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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I am in the market for a new receiver. I am considering Denon 4310, Pioneer SC25 or the Onkyo 3007. I will have a blu ray player, Dish Network HD receiver, and Dish Network HD OTA dvr connected. Presently, as components are connected directly to LCD tv via HDMI cables, with optical & coax connections to Pioneer 45 TX receiver for sound.


Which of my choices have the simplest auto setup?

Which setup is more accurate Pioneer's or Denon?

Will I "miss" not having the "wide/height" capability if I choose Pioneer?

Will I have to "assign" each input to the component being used?

Which will allow the components to pass the HDMI signal to the tv even though the receiver is not being used?

By connecting everything through the receiver, will the picture quality be degraded?

When choosing a receiver, will I need one to upconvert everything to 1080P?

Do all of these receivers have the on screen display - volume, input, etc?
 

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1) For simplicity of auto-setup, Pioneer wins over Denon and Onkyo, although BatPig's Denon-to-English Dictionary is a great help, as are, these forums for setting up the other two as well.


2) Pioneer's MCACC and Denon's Audyssey, both have their fans. It would be difficult to compare the two.


3) If you've never heard it, you won't miss it. This is a matter of personal choice, however.


4) Could not understand your question clearly. Setting up inputs is a one-time job.


5) Denon is the best when it comes to HDMI Pass Through. Pioneer's HDMI Pass Through only works with KURO-LINK enabled displays (usually Pioneer KURO Plasmas). If you wish to watch TV without switching on the receiver, you could simply run an HDMI cable from the cable box directly to the TV, bypassing the AVR, and connect optical/coaxial from the cable box to the AVR for surround sound. (You then need to switch on the AVR, only when you wish to hear TV sound through your speakers).


6) Usually, HDMI video is left untouched, without any alterations, in most receivers.


7) Your blu-ray player will, anyways, output video signal at 1080p. Regarding the other devices, you can choose where you want your upscaling to be done, either the receiver or the LCD itself. Usually, upscaling is best left to the display itself, although you can check which device upscales better and leave it at that.


Hope I've answered your questions satisfactorily, and correctly (to the best of my knowledge, they are correct, but I'm only human.)
 

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Speaking for the Denon AVRs only:

Quote:
Originally Posted by bnewt /forum/post/18165690


Will I "miss" not having the "wide/height" capability if I choose Pioneer?

Read through the 4310/4810 threads on this particular subject for likes/dislikes. Some have said the dialogue getting sent to the wide's on some tracks is somewhat artificial as dialogue is more natural from the center.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bnewt /forum/post/18165690


Will I have to "assign" each input to the component being used?

If you choose to use the mfr defaults/connections then no additional assigning is required, however, if you choose to make other connections, then of course yes, you would have to assign a specific HDMI/digital jack to a specific source name. Analog audio jacks are not assignable however and must be used as labeled.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bnewt /forum/post/18165690


Which will allow the components to pass the HDMI signal to the tv even though the receiver is not being used?

The Denon offers HDMI Standby for either the LAST source selected or a specific HDMI jack can be selected to be used regardless of what the last source used when the AVR is put into Standby. Although the work around that Zerv suggested (direct connection to TV w/optical to AVR) is generally better as it avoids any HDMI handshake issues that are very common with sat/cable boxes using HDMI directly to the AVR.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bnewt /forum/post/18165690


By connecting everything through the receiver, will the picture quality be degraded?

The i/p Scaler setting can be set to OFF on those HDMI sources that are already upscaled to 1080p or those sources you don't want to be upscaled to 1080p (rather letting LCD do the upscaling).

Quote:
Originally Posted by bnewt /forum/post/18165690


Do all of these receivers have the on screen display - volume, input, etc?

All Denon AVRs beginning with the 2310 offer a GUI that will display volume, input, menu, etc.



Why are you in the market for a new AVR? Another option rather than replacing the AVR would be to replace your BD player with a new HDMI 1.4 BDP that also offers multi-channel analog outputs to pass the HD audio on BD's to your current Pio AVR. That way you'll be set if you decide to upgrade to a newer 3D HDTV.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
I understand the work around of connecting directly to the tv & using optical connections, but that does not allow me to have the new sound formats. That is the major reason to upgrade my receiver.


I don't really understand this comment:


"The Denon offers HDMI Standby for either the LAST source selected or a specific HDMI jack can be selected to be used regardless of what the last source used when the AVR is put into Standby."


What I want to be able to accomplish is to be able to watch the satellite or the blu ray without having to turn on the receiver. I guess that I could purchase one of those hdmi splitters to split the blu ray to the tv & the avr.
 

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If you want the new sound formats from blu-ray, you'll have to switch on the receiver, anyways.


