mean about light control. It is one of the things that I have been worried about regarding a projector. I am not sure that I can completely darken my home theater during the day, but I can certainly dampen the amount of light that gets into the room.


Are there any specific model numbers of projectors and screens that you would recommend for my needs? If I get some actual numbers, I will check them out on line as well as at a distributor's store.


Thanks again for your help.


Cal68

Screens and projectors are only a small part of doing this right. I have seen many front projector setups that are very poor for other reasons. You need to spend more effort on this than just picking a screen and projector.


I own a RS20 and use a Carada screen with great results.

 

[gdmaddog]

For beginners in the projector world I'd recommend Epson or Panasonic for ease of set up. If you are going to have help from someone handy with a laser level and some basic carpentry skills you can move up into the world of DLP or LCOS. The latter take some careful planning to position in reference to the screen. LCD projectors usually have a lens shift that can hide a multitude of sins. I have both types in my home. My LCD is brighter than my DLP rig and I use it for outdoor movies and sports at night. My DLP set up is my main theater projector and its calibrated for that purpose. Epson has a turn key system that includes everything you need to get up and running. It would include professional installation. If you choose to go it alone, be patient and do your research. Just don't do too much research or you'll end up like most of us here... suffering from information paralysis

 

[Cal68]



Quote:
Originally Posted by umr /forum/post/15513841


Screens and projectors are only a small part of doing this right. I have seen many front projector setups that are very poor for other reasons. You need to spend more effort on this than just picking a screen and projector.


I own a RS20 and use a Carada screen with great results.

I recognize the logic of what you are saying, but I still need some help and advice. I'm not a newbie to home theater, I've had one for 15 odd years and have gone through a lot of equipment in my time, from S-VHS VCR's to Laserdisc to DVD to BluRay. But all these years, I've always had a RPTV. They've been great for me, but I'd like to explore the possibility of getting a projector.


If it makes any difference, I'm not planning on installing the projector or screen myself. It will be done by a CEDIA certified technician. But I am looking for some projector recommendations so that I can check them out for myself and decide which one suits my needs.


Thanks.


Cal68

 

[RobZ]



Quote:
Originally Posted by gdmaddog /forum/post/15514232


For beginners in the projector world I'd recommend Epson or Panasonic for ease of set up. If you are going to have help from someone handy with a laser level and some basic carpentry skills you can move up into the world of DLP or LCOS. The latter take some careful planning to position in reference to the screen. LCD projectors usually have a lens shift that can hide a multitude of sins. I have both types in my home. My LCD is brighter than my DLP rig and I use it for outdoor movies and sports at night. My DLP set up is my main theater projector and its calibrated for that purpose. Epson has a turn key system that includes everything you need to get up and running. It would include professional installation. If you choose to go it alone, be patient and do your research. Just don't do too much research or you'll end up like most of us here... suffering from information paralysis

I've owned plenty of each (DLP, LCD, LCOS) and while I agree that ease of setup/installation is important, LCD is not any easier to install than LCOS (though LCOS are usually larger and heavier). The JVCs have lateral and vertical shifting, etc. Many DLPs do not have the same lens shifting functions.

 

[umr]



Quote:
Originally Posted by RobZ /forum/post/15519960


I've owned plenty of each (DLP, LCD, LCOS) and while I agree that ease of setup/installation is important, LCD is not any easier to install than LCOS (though LCOS are usually larger and heavier). The JVCs have lateral and vertical shifting, etc. Many DLPs do not have the same lens shifting functions.

Correct.

 

[umr]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Cal68 /forum/post/15519743


I recognize the logic of what you are saying, but I still need some help and advice. I'm not a newbie to home theater, I've had one for 15 odd years and have gone through a lot of equipment in my time, from S-VHS VCR's to Laserdisc to DVD to BluRay. But all these years, I've always had a RPTV. They've been great for me, but I'd like to explore the possibility of getting a projector.


If it makes any difference, I'm not planning on installing the projector or screen myself. It will be done by a CEDIA certified technician. But I am looking for some projector recommendations so that I can check them out for myself and decide which one suits my needs.


Thanks.


Cal68

I would give strong consideration to the RS20 at your price point. It is what I own and what I would recommend at that price. You can look at others if you like. BenQ, Panasonic, Sharp, Sony and Epson also make some good units in your price range you may wish to look at. You will find it very difficult to locate a good setup for every product you may wish to see.


Getting front projection to work well is much more difficult than the other products you have owned.

 

[DVD Freaky]

I am in the same boat as original poster. Have only owned LCD tv's and plasma and moving into a new house soon, and with the prices being very reasonable now...I want to expand into projectors. I am very new to this technology and trying to acquire as much info as I can.


I am so serious about this that I am still searching for a new house and making sure it has a large gameroom area for the projector install. Of all the projector setups I have seen (and I have not seen many), 110" seems to be where you really start to see a difference between a 'really large screen' and something that feels truly cinematic. Of course, I am simply speaking from my own experience and not knocking any setup smaller than 110", but for me...anything less than 110" does not feel like you are truly immersed in the experience. So, the room I choose will have to accomodate this size.


umr, you mentioned in an earlier post that simply choosing the right screen and projector are not the only factors. I am curious what else the factors would be? Lighting is obviously one...space probably another, but what else? If you have the space and minimal lighting, I am curious what else needs to be considered.


