[Mr. Fuzz]

After having Onkyo receivers and both not lasting longer than 3 years (second one died within 2 years under warranty, but the warranty fix has not fixed the problem - HDMI card issues); I am looking for a quality receiver that has a minimum of 130 watts per channel with 7.1 channel capabilities. The last two Onkyo rigs were part of the HTIB receivers and last was THX certified and worked awesome until the HDMI handshake issues. The rest of the receiver (both of them) still work fine just won't work with HDMI.


So, where do I start?


Minimum Requirements:


7.1 channel

130 watts/channel

HDMI (preferably 4 or 5 in and 1 out)

Optical in/out (1/1)

Does not need to network.


Add'l requirement: THX certified if possible.


To be thorough, it will be in a well ventilated cabinet with a 360mm case fan pulling air from the receiver itself.


Looking at Onkyo 808 but gun-shy about it not lasting only 2 or 3 years.


Thanks in advance.

 

[Blacklac]

Your going to have to spend a lot more money to get a genuine 130x7. Ratings are always inflated. I think most recievers in this price range actually do like 30-50x7.


Maybe a Pioneer 1120 though? Ratings aside. It is THX.

 

[MichaelJHuman]

Emotiva UPA-7 is a good amp if you want something closer to 125x7 Watts (and even it can't do that continuously, IMO, in spite of what they say - it seems to have been tested with a sweep.)


Say your budget allowed for it, you could go with something like the Yamaha RX-V667 and add the Emotiva UPA-7.

 

[Mr. Fuzz]

Sadly my cheapness is being outweighed by quality and longevity issues for a receiver.


I would like to stay under $1,000.00 but realistically for quality and watts/channel...most likely it is going to be over that.


Maybe an amp and receiver combo to achieve that like MJH says. Hmmm. Haven't really thought of that...should have.


Pioneer...is there a rampant issue with HDMI issues similar to the Onkyo? Off to look.


Thanks. Anyone else with a suggestion or recommendation?

 

[MichaelJHuman]

Not to belabor the point much, but it seems like the midrange is the best bang for the buck.


Somewhere around $600 MSRP to $1000 or so, you get some receivers with decent power supplies.


Take the Yamaha RX-A1000. 32.4 pounds weight. Probably a good power supply. Can be had for under 1k. The A800 is not far behind at 30 pounds and can probably be had for a pretty good price with a sale price.


The A700 drops to 23 pounds. Not a huge difference, but if you are looking for a receiver with a decent power supply, these are the sort of things I would think about. I would maybe push for the A800 and call it a day, if it had the features I wanted. Similar sort of reasoning could be applied to other brands (I know Yamaha best, so I use them as an example.)

 

[Mr. Fuzz]

I am a Pioneer receiver virgin.


After looking at the specs the VSX-1120-K and Elite VSX-33.


Aside from a couple of minor things they appear to be identical. What makes the 33 "Elite"?


Both have an MSRP of $1k or below.


Same question for Yamaha:

RX vs. Aventage.

 

[MichaelJHuman]

It's Elite because they feel the need to have two lines. One is for sale at audio/video specialty dealers. The other is for sale at outfits like Best Buy. There may be some overlap, I have not looked, but the Elite line would definitely contain their most expensive models.


Yamaha has a similar concept with their Aventage line (and to some extent their RX-V line vs their HTR line, but those overlap a lot.)


Onkyo has a high end line, Integra.


Think Lexus vs Honda

In short, marketing I believe

As some people view Pioneer as low end, and seem to think Elite=good Pioneer, maybe it makes sense

 

[palehorse]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Fuzz /forum/post/0


I am a Pioneer receiver virgin.


After looking at the specs the VSX-1120-K and Elite VSX-33.


Aside from a couple of minor things they appear to be identical. What makes the 33 "Elite"?


Both have an MSRP of $1k or below.

The 33 is actually the first Elite in the line with an upgraded chassis. It also has a 12v trigger, yellow-text LCD, extended warranty, and more wpc.


I'd pick the 1120+UPA7 combo... That's what I'm running, and it's phenomenal.

 

[MichaelJHuman]

Thanks for mentioning the better warranty. I did not know for sure if Elite had that.


Really, seems like Yamaha, Pioneer, Denon, Marantz and HK all make good receivers. Not sure about Sony. Onkyo has excellent value, but I question their quality a bit. I question whether smaller market brands can really keep up anymore with the fast pace we have seen in feature creep as well. That has not stopped Anthem for releasing an interesting looking lineup

 

[Mr. Fuzz]

Holy Carp!!! The Emotiva UPA-7 is a beast!! Heck, I could downgrade the receiver itself and rely on that monster for sound.


So which receiver has the best quality guts especially for HDMI?


I can't just assume fancy names like Aventage and Elite have better guts.


The Onkyo did not fail in the sound department or any of the other features...just the darned HDMI cards/boards, but it has done it twice.

 

[MichaelJHuman]

Denon does not seem to get many complaints about HDMI.

 

[Mr. Fuzz]

Does Denon have a Lexus version?

OK. Definitely going with the Emotive UPA-7.


Next:


Denon AVR2311CI

or

Yamaha RXA-1000 or RX-V867

or

Pioneer VSX33 or 1120K


Hmmm.


BTW, thanks for the help.

 

[ap1]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Fuzz /forum/post/19559388


Does Denon have a Lexus version?

