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Discussion Starter #1
I've got a 27" Wega now and will be getting a new set. My eyes are demanding it. I need to sit on the edge of the seat to read my guide. So, I need a larger TV.


Like I said before, I'm looking to get a 30" 16:9. Is that the right target size though? I will be gaining a few inches horizontally, but losing an inch vertically. Will a 30" widescreen provide the increase in screen content size I need?


I took an overall width measurement of the Panny 34" and at alomst 40" across, that is a big TV. Too big for my current set up. My stand will also have to come away from the wall at least 6 more inches. My Yamaha RXV-2200 Receiver will have to find a new home because it is too tall to fit on the shelves, thus it sits next to the current TV. All this means well will be plunking down another $150 - $200 on a stand AGAIN!


What about a 32" 4:3 set? When viewing WS content what is the actual length and width of the onscreen content compared to a 30" 16:9 and a 27"? Can I get the same quality at around $800 or less?



This is quite a dillema.
 

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A 32" 4:3 HDTV will have a 70% larger screen when viewing 4:3 SD broadcasts when compared to a 30" 16:9 HDTV, and will have approx. 4% smaller screen when viewing HD broadcasts in 16:9.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
So what you are saying is I would be better of getting a 32" 4:3 rather than a 30" 16:9 for most content? When watching 16:9 HD or WS DVDs, I will still be in the ballpark of a 30" and substancially larger than my 27"?


I really raise this for question because, from what I understand 16:9 is measured horizontally while 4:3 is still diagnally.
 

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The 34XBR960 at 6-8 feet is pretty much ideal and optimal. That's exactly where I'm at with mine.
 

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Depends on your particular viewing habits. Personally, I'd recommend the Sony 34XBR960 for CRT from your viewing distance. You'd have a larger screen for 16:9, and retain approx. 27" for 4:3 broadcasts unless you zoom the pic fit your display. Also, Sony's Super Fine Pitch Tube can not be matched, period.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Quote:
Originally Posted by cajieboy
. Also, Sony's Super Fine Pitch Tube can not be matched, period.
The outrageous price tag is what keeps many buyers away from XBRs though and I am one of them. At $1899 for one TV, I could actually buy 2.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by davethestalker
The outrageous price tag is what keeps many buyers away from XBRs though and I am one of them. At $1899 for one TV, I could actually buy 2.
Your loss.


What a misinformed statement this is. Probably some sour grapes behind this comment.


You get what you pay for. Those two TV's you would buy at that price wouldn't come anywhere close to picture quality and performance.


You do realize that is the MSRP price and you easily take advantage of numerous sales and such?


There's nothing else you can buy anywhere near two grand that rivals the XBR960 in terms of picture quality, performance, and value all combined and all told.


It's considered a reference, professional monitor in just about every HT and AV circle and resource worth mentioning, and for good reason.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
I fully understand that Sony's XBR is their upper echelon series. The XBR is why they can get away with overpricing "general use" sets. Sort of the "resting on their laurels' kind of thing.


Sour grapes, no, realistic. I have a Wega, but Sony is not the end all be all anymore.


It just makes me mad most people say that (by default) Sony is "the best", no matter the price point. Sony overprices their general market products even though product may not be truely superior to their competition's product, at the same price point. I am speaking of the HS sets, not XBR.


Hitachi and Mitsubishi rear projection TVs kill Sony.....unless you throw an XBR into the competition.


If someone were to give me an XBR, I would not complain. But, I cannot justify spending $1899 for a TV when bills need to be paid and kids need to be fed. Are you going to finance me? If you can find an XBR for $800 brand new or even refurbed with a full factory warranty, I would buy it.


Not everyone has disposable income like you and the rest of the ultra high end community. I have known for well over 20 years that the XBRs are Sonys best. I am the first one to tell people that "you get what you pay for" when it comes to electronics.