The most frustrating thing for me, and one that was mentioned by a previous poster, is that it is very difficult to see many of these different projectors in a setup somewhere. The only pj's I have seen in action are the Sony VPL-VW60, the JVC RS1 and the Mitsubishi HC5000. To my eye, the Mitsu looked best...the Sony was great on Blu-Ray but soft to my eye on normal HD content, and the JVC seemed to have something that looked like the old 'silk-screen effect', or a kind of shimmering on white or bright backgrounds. I am very sensitive to this and hate it when seeing it on cheap rear proj. DLP displays at Best Buy or CC. Of course, the JVC projector was nowhere near as bad, but to my eye, the brighter background still had a little of that annoying shimmering effect that I don't like. Who knows...maybe it's just me...but it's not something I could live with, not for that kind of money. I do realize the JVC has a great reputation, but it's just not for me.


I want to test out the Epson and the Sim2, if possible. I think any of these pj's will look great on Blu-Ray, but I'd like to see how they do with sat or cable HD content and fast motion, particularly sports. I suspect that is where things somewhat get separated.


One question I have though- in movie theaters, you notice there are very low lit lights still on in the theater...it is not 100% dark. So, wouldn't it be natural then, in a home setting, to have some very minimal dim lighting as well? Just curious. The room I choose will probably have very little light...if there's a window, I plan to seal it off.


Anyway, thanks in advance for any advice or feedback. I am salivating at the thought of getting a pj in my future new home...this is something I've wanted for a long time. Cheers.

 

[umr]



Quote:
Originally Posted by DVD Freaky /forum/post/15522559


...I am so serious about this that I am still searching for a new house and making sure it has a large gameroom area for the projector install. Of all the projector setups I have seen (and I have not seen many), 110" seems to be where you really start to see a difference between a 'really large screen' and something that feels truly cinematic. Of course, I am simply speaking from my own experience and not knocking any setup smaller than 110", but for me...anything less than 110" does not feel like you are truly immersed in the experience. So, the room I choose will have to accomodate this size.


...umr, you mentioned in an earlier post that simply choosing the right screen and projector are not the only factors. I am curious what else the factors would be? Lighting is obviously one...space probably another, but what else? If you have the space and minimal lighting, I am curious what else needs to be considered.


...


One question I have though- in movie theaters, you notice there are very low lit lights still on in the theater...it is not 100% dark. So, wouldn't it be natural then, in a home setting, to have some very minimal dim lighting as well? Just curious. The room I choose will probably have very little light...if there's a window, I plan to seal it off.


....

I find the impact of screen size once you are watching a film is totally a function of seat location. When you walk in a room the bigger the screen the cooler the room looks, but that is a different issue. The larger the screen the harder and more expensive it is to have a great image and sound. The further you sit from the speakers the more important room acoustics are to sound quality. The amplifier power requirements for sitting further from the screen increase dramatically and the speaker distortion will increase with it unless you go to more and more expensive gear. The biggest mistakes I see in home theaters are too big a screen, poor heat dissipation, poor room acoustics, poor speaker positioning and poor light management. For example one of the best home theaters I have worked on has a 15' wide 2.40 screen, but to make that work he uses a $40,000 projector and about a $200,000 sound system with very high grade self powered professional monitors. Trying to do big screens with cheap gear does not work very well. This is not to say 110" is a huge screen, but it is not a size that will be easy to light up and the room spacing for it will increase the cost of the audio equipment if you want to do it well.


Other factors to consider for video alone are relative screen size, throw ratio, projector location effect on fan noise level, wall and floor color effect on contrast ratio, screen height, seat location effect on screen artifacts, screen aspect ratio, anamorphic lens limitations, auto/manual zoom, lens shift capability, effect of screen gain on seating positions, target light output from screen when lamp is new and old, flexibility of projector iris/lamp output, acoustically transparent screen or not, effect of transparent screen on image relative to seat location, effect of acoustically transparent screen on light output, equipment light output effect on image, controlling projector light spill, projector location for optimum light output and contrast ratio, projector location effect on seating and possible head hazard, height of seating platform, HDMI cable limitations for projector relative to equipment location, how to condition power to the projector, how many cables to route to the projector, is a video processor required, impact of screen location on speaker positioning, and heat dissipation.


I find any light in the room detracts from the film. This is one of the advantages of a well done home theater. I find myself drawn to any lights in my field of view. Lights will also reduce the on/off contrast and potentially alter the color of scenes.

 

[tlastrange]



Quote:
Originally Posted by DVD Freaky /forum/post/15522559


To my eye, the Mitsu looked best...the Sony was great on Blu-Ray but soft to my eye on normal HD content, and the JVC seemed to have something that looked like the old 'silk-screen effect', or a kind of shimmering on white or bright backgrounds. I am very sensitive to this and hate it when seeing it on cheap rear proj. DLP displays at Best Buy or CC.