OK. Definitely going with the Emotive UPA-7.


Next:


Denon AVR2311CI

or

Yamaha RXA-1000 or RX-V867

or

Pioneer VSX33 or 1120K


Hmmm.


BTW, thanks for the help.

If you need good sound go up to Denon 3311. It can be found for as low as $800.

 

[a/v HD fan]



Quote:
Originally Posted by MichaelJHuman /forum/post/19559254


Think Lexus vs Honda

I think you meant Lexus vs Toyota (or Acura vs Honda).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Fuzz /forum/post/19559388


Does Denon have a Lexus version?

No, not really. Denon's AVR lineup goes up to flagship receivers that MSRP for multi-thousands of dollars, all still under the Denon nameplate. Denon and Marantz are owned by the same company, D&M Holdings, but it's not as apples-to-apples like Onkyo/Integra for low/high end.


If you're going with the Emotiva 7-ch amp, you really only need a receiver with the functionality you desire (# of HDMI ports, room correction EQ, etc.) but you must make sure you choose one with speaker RCA preouts - not all lower-end receivers have 'em.


A compromise worth considering is to get a solid upper mid-level receiver (Denon's xx10 line can be had for serious discounts, if you don't need 3D and HDMI 1.4) and couple it with Emotiva's XPA-3 amp for your front 3 speakers, which typically demand the most wattage. Use the receiver's binding posts for your surrounds, which typically don't strain your receiver too much (especially once the front soundstage's demands have been freed up).

 

[MichaelJHuman]

Yes, sorry, I messed up my car brands

I have a headache. Might be getting sick. Dog ate my homework..

 

[superdave592]

Plus 1 for the xpa-3 and and a better featured receiver and let the receivers amp cruise on the remaining channels. I have a xpa-3 on order and then make the choice on a 1120 3311 a2000 and on and on.

 

[thebard]



Quote:
Originally Posted by a/v HD fan /forum/post/19559603


I think you meant Lexus vs Toyota (or Acura vs Honda).

Definitely Acura - hence the "Integra" line!

 

[Mr. Fuzz]



Quote:
Originally Posted by a/v HD fan /forum/post/19559603


I think you meant Lexus vs Toyota (or Acura vs Honda).

No, not really. Denon's AVR lineup goes up to flagship receivers that MSRP for multi-thousands of dollars, all still under the Denon nameplate. Denon and Marantz are owned by the same company, D&M Holdings, but it's not as apples-to-apples like Onkyo/Integra for low/high end.


If you're going with the Emotiva 7-ch amp, you really only need a receiver with the functionality you desire (# of HDMI ports, room correction EQ, etc.) but you must make sure you choose one with speaker RCA preouts - not all lower-end receivers have 'em.


A compromise worth considering is to get a solid upper mid-level receiver (Denon's xx10 line can be had for serious discounts, if you don't need 3D and HDMI 1.4) and couple it with Emotiva's XPA-3 amp for your front 3 speakers, which typically demand the most wattage. Use the receiver's binding posts for your surrounds, which typically don't strain your receiver too much (especially once the front soundstage's demands have been freed up).

I never thought of the rca plug thing. Currently, everything is banana-plug and simple as pie as it goes directly to the receiver. It would be cheaper to do the XPA-3 setup like you described. Now, off to check for the RCA compatibility for the front 3 channels.


Hold on...doesn't the Emotiva UPA-7 have the banana-plug capability across the bottom? It appears to have both RCA and banana compatible connections.

 

[jdsmoothie]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Fuzz /forum/post/19559388


OK. Definitely going with the Emotive UPA-7.


Next:


Denon AVR2311CI

You'll need to upgrade to the 3311CI (HDMI 1.4) or 3310CI (HDMI 1.3) as the USA 2311CI has no pre-outs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Fuzz /forum/post/19560263


Hold on...doesn't the Emotiva UPA-7 have the banana-plug capability across the bottom? It appears to have both RCA and banana compatible connections.

You would connect the pre-outs from the AVR, via RCA, to the RCA inputs on the XPA-3 (or UPA-7) and then connect the speakers via banana plugs to the XPA-3 (UPA-7). As already mentioned, the XPA-3 would likely be the better option.

 

[a/v HD fan]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Fuzz /forum/post/19560263


I never thought of the rca plug thing. Currently, everything is banana-plug and simple as pie as it goes directly to the receiver. It would be cheaper to do the XPA-3 setup like you described. Now, off to check for the RCA compatibility for the front 3 channels.


Hold on...doesn't the Emotiva UPA-7 have the banana-plug capability across the bottom? It appears to have both RCA and banana compatible connections.

Apologies if I'm mistaken, but I'm not sure you are grasping how this all gets setup and connected.


If you only use a receiver (i.e. it is your pre/pro and your amp), it goes:


receiver amp out using speaker-cable via your "banana compatible connections" to your speaker inputs. This method it sounds like you're used to.


If you add an amp in the mix for certain channels, those channels are wired as follows:


receiver pre-out using RCA (or XLR, but likely not in this case) cable to amp channel input, then amp out w/ speaker-cable to your speaker inputs.


People who, before purchase, are planning on using a receiver solely as a pre-pro (and consequently don't care about the specs of the receiver's amp section) just need to make sure that the receiver has the appropriate pre-out connections allowing for external amp usage - not every low end receiver has them. That's all I was trying to convey.