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Hello All,


Newbie here but I have been lurking for sometime with this forum.


I have a question about Rainbows people see with DLP TVs. Can any explain to me why some people see them and others don't? How come makers of these type of sets don't adress this problem if people have problems with rainbows.


I myself have never saw a rainbow with DLP's TV but from I read here I might see rainbows.


I saw the Samsung 5085 other day at BB while waiting for my wife and I was watching this set for like over 30 minutes and did not see one rainbow plus this set look the best DLP in the store.


DLP's TVs kind of scare me a little due to possible seeing rainbows.


Thanks
 

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Some rainbows happen for everyone, usually on dark backgrounds. Then there are rainbows that are on command type, where you blink your eyes and turn your head or just by turning your head. You'll see a green/yellow type arch in your peripheral vision. Then there's the headaches people get. I get motion sick, see rainbows and get headaches. My wife is not motion sick susceptible, does not see rainbows but does get headaches after viewing the DLPs. So it's a hard card for my to hold. Even if I didn't see rainbows, what if my little girls does, or my folks, or my friends.


As for why it still happens? Why change something that makes money is the thinking. Though I wonder why so many companies invest in a technology that not everyone can enjoy. It's like designing a new car that only right handed people can drive. It's a shame because DLPs do have nice pictures.
 

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I spent several months researching the various rear projection TV's technologies to replace my old 46 inch RP-CRT. I finally decided on the Mits 62725 DLP which I've had for about 3 weeks now. I love the PQ and features of this TV...EXCEPT I now see rainbows and once you start seeing them you cant seem to stop. It puts a real damper on your viewing pleasure. I never used to see the rainbows when ever I was in the stores testing out the TV's and now I do. They were very apparent to me during the baseball playoff series in HD. I'm now debating about keeping this TV or returning it for one of the new Sony LCD-RPTV.
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by Mrmark68
Hello All,


Newbie here but I have been lurking for sometime with this forum.


I have a question about Rainbows people see with DLP TVs. Can any explain to me why some people see them and others don't? How come makers of these type of sets don't adress this problem if people have problems with rainbows.


I myself have never saw a rainbow with DLP's TV but from I read here I might see rainbows.


I saw the Samsung 5085 other day at BB while waiting for my wife and I was watching this set for like over 30 minutes and did not see one rainbow plus this set look the best DLP in the store.


DLP's TVs kind of scare me a little due to possible seeing rainbows.


Thanks
I've been looking at DLPs in stores for a year now, and finally saw the "dreaded" rainbows. I had to force myself to cause my eyes to dart back-and-forth on the screen, or shake my head violently when at close range to the screen. I thought to myself "this is bad - I'm going to see these things every time I look at a DLP set". Not so. The next time at a different store with a different light level and program source, no rainbows no matter what I did.

So for me, it's no big deal. I compare it to the screen door effect with LCDs. To see it, you have to be too close for normal viewing. In other words, you have to go out of your way to see them at all. At least I do.

Others will, no doubt, give you conflicting opinions, so you'll have to judge for yourself. From what I've seen on this and other forums, out of 100 people who've bought DLP TVs, 80 were thrilled to death, 10 were happy but with some complaints, and the other 10 were disgusted and sent their sets back. Good luck with whatever type of display you decide on.
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by Reyfam
I spent several months researching the various rear projection TV's technologies to replace my old 46 inch RP-CRT. I finally decided on the Mits 62725 DLP which I've had for about 3 weeks now. I love the PQ and features of this TV...EXCEPT I now see rainbows and once you start seeing them you cant seem to stop. It puts a real damper on your viewing pleasure. I never used to see the rainbows when ever I was in the stores testing out the TV's and now I do. They were very apparent to me during the baseball playoff series in HD. I'm now debating about keeping this TV or returning it for one of the new Sony LCD-RPTV.
Return it while you still can...
 

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carl033 - Most people tend to see them more when the set is in a lower light situation, this is why people don't see them in the store then they show up when they get the set home in a light controlled situation... It's got nothing to do with going out of their way or forcing themselves to see them.
 

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I saw rainbows in the store with the early generation chips, but have not seen one on an HD3 or HD2+ chip.


It is not as if they are not doing anything about it, they have added segments and increased the speed of the color wheel, in attempts to reduce rainbows. The best solution would be to buy a three chip television but these are very expensive, (do they even make three chip RPTV's?)


JVC published an article claiming that dlp tvs cause eye fatigue. And as much as I like the DiLA technology, I see too many pixelation artifacts along the edges during fast motion. Since I mostly want to watch sports, this made me decide to go DLP.


I am concerned that once I get my dlp set home, that I will see rainbows, or get headaches or fatigue after prolonged viewing, something that you really cant test in stores.
 

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do they even make three chip RPTV's?


Not yet...


Make sure you get the set somewhere you can return it that way if you do have problems your not stuck with a TV you don't want to watch.
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by carl033
...I had to force myself to cause my eyes to dart back-and-forth on the screen, or shake my head violently when at close range to the screen...
Umm....ok :rolleyes: You must watch TV much differently than me if this is how you model your viewing experience.
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by bhoppe
Umm....ok :rolleyes: You must watch TV much differently than me if this is how you model your viewing experience.
Did you read his post? He said that's what he personally had to do to see rainbows. When he watches normally, he can't see them.
 

