Sanyo PLV-60 vs Sanyo XP21N
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After reading all the recent reviews regarding the PLV-60 at the InfoComm I am wondering why the XP21N is not mentioned at all. Is it even on display?
I had my mind made up to go for the XP21N mainly because I am interested in viewing 4:3 NTSC material and the occasional DVD. I do not have much use of 16:9 and would prefer the brighter projector.
Other than the aspect ratio and the brightness how do these two projectors compare with the following:
1. Color accuracy
2. Screen door effect
3. Graininess problem
4. Scaler/Deinterlacer
Is the PLV-60 really better than the XP21N or it is getting the most publicity because of its aspect ratio and the fact that it is new?
Does the different type of LCD panel make a big difference in the picture quality?
Peter
I had my mind made up to go for the XP21N mainly because I am interested in viewing 4:3 NTSC material and the occasional DVD. I do not have much use of 16:9 and would prefer the brighter projector.
Other than the aspect ratio and the brightness how do these two projectors compare with the following:
1. Color accuracy
2. Screen door effect
3. Graininess problem
4. Scaler/Deinterlacer
Is the PLV-60 really better than the XP21N or it is getting the most publicity because of its aspect ratio and the fact that it is new?
Does the different type of LCD panel make a big difference in the picture quality?
Peter
The 21 has the Micro lens Array which helps reduce the chicken wire effect. The 18 lacks this feature.
The purpose of the MLA is to increase the brightness. Projectorcentral.com claims this also reduces the screen door effect, but there is not agreement on that point. There is undeniably still a screen effect with the XP21N.
There seems to be a lot of recent posts on the screen door/ graininess on the PLV-60, does the XP21N exhibit the same symptoms or is it any better?
Has anybody compared the two units side by side?
Peter
Has anybody compared the two units side by side?
Peter
With regard to the MLA, the XP21N that I have seen had reduced screen door.
I am convinced that increased brightness increases the observability of screen door. I guess this should be obvious since a black screen should have no screen door.
Most of the graininess comments come from the Infocomm projector shootout. IMO, it wasn't particularly objectionable in comparison with the competition.
The only projectors that didn't have noticeable screen door were DILAS and/or cinema-quality projectors. The QXGA was truly impressive.
My biggest issue is that I'd like to see the PLV60 brighter.
I had some long and interesting discussions with the Sanyo people. The PLV-60 is an initial foray into the HT market. If it is successful, expect to see more (hopefully brighter) new products in this area. They were very receptive to feedback.
I was told that the PLV60 and XP30 have better aspect ratio control than the XP21 and XP18.
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Ken Elliott
[This message has been edited by kelliot (edited 06-17-2001).]
I am convinced that increased brightness increases the observability of screen door. I guess this should be obvious since a black screen should have no screen door.
Most of the graininess comments come from the Infocomm projector shootout. IMO, it wasn't particularly objectionable in comparison with the competition.
The only projectors that didn't have noticeable screen door were DILAS and/or cinema-quality projectors. The QXGA was truly impressive.
My biggest issue is that I'd like to see the PLV60 brighter.
I had some long and interesting discussions with the Sanyo people. The PLV-60 is an initial foray into the HT market. If it is successful, expect to see more (hopefully brighter) new products in this area. They were very receptive to feedback.
I was told that the PLV60 and XP30 have better aspect ratio control than the XP21 and XP18.
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Ken Elliott
[This message has been edited by kelliot (edited 06-17-2001).]
Phussary:
You may want to talk to Les/Arrow as he demoed the XP21N and told me it had noticeable screen door. We saw two different PLV 60s, one at Sanyo's booth, the other in the shootout.
The one at Sanyo's booth had a cabling problem as a horizontal line ran through the picture. This unit had serious screen door problems. The unit in the shootout, however did not. We tried to go back and confirm the difference but unfortunately the shootout closed early. We also tried to find out what hardware they were running at the shootout to perhaps explain the lack of screen door. Unfortunately we were unsuccesful.
Another problem with the PLV 60 seems to be the amount of dust it attracts. This has been a common theme in many posts I have read and what I've heard from people I spoke with. I demoed the unit and also noticed dust blobs on the blue screen but they didn't appear noticeable with source material.
You may want to talk to Les/Arrow as he demoed the XP21N and told me it had noticeable screen door. We saw two different PLV 60s, one at Sanyo's booth, the other in the shootout.
The one at Sanyo's booth had a cabling problem as a horizontal line ran through the picture. This unit had serious screen door problems. The unit in the shootout, however did not. We tried to go back and confirm the difference but unfortunately the shootout closed early. We also tried to find out what hardware they were running at the shootout to perhaps explain the lack of screen door. Unfortunately we were unsuccesful.
Another problem with the PLV 60 seems to be the amount of dust it attracts. This has been a common theme in many posts I have read and what I've heard from people I spoke with. I demoed the unit and also noticed dust blobs on the blue screen but they didn't appear noticeable with source material.
The viewing distance in the shootout was about 1-2 ft too far to notice screen door.