"Shimmer" could be a function of the screen material. I just upgraded my Infocus 7205 to a Sony VPL-HW10 and I see a bit of "shimmer" on my first generation Stewart Firehawk. The increased resolution is causing the screen surface (not completely smooth) to become visible. StudioTek 130 G3 screen material may be in my future.

 

[umr]



Quote:
Originally Posted by tlastrange /forum/post/15523544


"Shimmer" could be a function of the screen material. I just upgraded my Infocus 7205 to a Sony VPL-HW10 and I see a bit of "shimmer" on my first generation Stewart Firehawk. The increased resolution is causing the screen surface (not completely smooth) to become visible. StudioTek 130 G3 screen material may be in my future.

That is the probable cause. This is another problem with big screens. Screens with gain can add artifacts to the image. People who want the cleanest image should consider neutral or gray screens and appropriately match the screen size to the projector and seating locations.


Trying to compare projectors is very difficult unless you are in the same room with the same screen that you plan to use those variables can swamp the difference in projectors. A poor room will also look bad for any projector.

 

[Cal68]



Quote:
Originally Posted by umr /forum/post/15521567


I would give strong consideration to the RS20 at your price point. It is what I own and what I would recommend at that price. You can look at others if you like. BenQ, Panasonic, Sharp, Sony and Epson also make some good units in your price range you may wish to look at. You will find it very difficult to locate a good setup for every product you may wish to see.


Getting front projection to work well is much more difficult than the other products you have owned.

Jeff


Thanks for all your helpful comments in response to my posting as well to the posting by DVD Freaky. It is clear that picking the right projector and screen is not a simple task. I'll see if I can work out a deal with my CEDIA certified dealer so that I can try a couple of different units before picking one that works best for me.


I should have mentioned earlier that the projector will most likely be installed above my seating area, so fan noise (or lack thereof) will be an important factor in my decision. How much noise do you experience with the RS20?


Thanks again for your help.


Cal68

 

[umr]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Cal68 /forum/post/15523686


Jeff


Thanks for all your helpful comments in response to my posting as well to the posting by DVD Freaky. It is clear that picking the right projector and screen is not a simple task. I'll see if I can work out a deal with my CEDIA certified dealer so that I can try a couple of different units before picking one that works best for me.


I should have mentioned earlier that the projector will most likely be installed above my seating area, so fan noise (or lack thereof) will be an important factor in my decision. How much noise do you experience with the RS20?


Thanks again for your help.


Cal68

I do not find noise to be a problem in my install, but mine is in a location that minimizes its effect on my seating location.


I would only count on a CEDIA dealer to be able to wire and mount things properly at best. Beyond that my experience with them is not that great. I recently worked on a job for example where his CEDIA installer put a perf screen in and used a different speaker for the center and mounted it poorly instead of doing the same thing as the mains which is one of the primary advantages of a perf. When I pointed out the problems caused by this the owner was pretty upset because what the installer did cost him about $1k more money for the speaker and resulted in lower quality sound.

 

[DVD Freaky]



Quote:
Originally Posted by umr /forum/post/15523264


Other factors to consider for video alone are relative screen size, throw ratio, projector location effect on fan noise level, wall and floor color effect on contrast ratio, screen height, seat location effect on screen artifacts, screen aspect ratio, anamorphic lens limitations, auto/manual zoom, lens shift capability, effect of screen gain on seating positions, target light output from screen when lamp is new and old, flexibility of projector iris/lamp output, acoustically transparent screen or not, effect of transparent screen on image relative to seat location, effect of acoustically transparent screen on light output, equipment light output effect on image, controlling projector light spill, projector location for optimum light output and contrast ratio, projector location effect on seating and possible head hazard, height of seating platform, HDMI cable limitations for projector relative to equipment location, how to condition power to the projector, how many cables to route to the projector, is a video processor required, impact of screen location on speaker positioning, and heat dissipation.

Well, needless to say, I wish you were working on my system.

Thanks for the excellent info. I live in Dallas, and finding it very difficult to find good, knowledgable installers.


When you mention that 110" presents lighting issues, how can you be sure you select a projector that is bright enough for this? Going strictly by Lumens? What are the minimum specs for lighting 110" adequately? How high of a gain screen is too much for this size? Does it depend on the throw distance, as you referred to? The couple of installers I talked to hardly addressed these concerns...they simply said something like, 'we just match up the screen to the particular projector and go from there...it's pretty simple.' They said they would decide the particular screen based on the brands they carry and that I don't have to be involved in the decision.


The problem is, I am not educated enough to tell an installer exactly what I want, when it comes to pairing the equipment together. If I see a pj I like, I have no idea what to consider for a matching screen. I have looked at various sites on the internet, but the info isn't all that understandable and concise. It's like trying to build a house without knowing what kind of foundation you have...it's pretty frustrating. So, any info you have would be most helpful...if even to give me a starting point of where to go. Thanks!

 

[DVD Freaky]

Follow-up question. For a screen size of 110", what is the ideal throw distance for the projector?