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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I am in the early stages of gut renovating a rowhouse, and my wife has insisted we go in wall for the main speakers in our TV room. Probably Revel 893 or GE Invisa SPS for the LR and a freestanding center channel. Our technology consultant has suggested that we also go with an in wall sub – the Paradigm RVC-12SQ. I’m still open to that idea, but I think there may be other/better options, especially for the price (about $1700).

Although I’m strictly forbidden by the wife from having a sub out in the middle of the room, we will have custom built in cabinets on both the front (18-20” in depth) and back (15” depth) wall. Seems like I should be able to construct a cubby hole(s) in the built ins for at least one maybe two subs and cover the opening(s) with acoustic cloth, which should pass the WAF test. The sub(s) could sit on top of an isolation pad on the floor (not attached to the actual built it, to avoid unnecessary vibration). I’ve marked possible sub locations with a red X in the room setup attachment.

We aren’t looking to wake the neighbors (and we will have them on each side and a tenant’s bedroom immediately below, so we’ll be actively taking measures to soundproof the room as much as possible) – I care as much or more about music than action movies anyway.

A few questions:

  1. Will a sub perform successfully in the kind of environment I’m imagining – surrounded on 5 sides and with the front flush with the front of the built ins? I assume that for this kind of application I want sealed and front firing subs, correct? Do I want the cubby hole to be as fitted as possible or will it do better with some space to the sides and back?
  2. Should I opt for two subs for this space or will a single sub do the trick? My room is 15’ x 12.5’ x 10’ ceilings, but it is an open floor plan that is adjacent to the kitchen. Because my placement is pretty much limited to the locations marked, my thought is that having two subs might compensate for deficiencies that may be caused by the fixed locations.
  3. 10”or 12”? Based on the cabinet depth that I’m working with on the front wall, it seems like I could probably fit 12” subs there. Something like the SVS SB-2000. That wouldn’t leave very much breathing room at the back of the sub though. I guess that gets back to question #1.

Other than finding a different/better wife who would let me position the subs optimally in a visible location in the room, what would you do in my situation?
 

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Check this link, then design your cabinets to allow for more than one possible placement for each sub. Maybe have modular pieces on the "ground floor" so they can swap positions, to allow for options in sub placement should your first choice not have the results you desire.

https://www.aperionaudio.com/blogs/aperion-audio-blog/dual-subwoofer-placement-for-your-home

In addition, you'll want sealed or front ported subs, so no energy is focused into the cabinet area. Lastly, be sure the sub amps have a means to draw in cool air (bottom) and exhaust hot air (top). Same holds true for your equipment rack. Heat is the enemy.

Also, soundproofing is useless if you have in-wall speakers without back boxes. Sound travels into the wall cavity at the same volume as it travels into the room without a back box.
 

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I am in the early stages of gut renovating a rowhouse, and my wife has insisted we go in wall for the main speakers in our TV room. Probably Revel 893 or GE Invisa SPS for the LR and a freestanding center channel. Our technology consultant has suggested that we also go with an in wall sub – the Paradigm RVC-12SQ. I’m still open to that idea, but I think there may be other/better options, especially for the price (about $1700).

Although I’m strictly forbidden by the wife from having a sub out in the middle of the room, we will have custom built in cabinets on both the front (18-20” in depth) and back (15” depth) wall. Seems like I should be able to construct a cubby hole(s) in the built ins for at least one maybe two subs and cover the opening(s) with acoustic cloth, which should pass the WAF test. The sub(s) could sit on top of an isolation pad on the floor (not attached to the actual built it, to avoid unnecessary vibration). I’ve marked possible sub locations with a red X in the room setup attachment.

We aren’t looking to wake the neighbors (and we will have them on each side and a tenant’s bedroom immediately below, so we’ll be actively taking measures to soundproof the room as much as possible) – I care as much or more about music than action movies anyway.

A few questions:

  1. Will a sub perform successfully in the kind of environment I’m imagining – surrounded on 5 sides and with the front flush with the front of the built ins? I assume that for this kind of application I want sealed and front firing subs, correct? Do I want the cubby hole to be as fitted as possible or will it do better with some space to the sides and back?
  2. Should I opt for two subs for this space or will a single sub do the trick? My room is 15’ x 12.5’ x 10’ ceilings, but it is an open floor plan that is adjacent to the kitchen. Because my placement is pretty much limited to the locations marked, my thought is that having two subs might compensate for deficiencies that may be caused by the fixed locations.
  3. 10”or 12”? Based on the cabinet depth that I’m working with on the front wall, it seems like I could probably fit 12” subs there. Something like the SVS SB-2000. That wouldn’t leave very much breathing room at the back of the sub though. I guess that gets back to question #1.
Other than finding a different/better wife who would let me position the subs optimally in a visible location in the room, what would you do in my situation?

