[SteveGa]

Hi guys,


I am very new to the HDTV game and have started to read the huge amount of information on upconverting DVD players that is on this site. However, my search did not reveal the answers that I am looking for. I'm sure this info is somewhere on this site, but figured someone will be able to chime in quickly with a response.



I recently bought a Sony SXRD (KDS-50A2000) and now want an upconverting DVD player. But, nobody at any electronics stores here seem to know the following:


1) With the advent of the 1080P upconverting players, will I be able to discern a noticeable difference if I bought a 1080P vs a 1080i upconverting DVD player? The choices would be the Samsung DVD-HD960 or the Oppo DV-981 for the 1080P, or a simple Sony NC75 (I think) for the 1080i.



2) Since my TV can display in 1080P, will the TV itself "upconvert" a 1080i signal to 1080P? If I buy a 1080i upconverting DVD player and feed the TV that signal, would I be able to view a 1080P picture via the TV's own upconverter (if it even has one)??

 

[rare-air]

I have a KDS55A2000 and had a regular non progressive DVD player and the the SXRD displayed the output nicely at 1080p. In fact all content will be upscaled to 1080p no matter what it is being input.


The SXRD has a nice upscaling function. The issue is which will be better the one on the DVD player or the TV. You could spend a $1500 on a Denon and get world class upscaling but even that may only be a slight improvement as there is only so much info on a SD-DVD.


I choose to get a Toshiba A1 HD-DVD player which can display HD DVD at the native resolution and look awesome and also upscales SD DVD very nicely. An HD-A2 from toshiba can be found for $400 which is only $100-150 more than an Oppo.


It just makes no sense to me to purchase an Oppo at $250+- to only display SDDVD's even if they are upscaled. The Toshiba is a better upscaler and will display the new format HD-DVD's and it is only $400-499


-Craig

 

[SteveGa]

rare-air,


Thanks for the response. So, if I understand, no matter what is being fed into the SXRD (720p, 1080i) it will automatically upconvert the signal to 1080P?


I haven't received the TV yet, as it was on backorder here...but I am trying to complete my setup prior to it arriving so that I can really enjoy it. Haven't been able to really get aquainted with it, and see what it really does.


One more question: Right now I have a PS2 as my DVD player, so assuming the 50A2000 will convert to the 1080P format, would I still be better off spending $100 on the Sony upconverting 1080i to receive a more crisp signal (via HDMI) than what the PS2 offers? Would the difference in picture quality justify the expense?

 

[rare-air]

Yes on your first point everything will be scaled/deinterlaced to 1080p. Unless the Ps2 is a really bad dvd player I would save my $100 and save for a HD-DVD player. You are really paying $100 to find out how much better a cheap $100 dvd player is at scaling on your 2,000 TV. IMO not very likely. Now the PS2 might be a really poor DVD player noisy etc.


Only until you get a HD or BluRay will exploit your capability on your set. To me it is a waste of money to purchase a cheap upscaling DVD player which will likely not give any better results.


I purchased my A1 as an upscaler and it is hard for me to tell that it is any better than the SXRD with my old DVD player.


What I can tell you is that animation SD DVD (eg. Over the Hedge) look so close to HD that I could barely tell the difference, even through my old 480i DVD player. Regular SD movies looked a little blurry like maybe your prescription was not spot on. Still they look pretty good and maybe only a little bit better even on my Toshiba HD A1 upscaler.


-Craig

 

[weasel4]

We purchased our parents a Sony KDF- 50E2000 720p HDTV for Christmas, There was some left over money so now we are looking to add a Sony DVD-VCR combo. The choices are :



DVD/VCR Progressive Scan Combo Player

SLV-D370P





DVD/VCR HDMI Combo Player

SLV-D570H


The question is with the 2nd model which costs $50 more will the upscaling

be noticible and give them an hd quality picture on their HDTV?


Thank You

 

[ehlarson]



Quote:
Originally Posted by weasel4 /forum/post/0



The question is with the 2nd model which costs $50 more will the upscaling

be noticible and give them an hd quality picture on their HDTV?


Thank You

Well, maybe it will be noticeable. It's hard to say what someone considers to be noticeable. There are a couple of things you should be aware of though -


1. No conventional DVD player will give you a real HD quality picture. You need HD-DVD or Blu-Ray for that. However it will look pretty good if the DVD itself is a good transfer.

2. VCR will look terrible on a HDTV. It's bad enough on an ordinary TV. HDTV will show every flaw.

 

[Quank]

Personally, I'd go with the Oppo 970 because your new TV will likely have great upscalling abilities built-in. The Oppo 970 is one of the few DVD players out there that will output a PURE 480i signal over the HDMI connection. That will give your Sony the best signal to do its magic. If, for some reason, you don't think the Sony has as good of upscaling as some DVD players, the Oppo is one of the highest ranked upscalers, so you could use the HDMI output to kick out 1080i if you'd like. Oppo also has money back returns within 30 days if you change your mind. (Possibly to get the Oppo 981 which does 1080p).


