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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Little confused by operating instructions on 7uy while reading the manual in anticipation of my 50PHD7UY arrival.


Manual at: http://service.us.panasonic.com/OPER...TH37PWD7UY.PDF


Could someone explain the aspect controls (p. 19) further? For example, when watching a 2.35:1 DVD what aspect ratio do you use? And is there any concern with the bars on the top and bottom of the image regarding burn-in? Preferably I would want to display the image as the director intended and not blown up to fill the screen.


In the notes, the manual (p. 19) it says that for a 1125 (1080) /60i/50I/24p/25p/30p/24sF/1250 (1080) /50i/750 (720) /60p 50p signal input during Component, RGB, and DVI input signal, the mode is set to "Full" mode and switching is not possible.


What does this mean?



And all these warnings about burn-in? I thought Panasonic said this set had no more danger of burn-in than 4:3 CRT sets. Does Panasonic have these same warnings on its 4:3 sets. If so, I will feel more comfortable watching 4:3 without stretching the image. What do you think?
 

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For any dvd that is anamorphic, and is 1:78:1 or more (including 1:85:1, 2:35:1), use "full" mode. If you wanted to get rid of the black bars, or cut down on the amount of black bars for DVDs that is on you widescreen dvds, just use "zoom". That will force the tv to zoom on the image, cutting off part of the viewable image, but filling your screen.


IN regards to the different interlaced/progressive feeds....good question, I've no idea what that means. :D I've never played a DVD that I can't change the aspect ratio. However, be aware that if you watch a non-anamorphic DVD player, you'll most likely have to watch it on "zoom" in order for it to keep it's proper image size, otherwise it will appear distorted.


CRT sets can also burn-in if treated improperly. Deanne has, on purpose, burned in her own CRT and posted the images on her blog. On that note, it's most likely still a safe and best practice to watch feed that fills your screen for the first 150-300 hours.


I've watched 5-6 hour movie marathons at 2:35 OAR, and I've never had an issue with any sort of image retention or burn in. I can only imagine it'd be the same if I watched 4:3 non scaled to fit the screen. My wife and I tend to watch any SD feed in the "just" mode, we find it not as distracting as we had originally feared. :D


I hope this helps!


-JR
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by JuiceRocket



However, be aware that if you watch a non-anamorphic DVD player, you'll most likely have to watch it on "zoom" in order for it to keep it's proper image size, otherwise it will appear distorted.

JuiceRocket, you surely mean non-anamorphic DVD, not DVD player.


Many, if not most movies on DVDs are NOT anamorphic.


Does that mean that I will have to zoom them on TH-50PHD7UY???


That's would be a major downer.


Zoom mode is not good for PQ.
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by wojtek
Many, if not most movies on DVDs are NOT anamorphic.


Does that mean that I will have to zoom them on TH-50PHD7UY???
I would disagree with that... I've been using the 16:9 enhanced mode on my Sony 4:3 Wega CRT for a couple years, and I find that most widescreen DVDs are anamorphic. I have maybe one or two discs that are non-anamorphic widescreen. Just take a look at the backs of your DVD cases. They will basically all say something like "enhanced for widescreen TVs".
 

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Whoops, I did mean DVD, not DVD player. But, most movies are anamorphic, in fact, out of the 100+ dvds I own, I can only think of two that are not. I don't believe studios release non-amorphic DVDs anymore.


On a non-anamorphic dvd, yes, you'd have to zoom to make the image appear "normal". On an anamorphic, you'd be fine. :) For more info, along with some pictures that help display the differences, check out Digital Bits website .


Courtesy of TheDigitalBits.com, below are two images they display showing what your 16:9 tv will show. Non-anamorphic with the gray bars (unless you use your ZOOM function, which will crop out some of the image info), or anamorphic with no bars (full bleed due to slight overscan).


The ZOOM is a fake zoom I created, but you get the idea of how it cuts off info, such as the top of his head, and the people in the background. I don't think I zoomed the image as much as a Panny does (I don't know how much it zooms), but I figured this would give you a good visual idea.


