I can't remember who asked me about it, or which specific thread, but for anyone and everyone who is interested about the speed at which the Toshiba RD-X2 burns DVD-Rs, I've been burning a number of DVD-Rs in the last couple of days, and whether the amount of programming burned on the disc was 2 hours at SP, 2.5 hours at setting 3.8 or even more than six hours on 1.4, all the discs took less than 2 hours to create, from start to finalization. Probably about an hour and a half each. Whoopee!!!
RDX2's Speed -- Burning DVD-Rs
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For me, speed of burning DVD-R's is critical. That's why I'm holding out for the soon to be released Pioneer DVR-99H. It boasts a 4X DVD-R burn.
Jeff
Jeff
Quote:
You may have a bit of a wait since there doesn't seem to be any North American release date on this unit.
| Originally posted by Jeff Goldberg For me, speed of burning DVD-R's is critical. That's why I'm holding out for the soon to be released Pioneer DVR-99H. It boasts a 4X DVD-R burn. Jeff |
I should have addressed my question sw10025, it was actually for Jeff Goldberg. I was just pointing out that finding cheap 4x media might be a real problem.
With regards to your DVD-R burning experience sw10025, I'm not sure that it is anything faster than what else is out there. The main difference is that the Pioneer does not require real-time recording, whereas the Panny units do. But even the Panny unit can write an entire 4.7 GB disk in 1 hour. All it takes for that is to record in XP mode. So the main difference here is not that the drives can burn at difference speeds, but that the controlling mechanism uses the potential speed of the Pio drive at all times, whereas the Panny will record everything in real-time, even though that is sometimes far below the capability of the drive.
With regards to your DVD-R burning experience sw10025, I'm not sure that it is anything faster than what else is out there. The main difference is that the Pioneer does not require real-time recording, whereas the Panny units do. But even the Panny unit can write an entire 4.7 GB disk in 1 hour. All it takes for that is to record in XP mode. So the main difference here is not that the drives can burn at difference speeds, but that the controlling mechanism uses the potential speed of the Pio drive at all times, whereas the Panny will record everything in real-time, even though that is sometimes far below the capability of the drive.
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Felgar,
My needs may be different than other forum members. I produce wedding and event videos. Clients are lately requesting DVD instead of VHS.
Since I edit to DVCam, it is imperitive that whatever DVD burner I end up with, the DVD produced is close as possible to the DVCam master.
I envision I'll be transfering DV material from my SONY DSR-30 deck to the stand-alone DVD burner harddrive in real time via firewire. Then I'll need to make a couple of DVD-R's for the client and one for me for archive purposes.
I was leaning towards the HS-2 but I was unhappy about the need to archive to DVD-Ram.
The ultimate DVD- burner for me would have the following features:
1) Firewire input port with no luma bug problems
2) Large harddrive to hold several projects of approx 2 hours each.
3) Able to transfer from DVD-R to harddrive (archive)
4) High speed dub from harddrive to DVD-R.
5) Final DVD-R would be compatible with client's DVD player.
I believe the Pioneer DVR-99H would be pretty close to my ideal.
I thought I read somewhere that the 99H would be released in February '03. maybe I was dreaming.
Jeff
My needs may be different than other forum members. I produce wedding and event videos. Clients are lately requesting DVD instead of VHS.
Since I edit to DVCam, it is imperitive that whatever DVD burner I end up with, the DVD produced is close as possible to the DVCam master.
I envision I'll be transfering DV material from my SONY DSR-30 deck to the stand-alone DVD burner harddrive in real time via firewire. Then I'll need to make a couple of DVD-R's for the client and one for me for archive purposes.
I was leaning towards the HS-2 but I was unhappy about the need to archive to DVD-Ram.
The ultimate DVD- burner for me would have the following features:
1) Firewire input port with no luma bug problems
2) Large harddrive to hold several projects of approx 2 hours each.
3) Able to transfer from DVD-R to harddrive (archive)
4) High speed dub from harddrive to DVD-R.
5) Final DVD-R would be compatible with client's DVD player.
I believe the Pioneer DVR-99H would be pretty close to my ideal.
I thought I read somewhere that the 99H would be released in February '03. maybe I was dreaming.
Jeff
Ya, the HS2 obviously has no high speed dub and too small HDD for your purposes. I'm sure it won't be long before suitable equipment is released. It seems these units are advancing quickly.
FWIW, if you're following the luma bug thread, it may be that the professional version of the HS2 has no luma bug. It certainly does not have the bug on Firewire.
FWIW, if you're following the luma bug thread, it may be that the professional version of the HS2 has no luma bug. It certainly does not have the bug on Firewire.
Quote:
I don't really care whether or not its any faster than anything out there. Up to now, all I've had is a Panny E20, which would have taken the full 6 hours (real time), and before I bought the RDX2, I found no information about the unit on the Toshiba site, and no information about the DVD-R burn speed on vendor sites, or really even from the manual, which just had an oblique reference to burning a DVD-R at over 4.4 would take approximately an hour and a half to finalize.
