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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
During experiments with different AVR I realised that nobody from vendors follows HDMI specs in full volume

http://www.hdmi.org/download/HDMISpecification13a.pdf

Especially in part of Repeater Functions
Quote:
Originally Posted by HDMISpecification13a /forum/post/0


A Repeater is defined as a device with one or more HDMI inputs, one or more HDMI outputs, and

a retransmission function.

A Repeater has at least one of following functions:

Repeat function:

Single-input, single-output devices. Used primarily for cable extension.

Switch function:

Multiple-input, single-output devices. Used primarily to select among multiple Sources.

Distributor function:

Single-input, multiple-output devices, where only one output is active. Used primarily to select

among multiple displays or Sinks.

Duplicator function:

Single-input, multiple-output devices, where more than one output is active. Used for signal

distribution.

Combinations of the above, for instance, multiple-input, multiple-output devices, incorporating

both input selection and output selection or signal distribution are allowed.

In all cases, each HDMI input shall fulfill all of the requirements of an HDMI Sink when it is

connected with an active sink device, and each HDMI output shall fulfill all of the requirements of

an HDMI Source when it is connected with an active source.

The E-EDID presented by a Repeater should reflect the capabilities of the downstream Sink.

Good explanation about repeaters based on HDMI standards you may find here


All current AVR damage original TV EDID


In overall AVR as right repeater should transfer TV video EDID blocks w/o change and replace all audio blocks + CEC address with own data.

In reality it changes video info too



There is very simple test to check it.

You should have PC with DVI-D!!! or HDMI port and post 3 real-time moninfo http://entechtaiwan.net/util/moninfo.shtm reports with following connections:

1. PC - TV

2. PC - AVR - TV

3. PC - AVR

Simple way if you don't have 2nd monitor in 3rd test:

- just unplug HDMI cable from TV after 2nd test

- wait 10-15 sec and press F5

- plug Cabel back

Please post HDMI In and Out on every device due reporting wrong CEC addresses by many AVR.

Better to use Full HD TV with 30-36bit Color support - more issues will be visible.
Please use Code Tag


Not many people understand this issue. Several times I try to explain in AVR forum what's issue:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...4#post14058344
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...3#post14891863
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...7#post15217857
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...7#post15218157


But in this forum it will be more effective IMHO.

Moreover from June 2008 when this test was proposed appears new versions moninfo and Microsoft EDID Override .


I began thread in russian forum. http://forum.ixbt.com/topic.cgi?id=62:14612

The goal is to make database of all current AVR by Plug and Play ID.

You will see possible problems in advance. May be vendors pay attention to wrong written EDID finally.


Not so big list now



Plug and Play ID......... DON0009 92 B3 HDMI4

Plug and Play ID......... ONK0863 Model name............... TX-SR606 8E 72 HDMI4

Plug and Play ID......... ONK0882 Model name............... TX-SR806 BC Extension blocs.......... 1 (Reserved - 0x00)

Plug and Play ID............ YMH310C Manufacturer description.... RX-V2700 B2 90 HDMI1

Plug and Play ID......... YMH3110 Model name............... RX-V861 B7 60 HDMI1

Plug and Play ID......... YMH3111 Model name............... HTR-6060 BB 50 HDMI2

Plug and Play ID......... YMH3119 Model name............... RX-V3800 69 5F HDMI1

Plug and Play ID......... YMH3127 Model name............... RX-V663 66 5E HDMI1

Plug and Play ID......... YMH312B Model name............... RX-V863 60 5E HDMI1

Plug and Play ID......... YMH3131 Model name............... DSP-Z7 DA 39 HDMI2

But I am ready to update this post with your data!

Hope for your support


Usefull links Extended_display_identification_data
Quantum EDID structure presentation
EDID Override in this forum
 

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Discussion Starter · #2 ·
Based on Yamaha RX-V663 EDID I try to explain what's is most interesting in moninfo reports. Ìó comments in Red.

