Second-hand Comcast HD DVRs??



Quote:
Originally Posted by doug_k /forum/post/16896595


They have a sticker on them saying property of comcast, etc. Could this guy have owned them? Would comcast allow me to use them, and would this save me any money? Can I sell them? They do go on ebay for $150 or so.

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They are the property of Comcast.


No.


No.


You can try to sell them... but as the sticker denotes, not your property.


Whatever you decide, it's your risk.



Quote:
Originally Posted by doug_k /forum/post/16897255


You're saying that comcast never sells their units, they only rent them?

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In the U.S., that is correct.

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I checked again and there's definitely a market for used comcast boxes.

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No... they sell boxes not owned by the seller(s). Yes there is a "market" for those that want to a) make a profit and b) try to get something for free.

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So people need them, and buy them,

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Yes, people would need them and buy them, but they don't know that 99.9% of the time, it won't work (for very long).

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..and --one would assume-- use them successfully.

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Probably a bad assumption. Lot's 'o posts here about buying boxes.

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Comcast would also be the first provider I've heard of that didn't have an option to buy or own the units.

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And again... in the U.S.... all providers ONLY rent/lease digital cable boxes. That's not just a "Comcast thing".


EDIT:

Hey... take the sticker off and sell them. You deal with the consequences (or your conscience).



Quote:
Originally Posted by doug_k /forum/post/16897255


Well, it's just a sticker. If the guy took an option to buy the units (?) then the sticker would be irrelevant. You're saying that comcast never sells their units, they only rent them?

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Correct.

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I checked again and there's definitely a market for used comcast boxes. So people need them, and buy them, and --one would assume-- use them successfully.

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Wrong.

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Comcast would also be the first provider I've heard of that didn't have an option to buy or own the units.

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Wrong.

What the ?!

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Originally Posted by Ken H /forum/post/16898099


Correct.

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Damn straight!

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Wrong.

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Are you disputing that there's a market for this, despite their being bought and sold continuously?

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Wrong.

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So this isn't the first provider I've heard of that won't sell boxes? I'm a little confused by your semantics.



Quote:
Originally Posted by doug_k /forum/post/16898260


Are you disputing that there's a market for this, despite their being bought and sold continuously?

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Whether you think there is some kind of market is irrelevant. Whether they are bought and sold is irrelevant.


Anyone who sells one of these is selling someone else's property and guilty of fraud by representing it as a working unit, which they are not.


Anyone who buys one of these is ignorant of these facts, otherwise, there is no reason to buy one.


Anyone who has one of these units not directly supplied and authorized by their cableco owns a doorstop, and nothing more.


They will not work on any US cable system. Ever. Period.

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So this isn't the first provider I've heard of that won't sell boxes? I'm a little confused by your semantics.

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Yes, you are confused.


No US cableco sells cable boxes. None.


No US cableco will activate a box they don't provide, unless it is CableCARD compatible, which I've already explained is none of the boxes you are referring to.



Quote:
Originally Posted by doug_k /forum/post/16898276


Also.... please disclose if you are employed in some way by the cable tv industry.

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No, I don't work in any capacity for a cable company.



Bolierplate:


AVS is not your garden variety Internet forum. We are the most popular home theater forum on the Internet, with well over 30 million unique page views per month. I have been the principal HDTV Moderator for over 8 years, and have over 20 years experence in the professional video business. AVS is referenced frequently by home theater magazines, other A/V & HT web sites, and the mainstream press. I have been contacted for comments on HDTV related articles by The New York Times, The Wall Street Journal, The Washington Post, The Los Angeles Times, slate.com, and many others. I also have been a contributing writer on both programming and technical issues for Digital TV & Sound Magazine. In addition to having direct participation by industry members ranging from local TV engineers to HD network owners on the forum, I also receive information on a regular basis about HD networks, multichannel providers, and program providers that I'm asked to pass along to the forum. This information comes from TV industry members, including those at the highest levels of the industry.



Quote:
Originally Posted by doug_k /forum/post/16898235


Maybe... as an actual owner of directv and dish boxes, maybe you can see where I'm coming from.

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No...

We are discussing "digital cable" boxes, not "satellite". You need to think outside of the box.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken H /forum/post/16898089


None of the existing Motorola, Scientific Atlanta, Pace cable boxes use CableCARD.

