[pheare]

Hi all,

Took delivery of two TV1512s today. Even though I had pretty much figured out the best location for my subs when I had my psa PB2000s, I figured I'd run sweeps in all my possible positions just to make sure I got it right the first time. Spoiler alert, I did!

All of the sweeps were run at -20 Master Volume. AVR gain was set to 0. Sub gain was about 11:00 and Room was set to 9:00, Audyssey off.

First up we have sweeps using a single sub in all my positions. I have excluded the extremely bad ones for less clutter.

I ended up going with Pos7 (purple - front right corner of room) and Pos 9 (yellow - rear right corner of room). Ideally you can find two sweeps that complement each other - if one is dipping, find one that is peaking (or is at least flatish). 7 and 9 offset each other reasonable well between ~21hz and 73hz.

Below is 7 and 9 on their own and combined (red)

I then ran Audyssey to get the sub gain tweaked. Audyssey set the avr sub gain to -11.5 for both subs. I had to reduce the sub gain to about 10:00 on both subs.

I then re-ran 7, 9 and 7+9 without Audyssey. Below we have 7 (yellow) and 9 (purple) individually and then combined (redish). And then combined with Audyssey (light green, -11.5 avr gain) and then another audyssey sweep with -6.5 avr gain (dark green).

And now just the Audyssey eq'd sweeps:

I think this looks pretty decent, but I am far from an expert. I'd love to hear what others think.

Also wondering if anyone things there is anything that could be gained with a miniDSP hd?

And, a rough diagram of my room (the front sub is not in the right corner):

 

[Deaf-Forever]

Change you vertical graph range to get a 5dB change on the left side. Your response is being masked by the 10dB jumps. Congrats either way. Im sure they will look great fully tweaked. Im jealous.

 

[pheare]

Change you vertical graph range to get a 5dB change on the left side. Your response is being masked by the 10dB jumps. Congrats either way. Im sure they will look great fully tweaked. Im jealous.

Geez! Those are some ups and downs! What does it look like with both subs and eq'd?

I updated my pics to be 5db increments.

 

[Deaf-Forever]

No kidding. My room/MLP needs 2 sticks of TnT. Im still working it butt looks like I get my mancave back so I will probably be starting over in a week or so.

Why are they dropping off so early You're done by 80Hz if not a little before? You have a crossover set real low?

 

[pheare]

No kidding. My room/MLP needs 2 sticks of TnT. Im still working it butt looks like I get my mancave back so I will probably be starting over in a week or so.

Why are they dropping off so early You're done by 80Hz if not a little before? You have a crossover set real low?

Hmmm. Good eye. Crossover is off on the subs. Pretty sure it is set to 120 on the avr. Will double check tomorrow.

 

[Soulburner]

I ended up going with Pos7 (purple - front right corner of room) and Pos 9 (yellow - rear right corner of room). Ideally you can find two sweeps that complement each other - if one is dipping, find one that is peaking (or is at least flatish).

Looks like you got some really good results.

I find that the best location for subwoofer 2 is whatever gives the best response after sub 1 is in its ideal location and while both subs are playing. So with sub 2, you're only looking at the combined response. I've done them individually and gotten decent measurements, but it never sounded or measured better than optimizing when combined.

 

[Deaf-Forever]

Interesting. I did mine separately like pheare did. Ill have to take a run on #2 while measuring both together just to see the difference.

 

[badtlc]

Looks good. Audyssey works well for you and your room. My room is so bad audyssey can't do much for me.

 

[Soulburner]

Interesting. I did mine separately like pheare did. Ill have to take a run on #2 while measuring both together just to see the difference.

Yeah, it's considered best practice, so give it a try when you get time and if you have the ability to move sub 2 around.

 

[pheare]

Looks like you got some really good results.

I find that the best location for subwoofer 2 is whatever gives the best response after sub 1 is in its ideal location and while both subs are playing. So with sub 2, you're only looking at the combined response. I've done them individually and gotten decent measurements, but it never sounded or measured better than optimizing when combined.

Interesting. I did mine separately like pheare did. Ill have to take a run on #2 while measuring both together just to see the difference.

I actually did what Soulburner suggested.

As per my initial post, I did try all locations with a single sub and I then did look for two complementary sweeps. But, I also put sub 2 in all locations while sub 1 was playing. There were really two contenders, but I preferred the physical location of the second sub on one of them, so that is what I picked - which happened to be the complementary sweep.

I am not sure what is going on at ~80hz or if that sort of drop is within the realm of normal?

I checked some sweeps I did with my pb2000's and there was a similar drop - though one of my Audyssey corrected sweeps is not as drastic.

Double checked and my avr is set to LFE 120hz. Crossover is off on the subs.