After being unable to get any information about the DVD-R burn rate, it was a nice surprise that a 6 hour DVD-R took *anything* less than 6 hours to create and finalize, and that it took less than 2 hours was even better. (I'm just glad it doesn't tie up the machine for the full amount of time.) I was *whoopee'ing* for that, rather than for the fact that I thought it was faster than any other machine.
I like this machine *so much better* than my previous Panasonic...
| Originally posted by Felgar With regards to your DVD-R burning experience sw10025, I'm not sure that it is anything faster than what else is out there |
After being unable to get any information about the DVD-R burn rate, it was a nice surprise that a 6 hour DVD-R took *anything* less than 6 hours to create and finalize, and that it took less than 2 hours was even better. (I'm just glad it doesn't tie up the machine for the full amount of time.) I was *whoopee'ing* for that, rather than for the fact that I thought it was faster than any other machine.
I like this machine *so much better* than my previous Panasonic...
To Jeff Goldberg: Don't know if you've seen this http://www.draco.com/newindex.cfm?sh...rue&linkID=974
but it seems to fit all your criteria. I was thinking about it, because the Prestige has none of the problems of these consumer units only a steep price $3400.00, But with the commercial work of yours it may be justified.
but it seems to fit all your criteria. I was thinking about it, because the Prestige has none of the problems of these consumer units only a steep price $3400.00, But with the commercial work of yours it may be justified.
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Thanks Macsog,
The Draco Prestige is definately geared towards the event videography niche. The steep price is only justified if the non-linear editing capabilities are also desired. For me, the DVCam source is a fully edited master without the need for any further titling, transitions, or editing whatsoever.
If I didn't already own a PC with Adobe Premier and a DSR-30 DVCam deck, I would definately buy the Prestige.
Considering that prices are beginning to soften, I'm now thinking that the HS-2 may be a viable interim solution. Since it is commercial work that I do, cost containment is vital for maintaing price points and profits.
Jeff
The Draco Prestige is definately geared towards the event videography niche. The steep price is only justified if the non-linear editing capabilities are also desired. For me, the DVCam source is a fully edited master without the need for any further titling, transitions, or editing whatsoever.
If I didn't already own a PC with Adobe Premier and a DSR-30 DVCam deck, I would definately buy the Prestige.
Considering that prices are beginning to soften, I'm now thinking that the HS-2 may be a viable interim solution. Since it is commercial work that I do, cost containment is vital for maintaing price points and profits.
Jeff
It really amuses me that people weigh so heavily the ability of whether a standalone recorder can do high speed vs. real time dubs to DVD-R.
For perspecitve, a one hour video recorded in XP mode (maximum) quality could be high speed dubbed no faster than 1/2 hour saving about 1/2 hour (not counting the "real time" dub to the HS2 HDD in the first place). Similarly, a 2 hour video could be dubbed no faster than 1/2 hour in high speed saving about an hour and a half. Neither of which are significnat time savers even if you consider multiple dubs. WRT to 6 hour dubs, the quality of such a recording would not be such that I would be cranking out many copies like a high quality event video, so the one time 6 hour real time dub could be done overnight without much fuss or time wasted.
That's why I conduct "real time" dubs to DVD-R in off hours or when I'm not otherwise using the unit (like overnight - people do sleep still, don't they?).
I'm not saying that high speed dubs to DVD-R would not be beneficial, but IMHO the benefit of such a feature should not be weighed that heavily against the balance of the other features and benefits of the standalone DVD recorders including time shifting, on-board storage, real time good quality hardware encoding, menus, editing etc... that balance well against the non-real time PC solutions such as TMPGenc.
I guess people have already forgotten the days of real time analog dubs (including printing to the initial edited DV master) and high quality software mpeg2 encodes that take 6 to 10 times real time (and still do even with today's 2GHz+ processors)!
Vic
For perspecitve, a one hour video recorded in XP mode (maximum) quality could be high speed dubbed no faster than 1/2 hour saving about 1/2 hour (not counting the "real time" dub to the HS2 HDD in the first place). Similarly, a 2 hour video could be dubbed no faster than 1/2 hour in high speed saving about an hour and a half. Neither of which are significnat time savers even if you consider multiple dubs. WRT to 6 hour dubs, the quality of such a recording would not be such that I would be cranking out many copies like a high quality event video, so the one time 6 hour real time dub could be done overnight without much fuss or time wasted.
That's why I conduct "real time" dubs to DVD-R in off hours or when I'm not otherwise using the unit (like overnight - people do sleep still, don't they?).
I'm not saying that high speed dubs to DVD-R would not be beneficial, but IMHO the benefit of such a feature should not be weighed that heavily against the balance of the other features and benefits of the standalone DVD recorders including time shifting, on-board storage, real time good quality hardware encoding, menus, editing etc... that balance well against the non-real time PC solutions such as TMPGenc.
