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ROKU + AVR + ARC/CEC = Huge headache

3879 Views 9 Replies 5 Participants Last post by Otto Pylot, Aug 19, 2019

madmortar

Discussion Starter · Aug 15, 2019

My first post so hopeful it is in the right forum...

Looking for some help guidance, this is also my first post so I'm willing to take my beating if warrantied.

Finally after years of dreaming of a true surround sound set up, and being miserable watching TV with a sound bar, I went ahead and upgraded to a 3.1 set up (separate thread to come regarding all of that).

The biggest issue I am facing is getting my Roku Stick to work in conjunction with my AVR and TV.
AVR = Denon x1500h
TV = Samsung un60f6300
Roku = Streaming Stick +

I am hooking the Roku directly into my AVR in the cable HDMI port, and running an HDMI cable direct out of AVR to my TV into the ARC HDMI input on the tv.

Here is my issue and to make matters worse or harder for you all to understand...nothing is consistent, sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't, and when it doesn't it can bug out in different ways. But to summarize...

When things go right:
I click power button on my Roku remote..
The TV + AVR all turn on as normal..
The Roku home screen shows up...
If I quickly hit volume right away it will either no work but after 5 seconds start working OR will control my TV volume for about 5 seconds and then switch over to AVR.

When things go wrong:
I click power button on my Roku remote..
The TV + AVR all turn on as normal..
The Roku home screen shows up...
After a few seconds the screen goes black..
I hit "home" on the Roku and it acts like it's changing HDMI sources and flips back to the Roku screen..
At this point it's a coin toss if the AVR sound will dominate or the TV.

Another example is sometimes I click power button on my Roku and the AVR fails to turn on at all, reverting back to TV speakers.

I know there is a simple fix...simply ditch this BS, turn off ARC and use TV volume for normal watching and power up my AVR for movies and music. However I really would like to enjoy my 3.1 set up all the time PLUS I really want to utilize one remote as it's less confusing for my wife and kids.

Finally, there are way too many settings on my AVR related to this subject and ARC control. I have messed around with a few but none seem to solve my problem. In fact they just seem to complicate what should be a simple process. My guess is that the Roku is powering on before AVR is really up and running and at time things can get glitchy. Also I think the fact that the Roku doesn't really turn off right away and goes into standby can also cause issues (for example more issues when turning on tv first thing in the morning).

I can't be the only one.
Please share your thoughts...

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Otto Pylot

· #2 · Aug 15, 2019

Sounds like an ARC/CEC incompatibility. More specifically the CEC part. CEC is not a standardized protocol so the mfrs are free to implement CEC however they choose to do so, which can result in input switching issues, volume issues, etc, and in some cases affect ARC as well. There aren't any firmware upgrades that can make your devices play nicely together. This is a common issue, still.

Disable ARC/CEC on all of your HDMI connected devices. It can be called different things by the mfrs so read you manuals to make sure you are disabling the correct option. In lieu of ARC, use an optical cable from your tv to the receiver for the internal apps or OTA television. You will be limited to 5.1 audio, just like ARC. In lieu of CEC (single remote control) purchase a programmable remote like a Harmony. I've used optical and a Harmony on both of my HTS's for years and never regretted it once.

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madmortar

Discussion Starter · #3 · Aug 15, 2019

Otto Pylot said:
Sounds like an ARC/CEC incompatibility. More specifically the CEC part. CEC is not a standardized protocol so the mfrs are free to implement CEC however they choose to do so, which can result in input switching issues, volume issues, etc, and in some cases affect ARC as well. There aren't any firmware upgrades that can make your devices play nicely together. This is a common issue, still.

Disable ARC/CEC on all of your HDMI connected devices. It can be called different things by the mfrs so read you manuals to make sure you are disabling the correct option. In lieu of ARC, use an optical cable from your tv to the receiver for the internal apps or OTA television. You will be limited to 5.1 audio, just like ARC. In lieu of CEC (single remote control) purchase a programmable remote like a Harmony. I've used optical and a Harmony on both of my HTS's for years and never regretted it once.

Thanks for the reply.
A real shame that it doesnt work as it is suppose to do. I had the same frustration with my ROKU stick and my soundbar when i was running that set up. Though i figured out a way to get it to work 99% of the time.

Given I have a roku stick direct into AVR, i dont ever use the TV for cable, apps, or anything really. So I guess if i cant get it all to play nice im just going to disable and only turn on my AVR when its movie time.
Would a Harmony be able to control a roku stick? If not, that solution would not work for me.

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Otto Pylot

· #4 · Aug 15, 2019

madmortar said:
Thanks for the reply.
A real shame that it doesnt work as it is suppose to do. I had the same frustration with my ROKU stick and my soundbar when i was running that set up. Though i figured out a way to get it to work 99% of the time.

Given I have a roku stick direct into AVR, i dont ever use the TV for cable, apps, or anything really. So I guess if i cant get it all to play nice im just going to disable and only turn on my AVR when its movie time.
Would a Harmony be able to control a roku stick? If not, that solution would not work for me.

