[schris403]

I recently purchased a Sanyo XP21N projector and have been having some real problems with it... I originally made the decision to purchase this projector because of all the great reviews both on this board and in other places. I was going to check with a few other owners of this projector first to see if you are having the same problem before I decide to purchase a different projector possibly a D-ILA.


My equipment:

Stewart Grayhawk 16:9 120" v-lux screen

Sanyo XP21N LCD projector

Denon DVD-2800 progressive DVD player

Denon AVR-5800 THX receiver

RCA DC-100 satellite receiver


First off, it is giving me major pixilation when any object moves quickly across the screen. This is happens most of the time when a movie pans across a landscape for example. I am feeding a Composite video feed from my Denon DVD-2800 progressive DVD player straight into the projector without going through the receiver. It also happens from my RCA DTC-100 satellite receiver when fed directly from the HD port into the projector with a VGA cable. Is this a common problem with this projector?


Next, the screen-door effect is really noticeable with viewing of any source. I am 11 feet away from my Stewart Grayhawk screen and the only way to comfortably watch a movie from this distance is to defocus the image enough to take the screen-door effect away to watch the movie. Then the movie looks very blurry and takes some time to get used to.


Are any of these problems happening to anyone else or should I call Sanyo for service? Does anyone want to make a recommendation on how to fix these problems if these are typical of this projector? Any help would be greatly appreciated. I'm getting really frustrated with the quality this projector has given me.... I'm thinking of either a JVC D-ILA or the Sony VPL-VW10HT but would really like to get this one working if at all possible.


Thanks so much,

Chris

 

[jaron]

Why would you use Composite Output from a prgoressive DVD player. The Component Outs are leaps and bounds better. Try it, it may fix many of your problems.

 

[schris403]

sorry, I meant component out... Its a late night


Chris

 

[Jonmx]

I hate to say this, but your biggest problem is probably your screen size. A 120" is huge, especially at 11' away. I went with a 100" screen size and my closest viewing distance is at 12'. Absolutely no screen door and no defocusing. For a 120" screen, you should be atleast 15' away, and probably ideal at 18'.

 

[Grant Smyth]

Keep masking your screen size down until you reach a size you can live with. Your Denon DVD player may also exacerbate the screendoor problem. I would never have believed it if I hadn't seen it for myself, but my Panasonic RP91 shows annoying screendoor with my XGA DLP projector (my wife will attest to this), while my "over the hill" Toshiba 5109 is much better. My HTPC is liquid smooth from the same viewing distance. Borrow a different player and check it out!


A panamorph lens might help here (I think a masked down screen size + HTPC + panamorph will solve your problem - might seem a bit radical, but what an image you'll get!)


If none of this helps then a D-ILA might be a good choice. Being a DLP fanatic I would also check out the new Sharp DLP with the 16:9 chip and "rainbow" free colour wheel.


I had a thread on this forum awhile back called "Great Expectations" - take a look. IMO your screen is way too big and you're sitting way too close for a LCD projector!! Not the projector's fault!


Cheers,


Grant

 

[JHouse]

I think these guys have nailed your two biggest problems. Distance and source. Your sitting one screen width away. That's twice too close for any projector/source/source material I've ever seen. The fact that your DTC-100 through VGA is showing you artifacts is proof of this (assuming you have it and the projector set up right). It should look just about perfect most of the time. But even when you get back far enough you need to watch a couple of things real closely. First, if you are watching through the video input, knock the sharpness to zero. Also, I just got my Quadscan Elite working and the screen door and/or pixelization I had on video sources dissappeared (really, what I thought was screen door went totally away-now it looks like my old DLP in that you have to get withing a few feet of the screen to see the screen door/pixels). I'm still tweaking, but my son claims that the component interlaced output of the RP91 played through the Quadscan looks better than the progressive component output which goes straight to the projector. This makes be believe that the Quadscan Elite scaler is better than the projector's, but the jury is still out on that one. I've only had a couple of hours to look at it.


------------------

Joe

My current idea of the best value:

Boxlight 38t

Panasonic RP91

RCA DTC-100

Da-Lite 100" 4:3 1.3gain

Studio Experience SE616's

and some other stuff.

 

[schris403]

What settings are best for my Sanyo projector? Is there a service menu with this projector? If so how do I get into it and set it up? I haven't played much with the settings and I just ordered the Avia dvd but I'm pretty new with the whole setup thing about my projector.


Thank you so much for everyone's help, I'll look into getting masking immediately and possibly a quadscan if money permits.


Chris

 

[leckian]

Joe-

I am very confused about your statements regarding screen door. As far as I know the line structure around each pixel is a constant and never changes. I have never heard of any source material altering the fill ratio of any lcd projector. Please explain your reasoning how the screen door effect could possibly be affected by any source material.


thanks

lenny


[This message has been edited by leckian (edited 08-11-2001).]

 

[wvrich]

I can definitely attest to the fact that the source can make a difference as to screen door. When I added my Quadscan to the system, I immediately noticed a huge difference in apparent screen door. It may have to do with the fact that when scaled, the signal may have higher signal level per pixel (read fill factor) when divided by the XGA array. That is just a guess.


------------------

Through man's sweat and God's love, beer came into the world...