Here is the weird thing (I think) on the AVR I tried setting lfe crossover at 80, 120, and 250. In all cases there was no change in the sweeps - virtually identical in the 0 to 130 range.

I don't know if this means something is buggered with my avr? At the very least it seems strange that the crossover at 80 did not cause the sweep to drop at around 80.

Or is there some other setting on the avr I need to also set?

No idea if this is in the realm of normal or not?

 

[pheare]

Looks good. Audyssey works well for you and your room. My room is so bad audyssey can't do much for me.

Yes, thanks. I am happy with the results. Though, as noted above, not sure if the drop after 80 is in the realm of 'normal'.

 

[Swoosh830]

Awesome results!

Did you happen to experiment with the Room Size Control, or did you leave it at 9:00 on both the whole time?

 

[badtlc]

Yes, thanks. I am happy with the results. Though, as noted above, not sure if the drop after 80 is in the realm of 'normal'.

It looks like a crossover is impacting the sweep. Probably from the AVR. You might turn the LFE crossover/LPF up to 250Hz.

 

[pheare]

Awesome results!

Did you happen to experiment with the Room Size Control, or did you leave it at 9:00 on both the whole time?

I played with it a very little bit. I set it to 12:00 once - it seemed to cause it extend a bit more in the sub 20hz range before starting to drop off. It was a very slight difference and given Tom suggested 9ish, that is where we are.

 

[pheare]

It looks like a crossover is impacting the sweep. Probably from the AVR. You might turn the LFE crossover/LPF up to 250Hz.

Hi, see post 10. I tried setting lfe crossover at 80, 120 (audyssey set) and 250. Literally identical results until about 130hz. I'm not sure about LPF - is that a different setting or just another way to reference the LFE crossover?

Here are my sweeps at 80, 120, 250:

 

[David_SG]

Sorry to jump into your thread - played around with some measurements again after getting a longer cable so I could move one of the subs into the back corner. Also realized I was doing things completely wrong the first time (probably still doing things wrong this time but maybe a little less wrong). Keeping one sub in the front left corner and moving other to right rear corner seems to smooth things out a bit. These are with Audyssey turned off and crossovers set at 80 Hz on the AVR. Definitely see some drop off around 80 Hz (as I guess you would expect?) but not as steep?

 

[Lesmor]

I actually did what Soulburner suggested.

As per my initial post, I did try all locations with a single sub and I then did look for two complementary sweeps. But, I also put sub 2 in all locations while sub 1 was playing. There were really two contenders, but I preferred the physical location of the second sub on one of them, so that is what I picked - which happened to be the complementary sweep.

I am not sure what is going on at ~80hz or if that sort of drop is within the realm of normal?

I checked some sweeps I did with my pb2000's and there was a similar drop - though one of my Audyssey corrected sweeps is not as drastic.

Double checked and my avr is set to LFE 120hz. Crossover is off on the subs.

Here is the weird thing (I think) on the AVR I tried setting lfe crossover at 80, 120, and 250. In all cases there was no change in the sweeps - virtually identical in the 0 to 130 range.

I don't know if this means something is buggered with my avr? At the very least it seems strange that the crossover at 80 did not cause the sweep to drop at around 80.

Or is there some other setting on the avr I need to also set?

No idea if this is in the realm of normal or not?

I think you are getting confused somewhere
apologies if this is stating the obvious
first the LPF of LFE should be set at 120Hz and forgotten about
then you concentrate on bass management using the Denon crossover menu usually starting at 80Hz and try and improve any dips by increasing subwoofer distance
both subs should be measured as one
don't use Ch4 on REW for measuring the subs as that is 10db hot and ignores the XO
measure the center speaker + Subs then to measure subs only turn off or disconnect the mains

 

[David_SG]

I think you are getting confused somewhere
apologies if this is stating the obvious
first the LPF of LFE should be set at 120Hz and forgotten about
then you concentrate on bass management using the Denon crossover menu usually starting at 80Hz and try and improve any dips by increasing subwoofer distance
both subs should be measured as one
don't use Ch4 on REW for measuring the subs as that is 10db hot and ignores the XO
measure the center speaker + Subs then to measure subs only turn off or disconnect the mains

Hmmmm. I guess confirms that I was still measuring things wrong - I was using Ch4 for measuring subs. This stuff is complicated. So I guess everybody can disregard my previous measurements.

 

[basshead81]

Results look good. I would Measure the subs and speakers together then see what the crossover region looks like. That is how you listen to the system anyway.

 

[Lesmor]

Hmmmm. I guess confirms that I was still measuring things wrong - I was using Ch4 for measuring subs. This stuff is complicated. So I guess everybody can disregard my previous measurements.

Ch 4 seems like the obvious choice but it is the LFE channel which is 10db Hot and ignores bass management so don't use it measuring bass management XO