[Mash]

Reading this forum and trying to find a projector I came across the rainbow issue with DLP. As a newbie and never seeing a DLP before this was a major concern for me. If you read the forum, it really seems like many many people have problems with it. I think this is due to the fact that if you don't have a problem with them, you don't post about that so it goes unnoticed.


I finally saw an NEC 260 today and no rainbows for me, my wife or the dealer. This made me think about the problem quite a bit.


1) If you put 100 people in a room who have never viewed a DLP projector and don't even know what a rainbow is, how many do you think would report seeing a rainbow type artifact when questioned afterward?


My prediction- None- or 1 or 2 might say, hmm yea I thought for one millisecond I saw a spotch of red on a white background once.


2) How many people who report seeing rainbows, actually just see them for a split second, maybe during a certain scene or two in a movie or during only a couple of SPECIFIC movies, not all the time? Is that a good reason to downgrade to a lesser rainbow free projector? Would you rather see a poorer picture all of the time? Or a great picture with maybe an occational glitch?


My conclusion- That wouldn't really bother me at all.


3) How many people who see rainbows consider themselves projector profectionists? They look for, make themselves see any minor, tiny abnormality in any projector that most newbies would not notice unless shown?


conclusion - many people who see rainbows will fall here.

I'm not there-----YET, but give me a couple years.


4) Now what is the percentage of people who still see rainbows and do not fit in above- True rainbow sensitives


prediction Very low percentage of total poplulation- 2%


Okay, I might be completely off base but go ahead a post a response tearing my conclusions apart if you like. This is all from a paranoid newbie perspective.

 

[aviman33]

Mash,


I was in your shoes a a little over a year ago with the DLP/rainbow issue. After a year with my LT150 (650 hours) I still love it. I do see a very bief rainbow every now and then, but it's not very distracting. Actually rainbows are most noticable during end credits when you have white scrolling text on a black background. Another example would be a candle flame in a very dark room while panning the camera. Its basically a couple millisecond flash of color on the edge of a white object. Personnally, I believe most rainbow dissidents fall in catagory 3.


Jon


p.s. Now get ready for the headache, eyestrain and nausea warnings.

 

[richardg]

Rainbows for 95-99% of people= no big deal at all. Rainbows for those affected = huge deal.

 

[audible]

Quote:

Originally posted by richardg Rainbows for 95-99% of people= no big deal at all. Rainbows for those affected = huge deal.

I concur entirely. I'm not susceptible but was taught how to see them. A word of advise - don't learn this trick, just sit back and enjoy.


As I posted in another thread, there are people that look for fault but this isn't as bad as on other bulletin boards, you should try the one for digital photography, wow do these guys ever look for fault. "Gee, if you blow the image up to 30"x40" and look in the bottom left hand corner (cover your right eye and slightly defocus the other while standing on your head) you'll see a blue pixel that is two shade off, bummer, this camera goes to the bottom of my list!"


It's like anything, perfection costs big time and even then perfection is an illusion, it's all in the eyes of the beholder. Just look for the best bang for the buck and, as said before, sit back and enjoy.

 

[anthonyc]

"I concur entirely. I'm not susceptible but was taught how to see them. A word of advise - don't learn this trick, just sit back and enjoy"


I have already learned this lesson. We have to remember that some of the enthusiasts here are very picky. No problem with that. I feel sometimes being picky helps other people not settle for just any kind of performance. However, for the undecided or for people that have hard time making decisions this can cause problems, especially when thousands of dollars are involved. Take my advice, If you are new to projectors and stick to the mainstream projectors discussed in this forum you will not be dissapointed by probably all of them! Rainbows, screendoor, size, color, color wheel, lumens, etc.

Just find something in your budget that are in the main models here in this forum and you really won't be dissapointed. Sometimes just taking the plunge and ignoring alll the little specifics and discussions is the thing to do. I don't regret my purchase of my x1 and I didn't regret my purchase of the ae100. So there!

 

[Kevin Korom]

The thing that worries me about DLP isn't the potential rainbows, but the headaches & eyestrain. That seems to be more of an issue than artifacts, to me. It sure seems that a lot of people have reported this problem, without needing to be told about what to look for, etc.


Even if I personally weren't affected by it, what if friends/family came over to watch & were sickened by your theater? Talk about an ego-crushing experience

 

[Defiler]

Unfortunately, I saw them before I knew what they were.

I can never own a projector that produces rainbows. *shudder*

 

[meva]

I had 4 demo's of dlp projectors prior to buying one, Sim2 Ht200 and HT250, Davis CinemaOne and a Runco whose model no I don't recall.I saw rainbows briefly on the Runco but didn't think they would be an issue for me with this technology.

Then I bought an NEC HT1000. At 1st I saw occasional rainbows which didn't bother me. Then I watched The Terminator ( admittedly Pal which worsens things ), I saw rainbows all the time and after about 30 minutes had a blinding headache.

In some ways it broke my heart to send the Ht1000 back, aside from the rainbows ( and the Pal tearing which has been fixed) the picture was beautiful.

I hate the fact that I suffer from rainbowitis because dlp gives fantastic pictures. But until 3 chippers are cheap enough or the Archimedes wheel gets rid of colour wheel seperation artefacts, dlp is a non starter for me.