Another option I failed to mention was the Lindy CEC-less adapter. That's a little dongle that goes between the device and the HDMI input and blocks the CEC commands, if that's what the issue is, so you are still able to use ARC if that's what you need. You can also remove pin 13 (I think that's the one) from the HDMI cable which does the same thing.

I don't know for a fact if the Harmony has the commands for the Roku or not. I would be surprised if it doesn't because Logitech (the mfr of Harmony) has a database with thousands of commands for tons of devices. You could ask in the Remote Control Forum.

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madmortar

Discussion Starter · #5 · Aug 15, 2019

Otto Pylot said:
Another option I failed to mention was the Lindy CEC-less adapter. That's a little dongle that goes between the device and the HDMI input and blocks the CEC commands, if that's what the issue is, so you are still able to use ARC if that's what you need. You can also remove pin 13 (I think that's the one) from the HDMI cable which does the same thing.

I don't know for a fact if the Harmony has the commands for the Roku or not. I would be surprised if it doesn't because Logitech (the mfr of Harmony) has a database with thousands of commands for tons of devices. You could ask in the Remote Control Forum.

You know what... I think Lindy CEC-less might fix my issue. Or at least worth a shot.
Too bad they are $25 on amazon right now!

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ellisda1

· #6 · Aug 19, 2019

Otto Pylot said:
Another option I failed to mention was the Lindy CEC-less adapter. That's a little dongle that goes between the device and the HDMI input and blocks the CEC commands, if that's what the issue is, so you are still able to use ARC if that's what you need. You can also remove pin 13 (I think that's the one) from the HDMI cable which does the same thing.

I don't know for a fact if the Harmony has the commands for the Roku or not. I would be surprised if it doesn't because Logitech (the mfr of Harmony) has a database with thousands of commands for tons of devices. You could ask in the Remote Control Forum.

Lower end Harmony remotes (ie.,650) do NOT control a Roku Stick. I had to upgrade to the Roku Ultra and could continue using my old Harmony 650.
I have no ARC problems with my system, but have different TV. My Denon X3400 does eARC flawlessly, I plug my Roku Ultra into my Denon, use the Harmony 650 with no problems. Lots of folks complain about ARC, but I'm not one of them.

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Stephen Hopkins

· #7 · Aug 19, 2019

I've found Roku to be particularly bad at implementing CEC and cherrypick which features they support to push you towards using their remote (along with its pay-to-play shortcut buttons). Honestly, in the long run, a Harmony Hub-based remote is probably not only the best solutions but one of the best $50-$65 you'll ever spend on your home theater. The original Harmony Smart Control was an absolute game changer and that's why it's still in production 5+ years later. It's well worth the original MSRP of $99 and a bargain at the regular sale price of ~$50 (currently $52 at Walmart).

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Otto Pylot

· #8 · Aug 19, 2019

ellisda1 said:
Lower end Harmony remotes (ie.,650) do NOT control a Roku Stick. I had to upgrade to the Roku Ultra and could continue using my old Harmony 650.
I have no ARC problems with my system, but have different TV. My Denon X3400 does eARC flawlessly, I plug my Roku Ultra into my Denon, use the Harmony 650 with no problems. Lots of folks complain about ARC, but I'm not one of them.

It's refreshing to hear that you don't have any ARC issues because lots of folks do.

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aaronwt

· #9 · Aug 19, 2019 (Edited)

Otto Pylot said:
Sounds like an ARC/CEC incompatibility. More specifically the CEC part. CEC is not a standardized protocol so the mfrs are free to implement CEC however they choose to do so, which can result in input switching issues, volume issues, etc, and in some cases affect ARC as well. There aren't any firmware upgrades that can make your devices play nicely together. This is a common issue, still.

Disable ARC/CEC on all of your HDMI connected devices. It can be called different things by the mfrs so read you manuals to make sure you are disabling the correct option. In lieu of ARC, use an optical cable from your tv to the receiver for the internal apps or OTA television. You will be limited to 5.1 audio, just like ARC. In lieu of CEC (single remote control) purchase a programmable remote like a Harmony. I've used optical and a Harmony on both of my HTS's for years and never regretted it once.

Yes. When devices have great compatibility. the ARC/CEC can worked flawlessly. But if there are any incompatibilities, there can be major issues.

Personally I love the ARC/HDMI-CEC. It's worked great for me in multiple setups. Since I started using it around five or six years ago.

But I'll also do anything to avoid using optical cables. I stopped using most of them in 2005, when I switched to using HDMi devices. And then stopped using the rest of them a few years later. Like with the XBox 360. Optical cables It worked great for me from the early 90's on. But it was so nice to get rid of multiple component cables and optical cables. And replace them with one HDMI cable.

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Otto Pylot

· #10 · Aug 19, 2019

aaronwt said:
Yes. When devices have great compatibility. the ARC/CEC can worked flawlessly. But if there are any incompatibilities, there can be major issues.

Personally I love the ARC/HDMI-CEC. It's worked great for me in multiple setups. Since I started using it around five or six years ago.

Yep. ARC/CEC is a good idea and when it works, there's nothing like it. However, a lot of folks, myself included, never got it to work well. Or if it did, issues arose after a device was updated. I just got frustrated with it and said screw it. Or course it helps that I don't need ARC/eARC so that made my decision a bit easier

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