At $150, the Oppo has a few advantages over a HD-DVD player IMO:

1) It'll do a better job with standard DVDs than most HD-DVD players out there from what I've read on this site.

2) It is about $400 cheaper than HD-DVD players.

3) HD DVD will only play HD DVD and standard DVDs, they won't play Blu-Ray DVDs. Most of us want to wait until cheaper HD universal players come out or the format wars settle down.

4) If you buy a HD DVD player now, you're getting 1st or 2nd generation technology in HD. $30 DVD players at Target do a better job than my 2nd generation Sony DVD player from 1999.

5) The Oppo is Region Free so you can play DVDs from all over.

6) The Oppo plays PAL and NTSC formats

7) Plays DVD-Audio and SACD.


I'm biased, I have a Oppo 970 on order, but it was only after reading this forum for a few weeks that I decided on it. Your TV is also in my basket at Amazon, but I can't afford it yet!

 

[weasel4]

I know upscaling to 1080p is not 1080p like a HD-DVD or BLU-RAY so what is it and for that matter what is upscaling to 720p or 1080i? I have a pioneer dv 333 dvd player with hdmi connections to my Sony 50"SXRD and the picture looks almost like HD . Another question? is there a difdference between HD-DVD and an HD broadcast ?

 

[wmcclain]



Quote:
Originally Posted by weasel4 /forum/post/0


I know upscaling to 1080p is not 1080p like a HD-DVD or BLU-RAY so what is it and for that matter what is upscaling to 720p or 1080i? I have a pioneer dv 333 dvd player with hdmi connections to my Sony 50"SXRD and the picture looks almost like HD . Another question? is there a difdference between HD-DVD and an HD broadcast ?

SD-DVD is recorded at 480i (NTSC). You've got 480x720 pixels, never any more. You want to display this on an HD display, say 1080x1920, you have to scale the image and manufacture new pixels from somewhere.


There are different ways of doing this. With a well-mastered disk, good upscaling can produce very impressive images, on the order of "I can't believe there are only 480 vertical pixels there." But side-by-side with a real HD source, you would see the difference.


We're trying to squeeze as much video quality out the DVDs as we can. Scaling must occur somewhere: is it best to do it in the player or in the display? Opinions vary.


I have been pleased with my Oppo 971 and 981 players in this regard. I haven't had a chance to try the 970, but it is often prefered by plasma and DLP owners.


HD-DVD/Blu-Ray should be roughly eqivalent to a good HD broadcast, better than cable or satellite which often suffer from too much compression.


-Bill

 

[acteon]

"Another question? is there a difdference between HD-DVD and an HD broadcast ?"


Yes. No more pixelation(sp?) from low bit rates due to sub channels, etc.,

 

[rare-air]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Quank /forum/post/0


At $150, the Oppo has a few advantages over a HD-DVD player IMO:

1) It'll do a better job with standard DVDs than most HD-DVD players out there from what I've read on this site.

2) It is about $400 cheaper than HD-DVD players.

3) HD DVD will only play HD DVD and standard DVDs, they won't play Blu-Ray DVDs. Most of us want to wait until cheaper HD universal players come out or the format wars settle down.

4) If you buy a HD DVD player now, you're getting 1st or 2nd generation technology in HD. $30 DVD players at Target do a better job than my 2nd generation Sony DVD player from 1999.

5) The Oppo is Region Free so you can play DVDs from all over.

6) The Oppo plays PAL and NTSC formats

7) Plays DVD-Audio and SACD.

Not disagreeing with your choices but just giving some refinement to your points.


1.) In my experience and in every other thread I have read says the HD-DVD player is better than many if not most upscaling DVD players. Everything I have read is that it is equal to or better than the oppo players. But I have not directly compared so I can only judge by all I have read.


2.) I purchased my A1 at BB for $250 but A2's can be purchased new for $400 so $150 more by my math. I was at BB a few days ago and they had an XA1 for $299


3.) An Oppo will not play HDDVD or BluRay so the A1/A2 has one up on the Oppo.


4.) I highly doubt a $30 N'th generation DVD player at walmart is going to be better than the Toshiba in anything except price.


5.) The HD A1/A2 is region free but my understanding is not BluRay BluRay guys can correct me if I am wrong on that point.


6.) Toshiba does sell E1/E2 in europe so they must be PAL compatible but they have different models.


7.) The Oppo has the Toshiba here as it will not play DVD-Audio or SACD. Don't have any of these so its not a problem for me.