You may not realize it, but you are insulting me with your "XBR or nothing" attitude. How about this: When I am ready to buy a TV, I'll pay the $800 (which is the price I have determined to be my variable target) and you can give me a gift of $1000 (or less if you can find a 34" XBR on sale)?


Thanks for your suggestion, but why is there such a difference in screen size between a 34" HS and a 34" XBR? You overlooked the fact that I am more concerned about screen size and not contemplating whether or not to get an XBR.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by davethestalker
I fully understand that Sony's XBR is their upper echelon series. The XBR is why they can get away with overpricing "general use" sets. Sort of the "resting on their laurels' kind of thing.


Sour grapes, no, realistic. I have a Wega, but Sony is not the end all be all anymore.
Who makes a better CRT tube? That's what this area of the forum is about.

Quote:


It just makes me mad most people say that (by default) Sony is "the best", no matter the price point.
I never said that. You're putting words in my mouth.


I said in THIS price tier of two grand or less, you can't do better than the XBR960 and that's an indisputeable fact.


I realize that Sony is far from perfect, but in the CRT tube market, you simply cannot do any better.


That's a fact.

Quote:
Sony overprices their general market products even though product may not be truely superior to their competition's product, at the same price point. I am speaking of the HS sets, not XBR.
It's quite possible. It wouldn't surprise me.


Can you back this up with any concrete data? Any proof?

Quote:
Hitachi and Mitsubishi rear projection TVs kill Sony.....unless you throw an XBR into the competition.
LOL.


Quote:


If someone were to give me an XBR, I would not complain. But, I cannot justify spending $1899 for a TV when bills need to be paid and kids need to be fed. Are you going to finance me?
Oh not, not this high minded rhetoric again. Straw man argument all the way. See my sig link?



Quote:
If you can find an XBR for $800 brand new or even refurbed with a full factory warranty, I would buy it.
I guess you'll never see it, then. File under: Surprise surprise, another person who wants the best champagne while only paying for soda pop.....


That would be you.


Quote:


Not everyone has disposable income like you and the rest of the ultra high end community.
WOW! I'm in the ultra high end community now?! YAY! :D Thanks man! Wow, I HAVE come a long ways! :D



Blah, blah, blah, you're an elitist because you can afford to buy something I can't, blah, blah, blah.


That's all that comment really means. Seen it a million times, laughed at it a million times.


Again: You are a person who wants the best champagne while only paying for soda pop.....



See my sig link? It's like following a script of old, tired cliches in this post.



Quote:
I have known for well over 20 years that the XBRs are Sonys best. I am the first one to tell people that "you get what you pay for" when it comes to electronics.


You may not realize it, but you are insulting me with your "XBR or nothing" attitude.
It's all in your mind. Honestly.



Quote:
How about this: When I am ready to buy a TV, I'll pay the $800 (which is the price I have determined to be my variable target) and you can give me a gift of $1000 (or less if you can find a 34" XBR on sale)?
I couldn't care less. I wouldn't give you two cents.

Quote:
Thanks for your suggestion, but why is there such a difference in screen size between a 34" HS and a 34" XBR?
LOL. There isn't

Quote:
You overlooked the fact that I am more concerned about screen size and not contemplating whether or not to get an XBR.
Then why did you fire off with this drivel in the first place? You started the digression and made a misinformed statement and someone just happpened to take you up on it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by davethestalker
The outrageous price tag is what keeps many buyers away from XBRs though and I am one of them. At $1899 for one TV, I could actually buy 2.
Nice try, guy. ;)


One last time: You are a person who wants the best champagne while only paying for soda pop.....


That's your only real "argument" here.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by davethestalker
I fully understand that Sony's XBR is their upper echelon series. The XBR is why they can get away with overpricing "general use" sets. Sort of the "resting on their laurels' kind of thing.