-JR

NON-ANAMORPHIC
http://www.thedigitalbits.com/articl...516x9tvlbx.jpg


ANAMORPHIC
http://www.thedigitalbits.com/articl...16x9tv16x9.jpg


ZOOM

http://www.skullface.com/zoomn.jpg
 

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Some DVD players can do this themselves, and the main advantage to that is being able to view the subtitles. Using the TV ZOOM mode cuts them off, and a lot of foreign films are non-anamorphic.. My Toshiba 3800 can, the Panasonic S27/S47 do but it looks awful.. I tried a Samsung 841 and it does it wonderfully, but there are other serious issues with that player.

I think the Zenith 318 can do this too and maybe JVC.?

Denon's wont do it at all.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Quote:
Originally posted by JuiceRocket
For any dvd that is anamorphic, and is 1:78:1 or more (including 1:85:1, 2:35:1), use "full" mode. If you wanted to get rid of the black bars, or cut down on the amount of black bars for DVDs that is on you widescreen dvds, just use "zoom". That will force the tv to zoom on the image, cutting off part of the viewable image, but filling your screen.


IN regards to the different interlaced/progressive feeds....good question, I've no idea what that means. :D I've never played a DVD that I can't change the aspect ratio. However, be aware that if you watch a non-anamorphic DVD player, you'll most likely have to watch it on "zoom" in order for it to keep it's proper image size, otherwise it will appear distorted.


CRT sets can also burn-in if treated improperly. Deanne has, on purpose, burned in her own CRT and posted the images on her blog. On that note, it's most likely still a safe and best practice to watch feed that fills your screen for the first 150-300 hours.


I've watched 5-6 hour movie marathons at 2:35 OAR, and I've never had an issue with any sort of image retention or burn in. I can only imagine it'd be the same if I watched 4:3 non scaled to fit the screen. My wife and I tend to watch any SD feed in the "just" mode, we find it not as distracting as we had originally feared. :D


I hope this helps!


-JR
Appreciate reply. The manual states that the full mode display the picture at its maximum size but with slight elongation. I prefer to have the picture with no artificial adjustments. Which aspect ratio/mode should I use? Thanks.
 

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>>>In the notes, the manual (p. 19) it says that for a 1125 (1080) /60i/50I/24p/25p/30p/24sF/1250 (1080) /50i/750 (720) /60p 50p signal input during Component, RGB, and DVI input signal, the mode is set to "Full" mode and switching is not possible.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
You mean I am forced to watch the images with a slight elongation (full mode does this according to manual)? I can not watch a 2:35 to 1 aspect ratio movie in 2:35 to 1 as intended by the director?
 

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No.


On the remote is a button labeled PIC POS/SIZE. This area allows you to move the picture as well as change its height/width. You will be able to decrease the overscan so that 2.35:1 really is 2.35:1 on the 1.78:1 screen.


I don't like black bars. Because of this, I have my 50" 6UY set up as if it were a 1.85:1 screen. By this I mean that I have set up the display by using these controls (POS PIC/SIZE) with 1.85:1 DVD images so that the top, bottom and sides of a 1.85:1 DVD fits almost perfect. The reason I say "almost" perfect is because I overscan 2 pixels each on the top, bottom and sides to accommodate those DVDs which are not using the full bandwidth of the format. If you don't do this, some discs will show a wavering line or two on the side(s) and/or top and/or bottom. I hate wavering lines.


The 16x9 format is asinine and should not have been chosen. It was decided on as a compromise to appease the 4x3 (1.33:1) crowd and that's what it is -- a compromised format. When you go to the theater, the movie will be shown in 1.85:1 or 2.xx:1. If "widescreen" really was a HomeTheater decision, they should have chosen one of these (1.85:1 making more sense). If they would have chosen 1.85:1, we would only have 3 formats (1.33:1, 1.85:1 -- hey, a perfect match -- and 2.xx:1) to display. With 16x9, we have 4 formats to deal with!
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by JuiceRocket



CRT sets can also burn-in if treated improperly. Deanne has, on purpose, burned in her own CRT and posted the images on her blog. On that note, it's most likely still a safe and best practice to watch feed that fills your screen for the first 150-300 hours.



