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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I've been lurking in this forum as well as others for the last month and a half. I've gathered gargantuant amounts of great knowledge and information from you folks on purchasing my new Home Theater system.


I recencly purchased a complete Mirage speaker system. That's it, because the new house is not built yet. I'm pretty sure I'm going with the Denon 4802 and the Pioneer PRO720 for TV. I've been struggling with DVD and or CD player. I've been reading all the hub bub about the Denon DVD players and the Pioneer Elite DV-47a.


I saw the Denon 9000 playing a movie on the Pioneer PRO720. My bride and I thought the picture was quite good. We asked the salesman to put the same movie in the Pioneer DV-47. It was quite good as well but perhaps not quite as sharp. It seemed to be more sutble and softer. He then brought out and hooked up an Arcam DV-27. Before the opening credits even displayed we could see the difference. The movie was astonishingly better. Clean, and clear. I've heard about these so called jaw dropping experiences and this was one.


We listened to 2 channel music on the machine and it also was really, really awsome, and we have listened to a lot of different CD machines.


So, the Denon 9000 for $5,500 (all prices CND)

The Pioneer DV-47 for $2,600

Or the Arcam DV-27 for $4,000

humm

I know the Arcam does not play SACD or at this time DVD-A which is important to me BUT what good looker.


Would sure appreicate some comments on this system.
 

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Some will say that it has a decoder with the "chroma bug" which I've never been able to see using a Hitachi 43uwx10b 16x9 HDTV (though I'm not arrogant enough to say it does not exist). I thought the player's picture quality was great but what really clinched it for me was the quality of 2-channel CD playback. Nothing else I tried came close (Sony, Denon, Pioneer, Philips, Panasonic).


I own one. I'm glad I own one.


Whatever you do, have fun and good luck! :)
 

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Dano, I am also in the market for a new DVD player that also has quality 2-channel CD sound.


I have a Pioneer Elite Pro 610 and about a year ago thought I would buy the perfect DVD match for that TV - the Pioneer DV-AX10 (DVD-V, DVD-A and SACD). Well I never really found out how good an audio player it was since I was so disappointed in it's video quality. I truly got a better picure using it's interlace output (letting the Elite 610 do the de-interlacing) than with it's progressive scan output. I spent several months e-mailing and communicating with Pioneer before they finally agreed to take the AX10 back.


At that point I was back in the DVD player marketplace. A local dealer let me borrow an Arcam DV-27 and I was very pleasantly surprised by the video performance. It's progressive scan output far exceeded the 610's built-in de-interacing (and thus performaing better than the AX10). Given that the time of year was December and CES show and new product announcements were right around the corner I decided to wait. As a result of the show I put the Denon 9000, the Ayre D-1 and Camelot Roundtable on my list. I am still considering all these players. The Arcam certainly proved itself in my one night demo. The Arye get fantastic reviews and comments, but is certainly a major step-up in price and possibly overkill for my system. The Camelot also gets great reviews, but is more expensive than the DV27 and it's future is unknown since the Panasonic A-110 inside is no longer available. Regarding the Denon, I am still waiting for the verdict from forums like this and / or some reviews from respected sources (i.e., not Sound & Vision).


Given my experience, I don't think you could go wrong with the Arcam DV27 and it appears to mate very well with the Pioneer Elite TVs. Personally, since my rather bad experience with my last DVD player purchase I guess I am giving myself more time to make the decision.


Jeff
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Hi Rafaelp,

You mentioned the DV-27 was reported to have the chroma bug. I don't have any clue what it really looks like but this is how I would precieve it to be. The movie we watched with those different DVD players was Star Wars (First Contact). When we viewed it with the Denon 9000 the peoples faces in the outdoor scenes had a steely gray color and they looked amost like they had a bad acne problem.


With the same scene on the Pioneer DV-47, the faces were more natural looking but the picture was not as sharp.


With the Arcam DV-27 the skin tones were very natural and the picture was very sharp and clear.


Does that sound like chroma bug?


Regards,

Dano
 

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Dano, no. It does sound like you did not relacibrate the display (basic picture controls) when switching between players. Also, the 9000 and 47a have built in picture controls. The sharpness control in the Denon can cause what you describe.
 

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The DV-27 is a great DVD and CD player, I really love mine already and I've not had it for long :)


I especially appreciate the ability to output Progrssive PAL as well as NTSC.


Image quality is superb, and I refuse to go looking for the chroma bug so it doesn't bother me in the slighest.


Mark
 

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Hi,


I upgraded from a Denon2800 to the DV27. And as you can guess, I know the chroma bug very well from the Denon picture. Maybe the Arcam also still have this bug, but it is very hard to see compared with the Denon. And the great overall improvement let forget this.


Till now, I could not see the Pioneer yet, but I keep an Eye on it. The Problem with the 747 is the missing RGsB progressive output. That is one of the big DV27 advantages. Bye the way, does anybody know, if the Pioneer can also setup an audio delay to get the progressive picture lip sync?


Greetings


Harry
 

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I have a question for DV27 owners or anyone who is familar with Arcam. It is reported that Arcam will have a DVD-Audio upgrade available for the DV-27 (I had originally heard that it would be the first half of 2002). Is this available now or is there a release date for it?


Thanks,

Jeff
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Jeff. The salesman were I am dealing with tells me that Arcam have a new bunch of stuff just arriving. I know nothing of the details.


Can someone please tell me what the chroma bug looks like?

I would sure appreiciate it.


Regards,

Dano
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Halcy. Thankyou for the enlightenment. I don't think the chroma bug is going to destroy my universe.


By the way. Some thing that is curious to me is all the good things I've been reading about PC DVD players. How come they can make a simple little card that can go in your PC along with some software to make the DVD player work and get better results than some or most of these expensive and heavy DVD machines?


Regards,

Dano
 

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Dano,


better is very "subjective". DVD based players have issues too compared to best of rack players:


- "only" 10 bit maximum color calculation & DA depth

- no DCDi (jaggies on video material especially)

- stutter on pans (framerate / refresh rate synch issue)

- problems related to video boards (ghosting, blurriness, video dot clock jitter, etc)

- usability, tinkering, pc issues, etc


Let's not start another fight about what's best, but if something was objectively best in all categories, it would surely sweep the market. HTPC hasn't swept the market, so it's quite fair to assume it has issues to some people.


I think both rack and htpc dvd players are compromises on some fronts. It's just a matter of what trade-offs you choose.


cheers,

Halcy
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
OK. I appriecate your comments and do not want to start any kind of fight BUT when I read about people who are selling their $3000.00 US DVD players because the very inexpensive HTPC looks better on the Sharp 9000 I have to wonder where I'm going to put my money.


The front projecter will not work for me because I can not get good light control. I'm seriously thinking about the Pioneer Pro720 and I have no idea if the HTPC will work on this format but for the money it's worth some debate is it not?


Regards,

Dano
 

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Hi,


I am very interested in the Arcam DV27 as well. Does anybody know how it

handels the layer changes. My old Player (Pioneer DV05) is very bad at this.

I also heard that it does not pass "blacker than black" is this true?


Thanks,

Christoph
 

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The new firmware (anything higher than v1.74) will pass blacker than black (pluge test) by making a parameter change in the setup menu. Once black level is adjusted Arcam recommends that you revert back to the former mode for actual movie watching. The problem I have is setting the contrast. My set does not show blooming and the line-bending test doesn't work either. I decided to find what I thought was perfect contrast and then lower it! :)
 
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