It just makes me mad most people say that (by default) Sony is "the best", no matter the price point. Sony overprices their general market products even though product may not be truely superior to their competition's product, at the same price point. I am speaking of the HS sets, not XBR.
I don't see Sony using the XBR brand excellence to overprice its "general use" sets. I have the 34HS set you are referring to, and it's now selling for $1,199. Try to find another major brand 34" set, new, for that price.

Quote:
Not everyone has disposable income like you and the rest of the ultra high end community. I have known for well over 20 years that the XBRs are Sonys best. I am the first one to tell people that "you get what you pay for" when it comes to electronics.


You may not realize it, but you are insulting me with your "XBR or nothing" attitude. How about this: When I am ready to buy a TV, I'll pay the $800 (which is the price I have determined to be my variable target) and you can give me a gift of $1000 (or less if you can find a 34" XBR on sale)?
You should do a search before you assume you know someone's "attitude." Q has stated numerous times that the HS series constitutes a very good line of tvs. And I seriously doubt that Q has "disposable income."

Quote:
Thanks for your suggestion, but why is there such a difference in screen size between a 34" HS and a 34" XBR? You overlooked the fact that I am more concerned about screen size and not contemplating whether or not to get an XBR.
Where do you get the notion that the 34" HS has a different screen size than the XBR?
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by justsc
I don't see Sony using the XBR brand excellence to overprice its "general use" sets. I have the 34HS set you are referring to, and it's now selling for $1,199. Try to find another major brand 34" set, new, for that price.
Can't be done.


Quote:



You should do a search before you assume you know someone's "attitude." Q has stated numerous times that the HS series constitutes a very good line of tvs. And I seriously doubt that Q has "disposable income."
Only in my dreams. ;)
 

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Discussion Starter #12
An XBR is out of the question for myself and a lot of people. Don't you guys realize that?


Quote:
Who makes a better CRT tube? That's what this area of the forum is about.
Oh really? I was under the assumption that it is dedicated to the discussion of Direct View (single tube based) Displays?


Instead of quoting every part of what I said and refering to your signature mearly to rip someone to shreads. by dismantling what someone is trying to genuinly express to you, why don't you try listening instead of just waiting to speak?


Quote:
Quote:


Hitachi and Mitsubishi rear projection TVs kill Sony.....unless you throw an XBR into the competition.



LOL.
I owned a Sony 52" rear projection TV. After I sent it back to Crutchfield, I was able to compare in a store all three side-by-side. And yes, Sony was the bottom of the bunch. If I wanted Sony's superior TV to the other two brands, I would have had to spend at least another $1000.....simple fact.


Quote:
You should do a search before you assume you know someone's "attitude."
I'm not saying Q is in the truest sense of the term, but how can using a message boards search function determine if one is a Sony Fanboy or not? Instead of addressing the sizing issues he stated that his 34" TV is "optimal" from 6-8 feet. He only got arguementative after I told him that the $1899 price tag of the 34" XBR is in fact outrageous. Did I start this thread asking about XBRs? No. So why did he have to get so rude?

Quote:
I guess you'll never see it, then. File under: Surprise surprise, another person who wants the best champagne while only paying for soda pop.....
When did I ever state that I was in the market for an XBR? I wanted to know about sizing issues. Did you not read the post that originated the thread? Instead of addressing the sizing issues, you flew off the handle when I stated the fact that a 34" XBR costs twice as much as I (and a lot of other people) can afford.


Even if I was in the market for an XBR, the sizing issue is still primary. Did you overlook the part where I said that a 34" set would be too wide anyway?



Quote:

Thanks for your suggestion, but why is there such a difference in screen size between a 34" HS and a 34" XBR? You overlooked the fact that I am more concerned about screen size and not contemplating whether or not to get an XBR.

Where do you get the notion that the 34" HS has a different screen size than the XBR?[/QUOTE] You obviously missed the fact that I am concerned about screen sizing and not brands, nor specific models.
 

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I'm unclear what you are trying to say at the bottom of your post, since the "quote/unquote didn''t work just right for you.