-JR
Just came across this thread- yeah- it was 'on purpose' - I'll go with that :D.


(psss.... it was actually an accident (though written kind of tounge-in-cheek) but don't tell anybody- I just wasn't paying attention). I have to replace it because I can't use it as a video proof TV anymore. Actually- I just might keep it around to see what stuff looks like on torch mode.


Which won't happen with the plasma 'cause I know right away if I've reset it to torch mode by accident (which I have). And I wouldn't leave color bars on them for an extended period of time also.
 

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Joe Murphy Jr-


I have a Panny 50PHD6UY and I've read some of your other posts regarding overscan adjustments. Here's what I still don't understand: How can one be sure that the geometry is still correct after making these adjustments, especially since the display does not even have any numbers on the scale for this interface. Is there a way to make the display increase/decrease horizontal and vertical size in tandem without distorting the geometry?
 

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All of the below refers to 1.85:1 aspect ratio DVDs.


The adjustments via PIC POS/SIZE doesn't ensure proper geometry. In order for no distortion to take place, you will have to figure out how much overscan is occurring and the proper ratio of width to height adjustments.


What I do is keep the vertical dimension correct and slightly squeeze the horizontal dimension (not quite accurate). For "correctness", you need to know how many pixels you need to chop off from the vertical for each pixel that you decrease in the horizontal plane.


Here's a quick 'n dirty calculation method. The dirty part is that all DVDs are not encoded with the same number of vertical pixels and even the ones that are may be shifted a few pixels up or down compared to another DVD -- sad, but true. Because of this, you will need some overscan to avoid missing picture information somewhere on the edges of the image. If the FULL mode stretches in each direction equally, count how many times (is it 1 pixel or 2 pixels per change?) you have to decrease the horizontal width to just fill the screen. For every 16 pixels of decrease in horizontal width, decrease the vertical height by 9 pixels. Your second pass may have to be 4 pixels to 2 (or 3). One dimension will get "inside" the last section of pixels before the other: you can tweak it from there.
 

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Thanks, Joe, but I'm not gonna go there. I wish there were an easy AND accurate way to do this since I know I'm missing a good portion of the picture on the right and left sides (can see this by moving the horizontal position) but I really don't want to mess with the geometry.
 

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Do you want to eliminate the overscan, but live with bars for 1.85:1, 2.35:1, etc? All 1.78:1 material will fit perfect on your display, but all other aspect ratios will have black bars.


If this is the case, there is an easy and accurate way. There is a test pattern in Digital Video Essentials that will show you where a 16x9 (1.78:1) picture ends. In the test pattern, you'll also find ending points for other formats as well. It is located in Title 12 Chapter 19.
 

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Thanks, Joe. I don't mind the black bars- just want to eliminate the overscan, for 2.35:1, etc. For instance I have a HD TiVo recording from DirecTV of "The Rainmaker" with the black horizontal bars. I don't mind the bars, but there is considerable overscan on both sides. I don't have DVE, but I do have Avia. Perhaps I can find a Avia tool that I can use, but not sure how I would translate the settings from the DVD input to the HDTiVo input.
 

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For the HDTivo, I would record or watch a program that you can verify was actually produced and is being broadcast in 16x9 (1.78:1). This (verification) may not be all that easy to do, but it will give you the results you are looking for. Just decrease the vertical and horizontal size until you reach the border of the image content. You may end up shifting the image up/down and/or right/left to be sure you're getting every pixel of the image to show on the screen. When the verified 16x9 (1.78:1) HDTivo image fits the screen perfectly, all other aspect ratios that you watch or record with the HDTivo will be correct as well.
 

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Joe- That makes sense. What types of programming might be a good bet to be true 16x9 (1.78:1)? How about a local HD news program, or maybe something like "The Tonight Show"?
 

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I believe The Tonight Show is shot with true Hi-Def cameras in the 16x9 format. You might want to verify that information, but I'm pretty sure that's what you'll find. Make it fit and you should be good to go.
 
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