I guess people have already forgotten the days of real time analog dubs (including printing to the initial edited DV master) and high quality software mpeg2 encodes that take 6 to 10 times real time (and still do even with today's 2GHz+ processors)!
Vic
Quote:
Unattended dubs (overnight etc.) are especially viable on the HS2 given that you can set up a project and let it run without having to "babysit" the start and end points of each segment. I find that feature alone more than outweighs the lack of high-speed DVD-R dubbing.
| Originally posted by vferrari It really amuses me that people weigh so heavily the ability of whether a standalone recorder can do high speed vs. real time dubs to DVD-R. That's why I conduct "real time" dubs to DVD-R in off hours or when I'm not otherwise using the unit (like overnight - people do sleep still, don't they?). Vic |
I've been reading this forum for awhile and finally decided to join because it's the only place to find decent info on things like the RD-X2.
To Jeff Goldberg; What you're looking to do with the RD-X2 is the same thing I am, except I lean towards corporate/industrial video work. As far as I've read, the RD-X2 doesn't have a firewire port, correct? That has been the biggest delay for me for not buying it.
I was really hoping to use the RD-X2 as almost a secondary/slave HDD. I've read the RD-X3 will have the capability, along with that giant drive, but god only knows when that will see US import.
Thanks for the info everyone - Martin
To Jeff Goldberg; What you're looking to do with the RD-X2 is the same thing I am, except I lean towards corporate/industrial video work. As far as I've read, the RD-X2 doesn't have a firewire port, correct? That has been the biggest delay for me for not buying it.
I was really hoping to use the RD-X2 as almost a secondary/slave HDD. I've read the RD-X3 will have the capability, along with that giant drive, but god only knows when that will see US import.
Thanks for the info everyone - Martin
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Hi Martin,
The RD-X2 is not an option for me due to its lack of a firewire port.
The only gripe I now have with the HS-2 is that archiving is done on DVD-Ram, not DVD-R. This gripe is a small one.
There are solutions to the DVD-Ram archival gripe:
1)clone the DVD-R archive in a PC equipped with a DVD-R burner.
2)use one DVD-Ram for each client project and pass along the cost.
3)use the DVD-R archive in another DVD player as the analog source for additional HS-2 burns.
I'm sure other forum members can come up with even better solutions.
Jeff
The RD-X2 is not an option for me due to its lack of a firewire port.
The only gripe I now have with the HS-2 is that archiving is done on DVD-Ram, not DVD-R. This gripe is a small one.
There are solutions to the DVD-Ram archival gripe:
1)clone the DVD-R archive in a PC equipped with a DVD-R burner.
2)use one DVD-Ram for each client project and pass along the cost.
3)use the DVD-R archive in another DVD player as the analog source for additional HS-2 burns.
I'm sure other forum members can come up with even better solutions.
Jeff
Quote:
Yeah, the RD-X2 does that as well. Actually, last night I discovered another neat little feature it apparently has. Got my programming all ready, stuck in a brand new DVD-R, went through the "create DVD-R" function, and very shortly thereafter, it gave me an error message that said "insert another DVD-R disc".
I thought Oh-oh, this is not good, but when I looked at the disc, it had a couple of little specks of something on it. I cleaned them off the disc, inserted it back in, the machine automatically started recording my stuff (in full, from the top, without prompting) onto the disc, finalized it, no problemo. If that had been my E20, it would have recorded to the point it reached the first spec on the disc, then failed and ruined the disc.
The RDX2 must have checked the entire disc before starting...
| Originally posted by JeffWld Unattended dubs (overnight etc.) are especially viable on the HS2 given that you can set up a project and let it run without having to "babysit" the start and end points of each segment. I find that feature alone more than outweighs the lack of high-speed DVD-R dubbing. |
I thought Oh-oh, this is not good, but when I looked at the disc, it had a couple of little specks of something on it. I cleaned them off the disc, inserted it back in, the machine automatically started recording my stuff (in full, from the top, without prompting) onto the disc, finalized it, no problemo. If that had been my E20, it would have recorded to the point it reached the first spec on the disc, then failed and ruined the disc.
The RDX2 must have checked the entire disc before starting...
I was informed by my Toshiba distributor that his Toshiba rep said that the RD-X2 has been discontinued! He said "it's not competitive in the marketplace". Largely because of the lack of progressive scan and firewire, I do believe. No info on a replacement.
Eric
Eric
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I ordered an RD-X2 from Tech Depot (aka Computers4Sure) on backorder. After I had been on backorder for a couple of weeks, one of the customer service reps there offered to check directly with the distributor/supplier and see when it would come in...she seemed confident that it should be there soon. She called me back and told me, after speaking to whoever her distributor/supplier that they were NEVER getting them in.
Factor in the fact that it appears that virtually nobody on the web has them in stock and it starts to make you wonder...
Think I'll call Tosh and see if they have any comments...
Factor in the fact that it appears that virtually nobody on the web has them in stock and it starts to make you wonder...
Think I'll call Tosh and see if they have any comments...
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