You asked in a previous post:
Quote:
Quote:

Thanks for your suggestion, but why is there such a difference in screen size between a 34" HS and a 34" XBR?
Just to clear this up - they both have the same screen size.
 

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Now, all this BS makes me wonder:
Quote:
Originally Posted by davethestalker
If someone were to give me an XBR, I would not complain. But, I cannot justify spending $1899 for a TV when bills need to be paid and kids need to be fed. Are you going to finance me?
Assuming this is even true, which I seriously doubt:


How do you have the time and energy to waste spamming threads with a bunch of threadcrap and BS like you're doing in this thread?
 

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 http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=616107


Here's what happened in this thread.


I was responding to cajeboy. My post should have been number 5. For some reason, and I've seen it happen before, my post somehow magically jumped up to number 4, even though I'd written it AFTER cajeboy had written his.


I really wasn't even paying close attention to Dave's material.


The rest is history.


In any event:


I still won't accept someone trying to pass off their opinions as facts and then cover it up with a bunch of snide innuendo and arrogant BS.




Examples, all written by davethestalker in this thread:

Quote:
The outrageous price tag is what keeps many buyers away from XBRs though and I am one of them. At $1899 for one TV, I could actually buy 2.
That bolded item is an OPINION, not a FACT. Period.



Quote:
I owned a Sony 52" rear projection TV. After I sent it back to Crutchfield, I was able to compare in a store all three side-by-side. And yes, Sony was the bottom of the bunch. If I wanted Sony's superior TV to the other two brands, I would have had to spend at least another $1000.....simple fact.
Simple opinion. Simply irrelevant.


And we weren't talking about RPTV's! How the hell did that even come up?


RPTV's have their own forum here! http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/forumdisplay.php?f=63






and

Quote:
Sony overprices their general market products even though product may not be truely superior to their competition's product, at the same price point. I am speaking of the HS sets, not XBR.
I know I'll never see this qualified or backed up, will I? Can you back this statement up at all, with anything concrete?


It's really just another opinion that you're trying to pass off as something else.









Bakchand insults and snide innuendo:

Quote:
I'm not saying Q is in the truest sense of the term, but how can using a message boards search function determine if one is a Sony Fanboy or not?
C'mon. A blind man can see this one. See my sig link? You're going down in flames fast.


Just checking off the script.



Quote:
Not everyone has disposable income like you and the rest of the ultra high end community.
Ok. :rolleyes:





All this BS makes me wonder:
Quote:
If someone were to give me an XBR, I would not complain. But, I cannot justify spending $1899 for a TV when bills need to be paid and kids need to be fed.


Are you going to finance me? If you can find an XBR for $800 brand new or even refurbed with a full factory warranty, I would buy it.
The thread is full of asinine comments like these, but:


Assuming that bolded item is even true, which I seriously doubt: How the hell do you have the time and the energy to waste spamming Internet message boards with threadcrap, like you've done in this thread?
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Now, all this BS makes me wonder:

Quote:

Originally Posted by davethestalker

If someone were to give me an XBR, I would not complain. But, I cannot justify spending $1899 for a TV when bills need to be paid and kids need to be fed. Are you going to finance me?



Assuming this is even true, which I seriously doubt:


How do you have the time and energy to waste spamming threads with a bunch of threadcrap and BS like you're doing in this thread?
How can you afford an XBR? You are doing the same thing. In fact, you are using more of your time to rip apart what I have said. What you are doing has nothing to do with the premis of this thread. It seems you like to argue more than share information.


Do you not have constructive measurements or opinions based on various experiences with the situation I described in the original post that would help me (or others) to make more of an educated purchase?


As I said in the original post, a 34" is too big for my situation.
 

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...stalker,


You are hurting yourself and your chances to realize any benefit from this thread.


In your first post, you made mention of a very good receiver, high quality. This sets you apart as someone who knows what they want and is willing to buy quality. You seemed to have your stuff together regarding measurements, etc.