The workaround I suggested, was for watching TV without using the receiver (since even HD channels only have 5.1 Dolby surround, which is capable of being carried by optical/coaxial). For blu-ray, I'm sure you would want to turn on the receiver and use your connected speakers instead of crappy LCD speakers.


However, if you still want the HDMI Pass Through, even for blu-ray, I would suggest the Denon among the ones you suggested. Pioneer's Pass Through will not work unless you have a KURO.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by bnewt /forum/post/18166504


I understand the work around of connecting directly to the tv & using optical connections, but that does not allow me to have the new sound formats. That is the major reason to upgrade my receiver.


I don't really understand this comment:


"The Denon offers HDMI Standby for either the LAST source selected or a specific HDMI jack can be selected to be used regardless of what the last source used when the AVR is put into Standby."


What I want to be able to accomplish is to be able to watch the satellite or the blu ray without having to turn on the receiver. I guess that I could purchase one of those hdmi splitters to split the blu ray to the tv & the avr.

Your current Pio AVR has multi-channel analog inputs. If your current (or new) BDP also has multi-channel analog outputs, then you would NOT require a new AVR as you would simply pass the HD audio over the analog cables directly to the Pio AVR which would allow you to play the HD audio tracks on BDs.


Re: HDMI Standby ... the Denon will allow passing through a single HDMI source, either the LAST one that was used or a particular one that you select in advance, but as the Highlander would say ... "THERE CAN BE ONLY ONE". You could run the sat and blu-ray HDMI into a splitter and then to the AVR as one option. Another would be to use Sat --->HDMI--> TV w/optical to AVR workaround as suggested with the Blu-Ray using the AVR's HDMI Standby mode.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by zervinb /forum/post/18166540


Pioneer's Pass Through will not work unless you have a KURO.

I believe the video pass-through works from any HDMI source to any HDMI monitor.


shane
 

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I have to tell you, at the price level you are shopping at, NONE of those units would be considered "simple" to set up. Those are all powerful, high-end units with enough features and options to make you dizzy. I really wouldn't use that as a factor in your decision.


The Denon gets a bad rap because of the bizarro Denon-ese translation which makes the documentation somewhat obtuse, but every single one of your options is going to have a STEEP learning curve if you are not familiar with modern HDMI receivers. They all have assignable inputs, a multiple of sound processing and video scaling options, networking, etc. Not a one of those three could be considered "simple" -- talk to any high-end Onkyo owner about all the options available with THX modes and how they relate to Audyssey processing, not to mention all of those extra speaker terminals....


Not trying to scare you
but at the ~$1000+ price point basically every receiver sold these days would be considered dauntingly complex for someone who isn't familiar with the modern lingo and options. Once you ascend the learning curve and get the hang of it, they will all become increasingly easy to use and you will appreciate the power and flexibility that all that complexity provides.
 

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As many will tell you, go listen and see if you find any difference. I know I could not really tell any difference when I was in the market a few years back, but maybe you can and it could help you make a decision.


Having said that, now that you have batpig's ear--I would recommend a Denon as his tutorial, plus his "willingness to help--without attitude" makes the complexities of these AVR's easier to handle. In your price range, you will be satisfied with any of the receivers you choose. Happy hunting.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig /forum/post/18168050


I have to tell you, at the price level you are shopping at, NONE of those units would be considered "simple" to set up. Those are all powerful, high-end units with enough features and options to make you dizzy. I really wouldn't use that as a factor in your decision.


The Denon gets a bad rap because of the bizarro Denon-ese translation which makes the documentation somewhat obtuse, but every single one of your options is going to have a STEEP learning curve if you are not familiar with modern HDMI receivers. They all have assignable inputs, a multiple of sound processing and video scaling options, networking, etc. Not a one of those three could be considered "simple" -- talk to any high-end Onkyo owner about all the options available with THX modes and how they relate to Audyssey processing, not to mention all of those extra speaker terminals....


Not trying to scare you
but at the ~$1000+ price point basically every receiver sold these days would be considered dauntingly complex for someone who isn't familiar with the modern lingo and options. Once you ascend the learning curve and get the hang of it, they will all become increasingly easy to use and you will appreciate the power and flexibility that all that complexity provides.


What would be the most difficult thing in setting up these receivers? Is it running the auto setup? Isn't it basically the same as the Pioneer that I have now? Or is it the setup of the video portion? I know that it is not just "plug" and "play" like a computer, but surely you don't have to have a phd.......
 

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No you don't need a Phd, its just in most cases the manuals and remotes that come with these AVR's are for the most part useless. Get one you like, has all the connections you want and if you have set-up problems come back and ask your questions. Someone here will be able to help you.
 
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