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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Just wondering, if I get my hands on a progressive scan PAL DVD player, does that mean I turn off the line doubler in my projector (Mitsubishi XD200)
 

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It is my understanding that if you feed your projector an interlaced signal via the 15 pin component input, the projectors internal scaler does the processing. If you feed in a progressive scan signal it overrides the internal scaler.

I didn't think Pal progressive scan was available?
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Hi Old Salty


Progressive scan PAL is available on the cheap and nasty Sonken DV2600. I beleive its been discontinued, but they still have some. I picked one up before xmas and its perfomance on pal is better than my Toshiba sd9000 and also on my Panasonic RP82 (which I bought a week before the SOnken). I was hoping the RP82 would get rid of the "jaggies" on strong colours, but alas it didn't (as the RP82 can't do PAL progressive)


SO yes I heartily recommend the SOnken here in Australia for PAL progressive. Except though, you must use the VGA output (which it has) as the colours are a bit off (a lot off) with the ordinary progressive outputs.
 

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Hi Obiwan,

That's interesting as I thought Progressive scan if anything would be in the very high end expensive units. I have a separate scaler/ line quadrupler and I feed everything into it including DVD, Xbox & PS2, that way I am able to scale all my inputs to what ever signal I want. 768p

is best as it perfectly scales my image to suit my XGA projector 1024x768.

The scaler only accepts interlaced signals which was a bit hard to take at first as I have a muti region progressive scan DVD player (progressive only in NTSC). However the scaler works on both signals and creates an awesome picture with no jaggies and artifacts, except on really bad source material.

This unit came at a price though, 3k and that was a special deal.

I know the XD200u has DCDI, so perhaps it does as good a job as an external scaler? I don't know as I have' seen one in action. I have the Mitsubishi X80u which is a 1500 lumen LCD, and when it is out of the repair shop it has a great picture with the outboard scaler. Without it, the picture was almost unwatchable.

How are you liking the XD200? I may be upgrading to the XD300 when it arrives. There is a new review on Projector Central which is not as in depth as they usually are, but the unit was considered overall very good. My only concern is the 2x colourwheel and if there are any rainbow effects. Do you have this issue with your unit? How is the projector noise? Are the colours good? Is the Projector finished well? Would you recommend it? I don't mean to digress from your original topic but no one else seems to be around to complain, I hope you don't mind.


OLD SALTY.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Do I like the XD200? Well as you know, its not till you live with it do you find out what tis really like.


I've had it since mid last year I think. Initially I was pissed off with the DLP halo surrounding the outside of the 4x3 area, and then I was pissed off with the 4x3 light spill outside the 1.78 or 2.35 widescreen area. Anyway masking of the screen and Panamorph lens fixed all that. Contrast and blacks were disappointing and I tried various combinations of grey screens, neutral density and FL-D filters. Just this past weekend I made my screen fairly dark grey, and gee that's made me really happy with blacks contrast colours etc now. The only remaining problem is rainbows. I never saw them initially, but now can find them quite easily. I was thinking of upgrading to the XD300 as well, but as the colour wheel speed is no different by the looks, I don't think I'd bother. I think I'll just stay with the XD200 a little longer. Next machine will be more along the lines of the NEC HT1000 I think. Perhaps when there is a 16x9 version of the HT1000, that might make me change.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
I forgot to answer all your questions. Colours are good, noise is fine. But rainbows definitely yes. Other people don't notice it till I point them out to them. The image though is very film like, no screendoor on closeups. When I see projector set ups elsewhere in shops, I always leave thinking well mine's better than that.
 

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G'Day obiwan,


It's interesting to hear from you that the RP82 is not PAL progressive as I thought it was.


(Doesn't it use the genesis/faroudja FLI2200 de-interlacer which is capable of deinterlacing PAL- 625/50 material?)


Does it state in the manual that it does not do PAL progressive or is it from observation?


As I was comtemplating buying this to use with a panasonic AE300 for the progressive output!
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
No, it definitely can't do PAL progressive. I vaguely recall reading in one of the threads in the dvd hardware forum (here in avs) that there is no simple hack to allow it to do PAL progressive.


God if you can find a way to make it do PAL progressive let me know, but as far as I'm aware (and according to the manual) it is NTSC progressive only.
 

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Thanks for the info.


A quick search of google shows nothing much in the way of pal progressive hacks for the rp82.


Looks like having to stick with "cheap and nasty" players until something better is out in the way of PAL progressive.


The other option is to go for a NEC HT1000 (around AUS$7500) which has a faroudja chip inside for DCDi and deinterlacing (I think!)


Will post if I dig up anything on the rp82. It seems such a waste to have the capability on the chip and not use it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Well actually my Mitsubishi xd200 does DCDi as well, but the image is better using the progressive output from the Sonken compared to letting the projector do the DCDi and deinterlacing.


Oh and by the way,the Sonken is cheap, but its actually not that nasty, when I get home (if I remember!) I'll give you the link/s about it here in Australia (which includes a review).
 

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Is the progressive output from the Sonken better then the DCDi from your xd200 because there are less 'jaggies'?


This area has always confused me a little because alot of people rave on about the faroudja products and from your experience the faroudja doesn't stand up to a cheap (but not that nasty :) player with "who knows what" type of deinterlacing technology onboard.


1. Do you think that is because the deinterlacing on the Sonken is done in the digital domain before analog conversion?


2. And is this mainly from film source material (eg. hollywood movies) as opposed to video source (eg. TV based series)?


3. Do you notice any of deinterlacing artifacts on the Sonken such as combing from badly formatted dvds?


The secret's people have a good description of the different types of artifacts that progressive players can have. Scroll down to 1/3 of the page for pics.

http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/volum...ut-1-2003.html


4. obiwan, if you have time, would you be able to compare the 480p output of the Sonken vs rp82 vs 480i with faroudja DCDi/deinterlacing on the xd200 in respect to jaggies and artifacts?


Thanks for you help, its much appreciated and much more informative then most of the salespeople in the larger chain stores who wouldn't know what the difference between composite and component is!
 

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Obiwan,

Thanks for the run down on your projector. Apparently the XD300 has the new 12 degree Dlp chip. I don't know if this will fix the halo you spoke of or the rainbow effect, but it certainly takes care of the contrast ratio at 2000:1, so a grey screen should'nt be necessary. Is'nt it a *****, the more you know about these projectors the harder it is to be satisfied with just sitting down and watching a movie. Sometimes ignorance can be bliss.


OLD SALTY
 
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