 

[dHagger]

Two weeks ago, I was watching a few projectors at an event in a local shop (Stockholm, Sweden). My only previous experience with a DLP was an Infocus 110 about 8 month earlier, which I clearly could see 'rainbows' from.


In the first room they had a projector that showed TERRIBLE rainbows! I felt uncomfortable just beeing in that room! And no, I did NOT look for the rainbows - it was impossible to avoid them! I quickly went to another room and watched an (at that time) unknown projector for a while. Did not see any rainbows so I thought it was a LCD. However, I noticed that SOMETHING was wrong, but could not figure out WHAT. After a couple of minutes (less than five) I started to get a headache. It was an Infocus DLP (I think Screenplay 7200, but not sure) I had been watching...


Watched the Garbo Matchline (LCD) for a couple of minutes and felt the headache disappear.


On to what I first thougt was a VERY good LCD, but later learned that it was a NEC HT1000 (DLP)! I could not see any rainbows at all! No headace or eyestrain, even after 10-15 minutes!


There were a few other DLP's too, but I avoided them because the rainbows were noticeable (not visible). Even without looking for the rainbows, I got a headache in less than a minute!


What I'm trying to say, is that you don't have to see the rainbows to be bothered by them...


And the first projector? I heard it was an Optoma H50...

 

[joerocker]

I'm in that small percentage who seems to be bothered by rainbows. I've watched demos where there were more rainbows than picture! It was Jurassic Park III. I couldn't believe it! It was like an acid trip or something! I too couldn't watch it for more than a few minutes between the colors and headace from the strobing. BTW, I viewed the Infocus X1 and it too had rainbows, not bad, but they were there. I need a 5X or better color wheel to stop them.

 

[sunshine]

i am too very curious about the rainbow effect. i am considering the x1 (versus z1) and my biggest concern is the rainbow (if not the headache). so i went to a local store and they have a Toshiba TLP-MT7U which is an LCD and an Optoma H55 for DLP.


i watched the Toshiba for a while, the picture was smooth and sharp. then i went to the Optoma to look for the rainbow you guys talking about. i didn't see any... even when i paid close attention to the bright/white objects with black background. however, i got this funny feeling somehow... might be a headache or not.. i am not sure.. both projectors are very good in term of picture quality but somehow i am more comfortable looking to the toshiba.

just my 2 cents,


luki

 

[Bob Sorel]

Quote:

however, i got this funny feeling somehow... might be a headache or not.. i am not sure..

That's called a psychosomatic reaction. It's kind of like eating a prepared dish that you think is very tasty until the chef reveals that it was made with alligator meat. All of a sudden your stomache starts to feel uneasy. In this case, the chef told you ahead of time that it was made with alligator meat, but you just wanted to try it anyway.

 

[rlindo]

Exactly.


Maybe to most people it won't be an issue but to those who do see them, it is an issue. Just because the majority is one way does not mean everyone has to be the same. I say "awesome" to the people who don't see rainbows or to those that do but don't care. I have seen them and it'd drive me nuts living with that problem.


So to the original poster, it is not an overrated concern to me and my fellow rainbow haters.

 

[Gregg Brent]

Quote:

Originally posted by Kevin Korom Even if I personally weren't affected by it, what if friends/family came over to watch & were sickened by your theater? Talk about an ego-crushing experience

I watched a DLP in a showroom and couldn't see rainbows even while trying to (waving hand ,etc). Was set on DLP for the contrast and blacks, but now I am concerned that if I have a movie night some might get headaches or something. Has anyone had this experience where company comes to watch a movie and gets sick?? ugh.. maybe the z1 over the x1

 

[Gregg Brent]

Quote:

Originally posted by Kevin Korom Even if I personally weren't affected by it, what if friends/family came over to watch & were sickened by your theater? Talk about an ego-crushing experience

I watched a DLP in a showroom and couldn't see rainbows even while trying to (waving hand ,etc). Was set on DLP for the contrast and blacks, but now I am concerned that if I have a movie night some might get headaches or something. Has anyone had this experience where company comes to watch a movie and gets sick?? ugh.. maybe the z1 over the x1

 

[Glenn Refling]

Greg,


I don't want to try and convince you about what you should by, an open mind is probably best, but perhaps as Carl Sagan said, "Not so open your brain falls out."


Before choosing DLP I looked at many different technologies. I read all the posts, some of the most comforting were the experiences reported of LT150 owners with 1000+ hours on their machines and never have had ANY visitors complain of eye strain or headaches. So far I have had around 12 people watching my machine. No problems yet, everyone has enjoyed the projector and the movies.

 

[aviman33]

Greg,


I have over 600 hrs on my LT150 and no visitor complaints. It all comes down to you, if your a hair shirted type of guy wrt rainbows, stay away from DLP.


Jon

 

[jsanneblad]

Just wanted to add another factor to this:


Subtitles


In Europe we use subtitles on all our movies. White text on black background. The companies responsible for subtitles seem to like placing them in the border below the 2.35:1 picture...


I think ALL DLP owners can safely say that they see rainbows on the end titles (white text on black backround). I see them all the time in the subtitles on all DLPs (even the HT1000).. Watching movies without subtitles it's ok, but for most europeans this is actually the biggest dealbreaker of all for DLP. I for one can never use DLP since I (and all my friends) are used to subtitles... :-/


Just my 2c...