I bent forward and noticed screen door on every projector being shown including the DLPs. I didn't see rainbow on anything.
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Ken Elliott
I bent forward and noticed screen door on every projector being shown including the DLPs. I didn't see rainbow on anything.
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Ken Elliott
Is the screendoor effect on the Sanyo XP21N comparable to the Sony VW10HT? I recently saw the Sony and it looked very acceptable to me.
How about the dust problem, does the XP21N attract as much dust as the PLV-60?
How about the dust problem, does the XP21N attract as much dust as the PLV-60?
Maybe its time for a thread on observability of screen door.
I'm convinced that the observability of screen door goes up with brightness.
At distance greater than 2:1 at 1000 lumens, I think its usually not objectionable for an LCD at 480p.
At 2600 lumens, its more obvious at 2:1 and objectionable for bright scenes. The MLA reduces this, but its still observable.
The PLV60 does not have MLA, but should be viewed at greater than 2:1.
I have not been able to find the viewing ratio in the Infocomm Shootout Technical Supplement.
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Ken Elliott
I'm convinced that the observability of screen door goes up with brightness.
At distance greater than 2:1 at 1000 lumens, I think its usually not objectionable for an LCD at 480p.
At 2600 lumens, its more obvious at 2:1 and objectionable for bright scenes. The MLA reduces this, but its still observable.
The PLV60 does not have MLA, but should be viewed at greater than 2:1.
I have not been able to find the viewing ratio in the Infocomm Shootout Technical Supplement.
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Ken Elliott
I'd have the same question about screendoor on the PLV60 vs the 10HT. I saw a 10HT on a 102" diagonal screen, viewing it at 11 feet and, while there was some screendoor, it was not really that obvious or objectionable to either me or my wife. Is the roughly 20% greater brightness of the Sanyo going to make the screendoor all that much worse, or does it have more than the Sony to begin with?
Dan
Dan
My guess from reading numerous posts on the screen door issue and viewing both the 10HT and the PLV-60 (albeit at different times) is that the screendoor is more noticeable on the PLV-60. And I agree with Ken. I think it may be attributable to the increased brightness of the PLV-60.
Quote:
On the flip side, the Sanyo XP-21N is even brighter, but reportedly has a reduced screen door effect.
| Originally posted by smitty: My guess from reading numerous posts on the screen door issue and viewing both the 10HT and the PLV-60 (albeit at different times) is that the screendoor is more noticeable on the PLV-60. And I agree with Ken. I think it may be attributable to the increased brightness of the PLV-60. |
Jonmx:
That would be as a result of Micro Lens Array (MLA) which the XP21N has and the PLV60 apparently does not. I have a concern about the technical staff at Sanyo. I spoke to them 3 weeks ago and asked them straight out if they have MLA on the PLV60 and after leaving me on hold for about ten minutes advised me it did. Looking at it, however, I do not believe it does.
That would be as a result of Micro Lens Array (MLA) which the XP21N has and the PLV60 apparently does not. I have a concern about the technical staff at Sanyo. I spoke to them 3 weeks ago and asked them straight out if they have MLA on the PLV60 and after leaving me on hold for about ten minutes advised me it did. Looking at it, however, I do not believe it does.
Quote:
MLA increases brightness....and that is it. ProjectorCentral hypothesized that MLA also helps the screen door effect, but offer no real evidence to support that claim. This has been repeated so many times people accept this as gospel.
| Originally posted by Knuck: Jonmx: That would be as a result of Micro Lens Array (MLA) which the XP21N has and the PLV60 apparently does not. I have a concern about the technical staff at Sanyo. I spoke to them 3 weeks ago and asked them straight out if they have MLA on the PLV60 and after leaving me on hold for about ten minutes advised me it did. Looking at it, however, I do not believe it does. |
I tend to agree with Ken's theory regarding the brighter the projector the increased the screen door effect.
On the other hand the XP21N is a lot brighter than the PLV-60 and there seems to be a lot more screen door discussion on PLV-60 as opposed to the XP21N. If we go with the greater the brightness the greater the screen door effect theory, then we should be hearing a lot more from the XP21N folks.
Unless the LCD panels have something to do with this then maybe MLA does reduce the screen door effect??
On the other hand the XP21N is a lot brighter than the PLV-60 and there seems to be a lot more screen door discussion on PLV-60 as opposed to the XP21N. If we go with the greater the brightness the greater the screen door effect theory, then we should be hearing a lot more from the XP21N folks.
Unless the LCD panels have something to do with this then maybe MLA does reduce the screen door effect??
When I demo'ed the XP21N, I got up close and played with the focus side by side with my NEC. IMO, the MLA helps screen door but the XP21N is bright enough to make it more noticeable.
The shape of the screen door of the PLV-60 is almost identical to my NEC.
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Ken Elliott
[This message has been edited by kelliot (edited 06-18-2001).]
The shape of the screen door of the PLV-60 is almost identical to my NEC.
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Ken Elliott
[This message has been edited by kelliot (edited 06-18-2001).]
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