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Nobody in my family has ever seen a rainbow on my 14-month-old Sammy DLP, and we watch mostly at night in a totally dark room. I believe most do not see rainbows, or only see them when whipping their head around like a crazy person. Of course, some people are susceptible. If you do not see them, and think DLPs look the best to you in the store, then just make sure to double check in different stores, and then go ahead and buy the set. We love ours. It's too easy to get caught up in all the negative threads here, and you will not find any technology or any brand without some negative thread.
 

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When I first got my Sammy HLP 5063, I could see rainbows almost every day, but only when it was a mostly white screen and if darted my eyes or head to look at something else. That was back in June/July. Now, I can't see them at all anymore. I dunno what happened, probably just got used to it. My roommates don't see them anymore either, so I'm assuming after a few months your eyes just adjust to it.
 

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I am a new guy on the block and I have just begun my search for a RPTV for the first house that my wife and I are buying (closing in a week). I am replacing a 10 year old 32" Sony CRT TV. Based on my initial research and a trip to BB I am leaning towards one of the RCA Scenium DLP sets.


All this talk of "rainbows" and getting headaches is scaring me. What exactly causes these rainbows? And why would someone be susceptible to headaches? Is it something that is strictly only on DLP based sets?


I am a Computer Operator by profession (and a game playing, web surfing computer enthusiast by hobby) and I spend a lot of time in front of computer displays - both LCD and CRT. I never have gotten any headaches attributed to viewing these so am I safe in assuming that I should have no headache issues with DLP RPTV's? On the other hand, my wife can get motion sickness if she is a passanger in a car (not if she is actually driving however) for extended periods so should I worry about her?


Boy.... all this research and investigating options and choices for a RPTV is almost getting too much for me to handle. It's almost as bad as trying to figure out which components to pick for building a high-end computer!


Scott
 

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Rainbows are an artifact that is particular to single chip DLP televisions. Each color R, G, B is projected sequentially not simultaneously. The way single chip DLP works is the light is passed through a color wheel, and then to the DMD which then projects the image onto the screen, so three images for each frame are projected.


Of course this happens very quickly, much faster than the retina and brain can process the image so it appears to be a composite image. There is a web site with some images about this artifact. On this site there are photographs at progessively faster shutter speeds of a dlp television, and it took a shutter speed of 1/1000 of a second to seperate the images.


So for the most part rainbows are not a problem. But sometimes with fast motion on the screen or of your eyes, the edges can reveal the seperate R, G, B very quickly, and this is called a rainbow. It is much more prevalent in first generation chips. The newer chips have a faster color wheel so it is not as noticeable.


Some high end front projectors use three chips, so the R, G, B is projected simultaneously, so these have no problems with rainbows, and the images are gorgeous. But they are very expensive. The newest chips HD2+ and HD3 actually approach three chip projectors in PQ for a lot lower price.


JVC has published an article about fatigue from DLP's. But of course they are biased. ;)
 

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This seems to be an issue of the right settings maybe lighting also. When the picture is too dark I see more rainbows. When it is too bright I get more fatigue. It is about finding the right settings, with an optimum amount of ambient light.


Rainbows don't bother me as much as lets say SDE/SSE. Rainbows are fleeting generally lasting a millisecond or two, whereas SDE is a more permanent thing. Also, bad convergence in RP CRT's bugs me more than rainbows. If it's a choice between rainbows and lets say fatigue I'd rather set my TV up for less fatigue more rainbows. But that's just me.
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by Geed
I am a new guy on the block and I have just begun my search for a RPTV for the first house that my wife and I are buying (closing in a week). I am replacing a 10 year old 32" Sony CRT TV. Based on my initial research and a trip to BB I am leaning towards one of the RCA Scenium DLP sets.


All this talk of "rainbows" and getting headaches is scaring me. What exactly causes these rainbows? And why would someone be susceptible to headaches? Is it something that is strictly only on DLP based sets?


I am a Computer Operator by profession (and a game playing, web surfing computer enthusiast by hobby) and I spend a lot of time in front of computer displays - both LCD and CRT. I never have gotten any headaches attributed to viewing these so am I safe in assuming that I should have no headache issues with DLP RPTV's? On the other hand, my wife can get motion sickness if she is a passanger in a car (not if she is actually driving however) for extended periods so should I worry about her?


Boy.... all this research and investigating options and choices for a RPTV is almost getting too much for me to handle. It's almost as bad as trying to figure out which components to pick for building a high-end computer!


Scott
I had a slight headache the first night I watched my DLP. I was watching the TV in almost total darkness, and I think the headache was due to my eyes trying to adjust to a much larger and brighter picture than they were used to. I haven't had any headaches since the first night of viewing.


My wife is also susceptible to motion sickness. She hasn't experienced any motion sickness when viewing our DLP. I would guess that the closer you are to the screen, the greater the possibility of motion sickness. Our seating position is about 12' from our 50" TV.
 

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I had headache's and eye strain (left eye only) the 1st week I had my Sammy HLP6163. But since then I have added a backlite and adjust the settings and now I dont have any probm's anymore with headaches and eye strain. I use to get the same eye strain (left eye) when I was playing 1st person shooters for a long period (6+hrs) using a 21" monitor (80hz refresh rate) also. But the backlite does really help a lot with DLP's esp in a darken room.
 
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