-Craig

 

[wmcclain]



Quote:
Originally Posted by rare-air /forum/post/0


1.) In my experience and in every other thread I have read says the HD-DVD player is better than many if not most upscaling DVD players. Everything I have read is that it is equal to or better than the oppo players.

I've seen comments from people who like the Oppo better, but also many trustworthy comments from people who say the Toshiba sd-dvd playback is very good. The first Samsung Blu-Ray got poor reviews in this regard. I haven't kept up with other models.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rare-air /forum/post/0


5.) The HD A1/A2 is region free but my understanding is not BluRay BluRay guys can correct me if I am wrong on that point.

I have not kept up with the game consoles and HTPCs, but I believe that no HD-DVD or Blu-Ray player sold in North America will play any sd-dvd other than NTSC region 1. No PAL, no other regions.


-Bill

 

[Bobcel]

I own an Oppo 970HD and currently am using it with My Samsung 7178 1080p. For a upscaling universal player ( and ridiculous price ) it is outstanding, nothing I have thrown at it, it won't play. Tech support is phenomenal. I output at 780i and the TV does an excellent job with the rest. Personally I am waiting for the HD wars to settle / pricing to drop and technology to improve.... yes I am chomping at the bit for an HD Player as nothing will look that good with my display.... but the Oppo looks pretty darn impressive.... IMHO

 

[A96Honda]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobcel /forum/post/0


I own an Oppo 970HD and currently am using it with My Samsung 7178 1080p. For a upscaling universal player ( and ridiculous price ) it is outstanding, nothing I have thrown at it, it won't play. Tech support is phenomenal. I output at 780i and the TV does an excellent job with the rest. Personally I am waiting for the HD wars to settle / pricing to drop and technology to improve.... yes I am chomping at the bit for an HD Player as nothing will look that good with my display.... but the Oppo looks pretty darn impressive.... IMHO

if you dont mind me asking. what was the reason for you to test out Oppo's tech support?

 

[Bobcel]



Quote:
if you dont mind me asking. what was the reason for you to test out Oppo's tech support?

I had purchased a SACD, "Tony Bennett & Friends" and the Oppo just would not play it. I emailed them about it and they came back (within a half an hour) with setting suggestions and ultimately said there were a few SACD's in the field that seem problematic. I told them I was going to return it and try a new one. They were very interested to see if this corrected the problem, and asked me to please give them an update. They seem to be very customer oriented and eager to correct any problems their customer base are experiencing. Never did get that puppy to play though.....


Once again... I am very pleased with the Oppo.

 

[Harrypt]



Quote:
Originally Posted by wmcclain /forum/post/0


SD-DVD is recorded at 480i (NTSC). You've got 480x720 pixels, never any more. You want to display this on an HD display, say 1080x1920, you have to scale the image and manufacture new pixels from somewhere.


There are different ways of doing this. With a well-mastered disk, good upscaling can produce very impressive images, on the order of "I can't believe there are only 480 vertical pixels there." But side-by-side with a real HD source, you would see the difference.


We're trying to squeeze as much video quality out the DVDs as we can. Scaling must occur somewhere: is it best to do it in the player or in the display? Opinions vary.


I have been pleased with my Oppo 971 and 981 players in this regard. I haven't had a chance to try the 970, but it is often prefered by plasma and DLP owners.


HD-DVD/Blu-Ray should be roughly eqivalent to a good HD broadcast, better than cable or satellite which often suffer from too much compression.


-Bill

Very well said! The misunderstanding about upconversion and dvd players makes me nuts. The marketers have done a masterful job selling this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wmcclain /forum/post/0


We're trying to squeeze as much video quality out the DVDs as we can. Scaling must occur somewhere: is it best to do it in the player or in the display? Opinions vary.

Yes, opinions vary but I also think that some tv's have better deinterlacers and scalers than others. The question is does your tv or your dvd player do a better job at each of these tasks.


Right now I have both the Oppo 970 and 971 beneath my Panasonic plasma. The 970, to my eyes, is best at 480P. This means that it deinterlaces better than the Panny but the Panny upscales better. When I upscale with the 970 I see a lot of digital garbage.


The 971, again to my eyes, looks best at 720P. Seems it deinterlaces and upscales better than the Panny.


The problem is that these decisions change based on individual components. The Pioneer panels have the Faroudja processing onboard so on that, the 970 might be just as good as the 971 when fed 480i. On a budget panel, the 970 might be better in every regard. Therefore only YOU can make the decisions based on your unique setup. The best thing to do is educate yourself on the nuts and bolts of how this works rather than the "which is better component a or component b" questions.


Therefore it is difficult if not impossible to make a fully educated purchase decision until you have your panel and can try these things out for yourself.