- Saint Arnoldus

 

[DanHouck]

Or it may just be that visual effects that look like screen door can also be created by other issues such as scaling, setting, etc.


Keep working on this. There isn't a projector made at this time that you just set up and run without a lot of fiddling. The Selecos and the Sony 10HT probably come closest to plug and play.


Let's keep the Sanyo resource thread going and share our tweaks and setups as we work on them. My projector just arrived and we're going to make a test run using the component outs of my old Toshiba 2109. I'll post first impressions in a day or so.


Dan

 

[Jonmx]

Quote:

Originally posted by DanHouck: The Selecos and the Sony 10HT probably come closest to plug and play.... Dan

I am not sure I would agree with that. The Sony 10HT has to be tweaked ALOT before it gets a stellar picture from what I have read on this and other forums. On the otherhand, my XP21N looked great out of the box and I am still using the factory defaults, but I may try some of Joe's recommendations later. Everybody who has seen it has been thoroughly impressed.

 

[JHouse]

Lenny, I know the theory you're subscribing to, and it makes sense. You should never have light projected where the grid lines are. BUT, maybe its the fancy MLA (micro lens array) that diffuses or spreads the pixel light a little before it hits the screen, thus causing the light beams to almost meet at the screen. It really can look just like a DLP with your nose up to the screen, even when focused.


Second, what I have recently been chasing as edge artifacts, screen door and pixelization have just gone away with the installation and set up of my Quadscan Elite. I now have two new progressive scan DVD players ( Panasonic RP91 and Toshiba 6200) which look 100% better when their INTERLACED COMPONENT output is video processed, deinterlaced and scaled by the QSE. No more pixels, artifacts, screen door, stairstepping, jaggies,... whatever. What a shock. I never suspected that the QSE was going to have superior processing to the direct component progressive output from a late model DVD player. However, that thing is a bear to set up right. Read/adjust/re-read/reset and re-adjust/re-re-read .....


I'm completely freakin'!


------------------

Joe

My current idea of the best value:

Boxlight 38t

Panasonic RP91

RCA DTC-100

Da-Lite 100" 4:3 1.3gain

Studio Experience SE616's

and some other stuff.

 

[DanHouck]

Yeah, Joe is pretty close with his settings though I found a little sharpness, +5, is more pleasing to us. However, I'll have to go through it again when I get a decent source.


You're right though, that puppy was pretty easy to set up, if even in a rough way. We watch Chocolat and just loved it!


Dan

 

[JHouse]

The Quadscan Elite cuts the allowable viewing distance almost in half. See my post on Dan's Resource Page.


------------------

Joe

My current idea of the best value:

Boxlight 38t

Quadscan Elite

Panasonic RP91

RCA DTC-100

Da-Lite 100" 4:3 1.3gain

Studio Experience SE616's

and some other stuff.

 

[schris403]

Ok, now that everyone has made their recomodations what would be the best setup for me to receive the best quality and minimize all the problems I've been having with the screen-door effect, pixelization, artifacts etc..? Lets say I have a pritty much unlimited budget to fix this problem with my current projector or should I just sell it and get a D-ILA? I've heard both good and bad things about them though and it makes me want to stick more with my Sanyo. Should I get a HTPC? A quadscan elite? panamorph? All three or should the HTPC eliminate most of that? I was going to use a ATI Radeon DDR 64mb card with a P3 833. Should that eliminate most of these problems or should a quadscan still do more?


Thanks so much!!


Chris

 

[David Guill]

Go with the Quadscan Elite. You won't be sorry.

 

[JHouse]

David, Where were you when I was begging for help?


------------------

Joe

My current idea of the best value:

Boxlight 38t

Quadscan Elite

Panasonic RP91

RCA DTC-100

Da-Lite 100" 4:3 1.3gain

Studio Experience SE616's

and some other stuff.

 

[leckian]

Joe-

Based on your experience would you say a good interlaced player and the quadscan is yielding the best results and a progressive scan player would yield an inferior picture when fed directly into the projector. If your answer is affirmative then this would reinforce the traditionalist approach to outstanding video.

Lenny

 

[JHouse]

Yup. I'm no expert, but I'm suspicious of the scaler in the projector. Even with what was probably a very good progressive(deinterlaced and 3:2'd) signal, the projector wasn't able to show it without artifacts. Since the projector was only using its scaler, that's where I'm laying the fault at this point, based upon this line of reasoning. So I'm thinking the projector makers could upgrade their scalers and make progressive component sources look about perfect and make home theater easier. Heck, they could even leave the video processor, deinterlacer, etc out, and just put in a fast scaler for a dedicated DVD presentation projector. Plus, anyone could use an I-Scan with such a projector for a first class, low budget set-up. Pass the word.


------------------

Joe

My current idea of the best value:

Boxlight 38t

Quadscan Elite

Panasonic RP91

RCA DTC-100

Da-Lite 100" 4:3 1.3gain

Studio Experience SE616's

and some other stuff.

 

[Dan G]

Joe-

I am so glad you got the QS Elite working well!

I have been telling anyone who will listen for months that a Quadscan should be factored into the basic price of this projector- fantastic improvement, isn't it?

I only have the Pro, but would love to check out an elite one of these days.

Wait till you see how good NTSC can be.


Along with what others have said about source & screen door, I have found power conditioning to reduce screen door as well- weird.