The speakers you're considering appear to be fairly midbass capable, I would go to 12" subs to make it worthwhile. Duals in each corner would give you the best chance of better response and more even output across the couch area. Since you have shared walls with neighbors I'd go sealed. As mentioned, make sure there's sufficient room for ventilation. Being in a cabinet with the driver almost even with the opening should work OK acoustically.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Thanks for the replies!

Check this link, then design your cabinets to allow for more than one possible placement for each sub. Maybe have modular pieces on the "ground floor" so they can swap positions, to allow for options in sub placement should your first choice not have the results you desire.
This is a shared family space and the design of the cabinets will be custom and planned way in advance -- no way the wife allows me to have modular cabinets to experiment, unfortunately. I pretty much need to commit to locations and hope they sound ok.

RayGuy said:
Lastly, be sure the sub amps have a means to draw in cool air (bottom) and exhaust hot air (top). Same holds true for your equipment rack. Heat is the enemy.
dpc716 said:
As mentioned, make sure there's sufficient room for ventilation.
So, how much ventilation is needed? Let's assume an 18" built in depth....would a 15" deep sub be ok? How much space around the sides and top? Right now I'm looking at the following subs:
  • Seaton JS-12 -- 14" deep (with grill)
  • SVS SB-3000 -- 15.7" deep (without grill)
  • Rythmik L12 -- 15.5" deep (with grill)

If that doesn't leave enough breathing room, I may need to bump down to dual 10" or make my cabinet 20" deep....
 

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Thanks for the replies!



This is a shared family space and the design of the cabinets will be custom and planned way in advance -- no way the wife allows me to have modular cabinets to experiment, unfortunately. I pretty much need to commit to locations and hope they sound ok.





So, how much ventilation is needed? Let's assume an 18" built in depth....would a 15" deep sub be ok? How much space around the sides and top? Right now I'm looking at the following subs:
  • Seaton JS-12 -- 14" deep (with grill)
  • SVS SB-3000 -- 15.7" deep (without grill)
  • Rythmik L12 -- 15.5" deep (with grill)

If that doesn't leave enough breathing room, I may need to bump down to dual 10" or make my cabinet 20" deep....
I wouldn't rely on "passive" ventilation. Move some air with fans ...
 

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Thanks for the replies!


This is a shared family space and the design of the cabinets will be custom and planned way in advance -- no way the wife allows me to have modular cabinets to experiment, unfortunately. I pretty much need to commit to locations and hope they sound ok.



So, how much ventilation is needed? Let's assume an 18" built in depth....would a 15" deep sub be ok? How much space around the sides and top? Right now I'm looking at the following subs:
  • Seaton JS-12 -- 14" deep (with grill)
  • SVS SB-3000 -- 15.7" deep (without grill)
  • Rythmik L12 -- 15.5" deep (with grill)
If that doesn't leave enough breathing room, I may need to bump down to dual 10" or make my cabinet 20" deep....

Behind the subs you will need about 3 inches or so not just for ventilation but for clearance for the power cords/rca cables, etc. I would think 3 inches above would be sufficient, you should check with the sub manufacturer. Sides probably don't matter as much.
 

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Behind the subs you will need about 3 inches or so not just for ventilation but for clearance for the power cords/rca cables, etc. I would think 3 inches above would be sufficient, you should check with the sub manufacturer. Sides probably don't matter as much.
Good call. We always advise a few inches clearance in the back for the sub cable, the power cord and some ventilation space.

Our Class D amps run quite cool - so it's usually not an issue, even when housed in an entertainment center like this. Typically the back of the entertainment center will have some holes in it for the power cord and sub cable - so adding a few more will help with some passive air changes.

Removing the grille will also save some depth for the subwoofer, but if the OP is looking at something like an SB-2000 - I would design for 18" of cabinet depth. That will comfortably accommodate the cabinet without the grille and leave a few inches in the back for power cord, sub cable, control access and ventilation.
 
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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
dpc716 said:
Behind the subs you will need about 3 inches or so not just for ventilation but for clearance for the power cords/rca cables, etc. I would think 3 inches above would be sufficient, you should check with the sub manufacturer. Sides probably don't matter as much.
Ed Mullen said:
Good call. We always advise a few inches clearance in the back for the sub cable, the power cord and some ventilation space.

Our Class D amps run quite cool - so it's usually not an issue, even when housed in an entertainment center like this. Typically the back of the entertainment center will have some holes in it for the power cord and sub cable - so adding a few more will help with some passive air changes.

Removing the grille will also save some depth for the subwoofer, but if the OP is looking at something like an SB-2000 - I would design for 18" of cabinet depth. That will comfortably accommodate the cabinet without the grille and leave a few inches in the back for power cord, sub cable, control access and ventilation.
Thanks gentlemen, this is extraordinarily helpful! I think I could definitely squeeze two 12" into the front wall of the media room, but I'm worried it might not do too much given the open floor plan. It's approximately 10,000 cubic feet. Now wondering if near field behind the couch might be a better bet. Something like the "couch kicker" that @Raylon built DIY.
 
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