Monitor #2 [Real-time 0x0021]

Model name............... RX-V663

Manufacturer............. Yamaha

Plug and Play ID......... YMH3127 It's main. OS knows your AVR due to this name

Serial number............ n/a It's not monitor. Just few CE vendors fill this field

Manufacture date......... 2008, ISO week 0 Don't believe. But you receive some idea about creation date

-------------------------

EDID revision............ 1.3

Input signal type........ Digital

Color bit depth.......... Undefined

Display type............. RGB color

Screen size.............. Undefined or variable

Power management......... Not supported

Extension blocs.......... 1 (CEA-EXT) It's flag, that there is E-EDID

-------------------------

DDC/CI................... Not supported


Color characteristics

Default color space...... Non-sRGB

Display gamma............ 2,20

Red chromaticity......... Rx 0,625 - Ry 0,340

Green chromaticity....... Gx 0,280 - Gy 0,595

Blue chromaticity........ Bx 0,155 - By 0,070

White point (default).... Wx 0,283 - Wy 0,298

Additional descriptors... None


Timing characteristics

Horizontal scan range.... 15-91kHz

Vertical scan range...... 23-121Hz

Video bandwidth.......... 150MHz

CVT standard............. Not supported

GTF standard............. Not supported

Additional descriptors... None

Preferred timing......... Yes

Native/preferred timing.. 1920x1080i at 60Hz (16:9) First DTD

Modeline............... "1920x1080" 74,250 1920 2008 2052 2200 1080 1084 1094 1124 interlace +hsync +vsync

Detailed timing #1....... 1920x1080i at 50Hz (16:9)

Modeline............... "1920x1080" 74,250 1920 2448 2492 2640 1080 1148 1158 1124 interlace +hsync +vsync


Standard timings supported


EIA/CEA-861 Information

Revision number.......... 3

DTV underscan............ Not supported

Basic audio.............. Supported

YCbCr 4:4:4.............. Supported

YCbCr 4:2:2.............. Supported

YCbCr 4:2:2.............. Supported

Native formats........... 5

Detailed timing #1....... 720x480p at 60Hz (4:3)

Modeline............... "720x480" 27,000 720 736 798 858 480 489 495 525 -hsync -vsync

Detailed timing #2....... 720x576p at 50Hz (4:3)

Modeline............... "720x576" 27,000 720 732 796 864 576 581 586 625 -hsync -vsync


CE video data (timings supported) SVD Table

1920 x 1080i at 60Hz - HDTV (16:9, 1:1) [Native]

1280 x 720p at 60Hz - HDTV (16:9, 1:1)

720 x 480p at 60Hz - EDTV (4:3, 8:9)

720 x 480p at 60Hz - EDTV (16:9, 32:27)

720 x 480i at 60Hz - Doublescan (4:3, 8:9)

720 x 480i at 60Hz - Doublescan (16:9, 32:27)

1920 x 1080p at 60Hz - HDTV (16:9, 1:1)

1440 x 480p at 60Hz - DVD (4:3, 4:9)

1440 x 480p at 60Hz - DVD (16:9, 16:27)

2880 x 480i at 60Hz - Console (4:3, 2:9-20:9)

2880 x 480i at 60Hz - Console (16:9, 8:27-80:27)

2880 x 480p at 60Hz - Console (4:3, 2:9)

2880 x 480p at 60Hz - Console (16:9, 8:27)

1920 x 1080i at 50Hz - HDTV (16:9, 1:1)

1280 x 720p at 50Hz - HDTV (16:9, 1:1)

720 x 576p at 50Hz - EDTV (4:3, 16:15)

720 x 576p at 50Hz - EDTV (16:9, 64:45)

720 x 576i at 50Hz - Doublescan (4:3, 16:15)

720 x 576i at 50Hz - Doublescan (16:9, 64:45)

1920 x 1080p at 50Hz - HDTV (16:9, 1:1)