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All the manufacturers have now come out with CableCard-based models thanks to the FCC's separable encryption provisions. In fact, it's pretty difficult to obtain a box that isn't using a CableCard these days. Even the new Motorola boxes used with FiOS TV are using CableCards, and FiOS was initially exempt from the separable encryption provisions.



FWIW, back in the very first days of HD cable service, some US cable providers did sell boxes to customers who didn't want to rent. This practice didn't last very long, but there are a small number of people out there using 100% legal, authorized boxes that they own. Needless to say, none of these boxes have a "Property of Comcast" sticker on them . Those customers would also likely be unable to get the box activated by another provider despite the legal status.



Quote:
Originally Posted by doug_k /forum/post/16905060


After previous experiences over the years (time warner and cablevision) I hadn't considered cable until recently. The idea actually of having the box (or PC.. hmm) independent of the interface (cable card) is very appealing because I don't want the provider in a position to dictate price/features. But you're saying that cablecard gear is widely available? Does it succeed for that purpose?

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The widely available CableCARD equipment is the same hardware I referred to above; from the cableco only.


There are only two CableCARD units currently available now for retail purchase, the TiVo HD & Moxi. Here are topics for both:


TiVo HD http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=879469 (Be sure to read the first post.)


Moxi http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1095015




Also, you can build your own CableCARD PC: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=934453


More info is found in the HTPC forum: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/forumdisplay.php?f=26



The problem with current CableCARD units is they are soon (6 mths, 1 yr) to be superseded by the previously mentioned 'tru2way' units. In addition to everything a TiVo HD or Moxi does (receive all subscribed channels, interactive program guide, HD DVR, etc.), tru2way will add Pay-Per-View, On Demand, and any other interactive features the cablecos think up, none of which the current units do.


tru2way is the future for those who don't want to rent a cable box. But in all cases, the cableco will most definitely dictate pricing on programming.


Here is a link on tru2way: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=893485



Quote:
Originally Posted by doug_k /forum/post/17522321


This is an old thread, and I finally got conclusive clarification from Comcast on this issue.


You CAN buy/sell/use motorola DVRs used by comcast.

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Except, you know, Motorola won't sell them to you, Comcast won't sell them to you, and other US cablecos won't either. Even Canadian cable operators have ceased that. The only ones I've seen on sites like eBay can easily be seen to have operator stickers (I remember seeing a BHN unit, with their "this is property of BHN" sticker clearly visible in the photos). So outside of like, two SD-only models that haven't been sold in years and wouldn't interest anyone at the moment, where would you acquire such a unit?

Quote:
Originally Posted by doug_k /forum/post/17522321


These motorola DVRs aren't just used by comcast, and people DO own them. Therefore, there is a legitimate market for these units. Comcast does not sell DVRs, but they will allow you to use your own PROVIDED it is compatible and was not one of their units tagged as "stolen".

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Which, again, you would get from where? You can't buy an HD box legitimately as an individual. (And please don't say eBay.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by doug_k /forum/post/17522321


However, if you want to use a non-comcast unit on their network, the software needs to be changed and the tech wasn't sure that could be done over the network or if it needed to be done manually. It probably depends on how the update service discovery works on the network.

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Which is ridiculous, because the software doesn't live on the unit, they netboot. When you turn the box on, the first thing it does is try to find the headend and pull software - which if it's not authorized on their network, it won't because the boot servers will reject it.


I don't know who you were talking to, but I don't think it was actually someone who knows how this works.



Quote:
Except, you know, Motorola won't sell them to you, Comcast won't sell them to you, and other US cablecos won't either. Even Canadian cable operators have ceased that.

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Future shop and Best buy in Canada currently sell many types of cable boxes and PVR's.

http://www.futureshop.ca/search/sear...=EN&search=KWS

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When you turn the box on, the first thing it does is try to find the headend and pull software -

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...and it does this by running firmware that is installed on the cable box. this firmware may need to be updataed by your cable company.

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I don't know who you were talking to, but I don't think it was actually someone who knows how this works.

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Maybe he was talking to you

All that can be said is...


Buy it, try it. If it doesn't work or Comcast (or any US provider) won't activate... you were warned.