Q was just trying to help you out. Your comment about being able to get 2 sets for the price of a 34" XBR didn't seem to fit, unless you had a chip on your shoulder. It didn't make sense that you'd marry that receiver with an $800 tv, since these days, at the prices they go for, tvs are very much an investment.


Again, Q was trying to help you. Q is one of the most respected and helpful members of this forum and you've taken him to task w/o so much as a search to see whom you were dealing with. You accused Q of having an "XBR or nothing attitude, referring later to what you call a Sony Fanboy." There's that chip on your shoulder, or the "sour grapes" Q referred to earlier.


Sony's aren't the only answer, and Q would be the first person to tell you that. I've seen him recommend all kinds of sets, depending on what the user said they needed/wanted.


You've got all the info you need. Good luck to you.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by justsc
Q is one of the most respected and helpful members of this forum and you've taken him to task w/o so much as a search to see whom you were dealing with.
Ok. Now even I have to say: That's WAY too generous my man. ;)


Thanks for the props, though.



Quote:
Originally Posted by davethestalker
I've got a 27" Wega now and will be getting a new set. My eyes are demanding it. I need to sit on the edge of the seat to read my guide. So, I need a larger TV.


Like I said before, I'm looking to get a 30" 16:9. Is that the right target size though? I will be gaining a few inches horizontally, but losing an inch vertically. Will a 30" widescreen provide the increase in screen content size I need?


I took an overall width measurement of the Panny 34" and at alomst 40" across, that is a big TV. Too big for my current set up. My stand will also have to come away from the wall at least 6 more inches. My Yamaha RXV-2200 Receiver will have to find a new home because it is too tall to fit on the shelves, thus it sits next to the current TV. All this means well will be plunking down another $150 - $200 on a stand AGAIN!


What about a 32" 4:3 set? When viewing WS content what is the actual length and width of the onscreen content compared to a 30" 16:9 and a 27"? Can I get the same quality at around $800 or less?



This is quite a dillema.
Punch the numbers in. Voila!

http://www.cavecreations.com/tv2.cgi
 

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Discussion Starter #19
Justsc, thanks for bringing the tone back down. Call me Dave or DTS. My screen name may be taken negatively, but there is actually meaning behind it.


It's funny how pricing in electronics takes a nose dive after you buy something. A receiver such as mine can be purchased for $500 or less now. When I bought mine in '02, I did a lot of research for longer than a month. I dug deep into similar products at the same price point. I even took mine back for a refund. Looked at Onkyo, but they were too midrangy for my tastes.


When I am in the position to actually buy the TV, I could plunk down the cash to get an XBR. But realisticly, that would not be fair to my family and I could not justify that purchase in my heart. I have to keep my wife happy. If she had it her way, we would not be getting a new TV. This is why I am trying to stay around that $800 mark, at the most $1000 (maybe). If we can get financed that will change things.


Unfortunately, similar to the auto industry, financing everything we really want has driven the prices up. In turn, it also makes those things accessable.

Quote:
Punch the numbers in. Voila!

http://www.cavecreations.com/tv2.cgi
Thanks Q for posting this. If you guys could help me decifer it, that would help too ;)


From what I gather, the only time the 4:3 would truely be bigger is when comparing full 4:3 to the side barred 16:9 mode. All other aspects the 30" beats the 32".
 

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Quote:
The outrageous price tag is what keeps many buyers away from XBRs though and I am one of them.
While it may still be out of your price range, I feel that $1899 for the BEST consumer television at any price is a heck of a bargain. I paid $2200 for my 34-XBR910 and felt like I stole it. The 960 actually went down in price while adding a built in tuner. What about all of the more expensive sets that don't look half as good? The tube XBRs are not the cheapest tube televisions out there, but they are one of the best values in televisions today (or ever for that matter).


That being said, I am not a huge sony fan and in some other display technologies, the XBR sets are overpriced for what you get, but this is not the case in the tube XBRs (or XSs)
 
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