1440 x 576p at 50Hz - DVD (4:3, 8:15)

1440 x 576p at 50Hz - DVD (16:9, 32:45)

2880 x 576i at 50Hz - Console (4:3, 2:15-20:15)

2880 x 576i at 50Hz - Console (16:9, 16:45-160:45)

2880 x 576p at 50Hz - Console (4:3, 4:15)

2880 x 576p at 50Hz - Console (16:9, 16:45)

NB: NTSC refresh rate = (Hz*1000)/1001


CE audio data (formats supported) Most interesting for Audio format understanding

LPCM 2-channel, 16/20/24 bit depths at 32/44/48/88/96/176/192 kHz

LPCM 8-channel, 16/20/24 bit depths at 32/44/48/88/96/176/192 kHz

AC-3 6-channel, 640k max. bit rate at 32/44/48 kHz

DTS 7-channel, 1536k max. bit rate at 32/44/48/88/96 kHz

SACD 6-channel at 44 kHz

DD+ 8-channel at 44/48 kHz

DVD-A 8-channel at 48/96/192 kHz

DTS-HD 8-channel, 16-bit at 48/96/192 kHz


CE speaker allocation data

Configuration............ 8.1 channel It was mistake in this version of moninfo. Now everything is correct.

Front left/right......... Yes

Front LFE................ Yes

Front center............. Yes

Rear left/right.......... Yes

Rear center.............. Yes

Front left/right center.. No

Rear left/right center... Yes

Rear LFE................. No


CE vendor specific data (VSDB) If this block exist, Source realized that Sink is HDMI. If Not - DVI.

IEEE registration number. 0x000C03

CEC physical address..... 1.1.0.0

Supports AI.............. Yes

Supports 48bpp........... No

Supports 36bpp........... No

Supports 30bpp........... No

Supports YCbCr 4:4:4..... No

Supports dual-link DVI... No

Maximum TMDS clock....... 165MHz

Data payload............. 2100


Report information

Date generated........... 21.10.2008

Software revision........ 2.11.0.744

Raw data................. 00,FF,FF,FF,FF,FF,FF,00,65,A8,27,31,00,00,00,00,00,12,01,03, 80,00,00,78,0A,0D,C9,A0,57,47,98,27,

......................... 12,48,4C,00,00,00,01,01,01,01,01,01,01,01,01,01,01,01,01,01, 01,01,01,1D,80,18,71,1C,16,20,58,2C,

......................... 25,00,C4,8E,21,00,00,9E,01,1D,80,D0,72,1C,16,20,10,2C,25,80, C4,8E,21,00,00,9E,00,00,00,FC,00,52,

......................... 58,2D,56,36,36,33,0A,20,20,20,20,20,00,00,00,FD,00,17,79,0F, 5B,0F,00,0A,20,20,20,20,20,20,01,66,

......................... 02,03,45,75,5A,85,04,02,03,06,07,10,0E,0F,0A,0B,23,24,14,13, 11,12,15,16,1F,1D,1E,19,1A,25,26,38,

......................... 09,7F,07,0F,7F,07,15,07,50,3E,1F,C0,4D,02,00,57,06,00,67,54, 00,5F,54,01,83,5F,00,00,68,03,0C,00,

......................... 11,00,80,21,00,8C,0A,D0,8A,20,E0,2D,10,10,3E,96,00,13,8E,21, 00,00,18,8C,0A,D0,90,20,40,31,20,0C,

......................... 40,55,00,13,8E,21,00,00,18,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00, 00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,5E


As you may see Yamaha doesn't support such HDMI 1.3 features as 30-36bit color. But if you connect it to TV with this feature everything will be correct passthrough.


The same situation will be with 24p support.

IMHO Yamaha should revise own EDID for support those features.


Also bug of this EDID - nonunderstandable

Native formats........... 5

According all DTD and SVD we have only 1 Native format.
 
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