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Someone please talk me out of upgrading my Nec 6PG Extra

808 Views 26 Replies 10 Participants Last post by  romy101
I cannot stand the fact that every time I come to this forum I want to buy a 9" crt and shelf my Nec. I just did a focus exercise last night and wow. If it looks that good with this 7" I would love to see a Ehome or some high end unit display hdnet. My curiosity is killing me and my wallet is crying my name.


Please someone tell me what I want to hear, and that is I don't need to upgrade because my Nec is a great pj and it won't be that big of an improvement. I don't want to get into a fight with my wife over spengin more money.


Please.
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I can't talk you out of it.


But I do take trades..:)


Curt
I've OWNED the following 9" crt projectors, none of which I personally would "upgrade" a finely tuned PG Extra to. Ampro 4600, Sony 1292, NEC GP5000, Marquee 9501. There is one I would upgrade to, but I won't mention it as it would just beg too many questions.

Keep your present pj. If its been tweaked and tweaked, the difference between its picture and that of a 9" is negligable, and not worth the HUGE price that you would most likely have to pay. Give your pj a few years of use, and keep your eyes open for a great deal on a 9" pj. When one falls into your lap, that will be the time to "upgrade". In the meantime, look at as many as you can in person, you may not be impressed enough to even go to the trouble. Changing brands means going to either MEC(Ampro, Barco and Electrohome) or Sony(Barco, Sony)tubes, both of which have different color characteristics you may not be thrilled with.

All that being said though, I personally, like having the BIGGEST projector possible, this usually means having a 9" crt. Luckily my 1208S/2 is a monster, and keeps that desire at bay.

Keep your PG Extra, its the distillation of all that is good about that entire line of projector, it is a pinnacle machine, very difficult to upgrade, and I don't think you'd see a "dramatic" change in pic quality no matter WHAT projector you changed to.

Do a full out, ground up, no holds barred, mechanical and electronic setup on it. That might hold off the "upgrade" demons.
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Quote:
Originally posted by gn2
I've OWNED the following 9" crt projectors, none of which I personally would "upgrade" a finely tuned PG Extra to. Ampro 4600, Sony 1292, NEC GP5000, Marquee 9501. There is one I would upgrade to, but I won't mention it as it would just beg too many questions.
Hey Paul! What kind of questions do you think people would ask about you upgrading to a NEC 10PG? :D :D



Romy101: What contrast setting are you running the 6PG at? If you're happy with the amount of light output you're getting then I'd keep it 6PG. Is it set up 100% perfect? If you feel a better setup is needed, you're probably better off spending some of the upgrade money on getting someone like Doug Baisey to really dial in the setup perfectly for you.


Kal
My problem is that I don't know what great looks like. I don't even know what a perfectly focused machine looks like. Everyone that looks at my setup says wow but what do they know, they are just ignorant tv viewers. I need to see a super dope machine in my area to compare mine to. I would fly someone in, but to be told it looks great as it is would be a waste of money.


You know this was the same curiosity that made me sell my PLV60 lcd and go to crt. Well that paid off very well so I wonder ... and wonder ...


No it is not PERFECTLY set up I know that but whose is except the 0.5% of you out there.


Does in south florida have a sweet crt that I can see? By the way who is Doug and how do I get a hold of him?
ROMY! You sound like you're happy. Save the cash, buy some DVDs and wait until your PJ dies then talk to Curt. I saw a well set up CRT and I have to say, it does look better than mine but when I watch movies, mine looks SOOO nice. (ECP4500 - and I still think it's great!) Especially with DVDs.


R-S
Paul,

Quote:
Originally posted by gn2
.....There is one I would upgrade to, but I won't mention it as it would just beg too many questions......
It's not the one with the Frensel lens and the huge 21" TV (which is way bigger than even the 9 inchers) that drives it, is it? :D


Romy101,


Based upon your posts now and in the past, forget the upgrade and have it properly calibrated (ISF'ed) by one of the better NEC-oriented calibrators. I won't recommmend any, as I've got one of the best, just down the street, and don't really know others personally, but there are dozens of posts about these guys.


That money will be much better than an upgrade and Doing-It-Yourself. Also, if you got money you want to spend, consider darkening the room, changing the screen, improving the sound (My personal opinion is that good surround sound increases the enjoyment much more than increasing screen size or brightness


If your tubes are toast, then have them changed 1st.


My NEC 9PG Xtra seems more than enough, and I have seen the best-of-the best.


Regards,


Ira
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You''ll know you're done with the setup of your PG Extra IF:

All colors have the exact same width of line in internally generated test patterns.

All of those lines are soooo fine you marvel at that every time you bring up the patterns(and start doing that just to look at how good they are !)

When you converge a color on top of another, you can't tell where the separate colors are, EXCEPT by misconverging it a tiny bit.

Your convergence is ROCK steady right from turn on, corner to corner, top to bottom, side to side.

Your focus is PERFECTLY uniform and virtually perfect(able to see individual pieces of the fine dots in the fine dot test pattern) for ALL THREE COLORS, across the entire screen, top to bottom, side to side and corner to corner.

When you have done all of this, you can get a coloromiter and do and EXACT white balance for perfect D6500.

With this kind of setup, you'd likely embarass all but the pro setup and tweaked 9" crt's.
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able to see individual pieces of the fine dots in the fine dot test pattern
Individual dots? What in the world? I guess I do have much to tune then. My dogbones are looking good to me. Are they made up of dots?
Help a brother out then. If my dogbones are one solid blob of bone and I cannot see dots then I need to focus properly. I did a phosfor grain focus to perfection last night then did another focus with the electronic controls but still the dogbones are one blob of bone.


What in your opinion could be wrong? When you go up to your screen you can definitely see dots making up the bone? Are there focus adjustments under the hood apart from the center and side focus wingnuts?
Astig/flare. This is often overlooked aspect of focus but it is the most basic. It is the focus of the actual electron beam. When its shape is as small as possible and as perfectly round as possible, you will have MUCH better electronic focus.

To do it right, you need to do astig flare, center your rasters, do astig flare, center your rasters, do astig flare, etc, etc. until the rasters are centered AND the astig flare is dead on perfect. NOW do your electronic focus and you should see the individual pieces which make up the "dogbones". When doing your astig flare though, you should use the "Dots" pattern not the "Focus" pattern.
Keep Your 6PG, I,ve got 2 of them in different rooms of the house and they are very durable and give excellent color, You might upgrade to the HD-144n lenses if yours doesn,t have them, will give you a better color spectrum. I just picked up a XG135lc with 1500 no bun hrs. and is a harder PJ to set up than the 6PG as far as focusing goes but I,m getting there, It,s not a Gigantic Leap better than the 6pg only slightly You didn,t say what type of screen and width you use, I switched to a high power and THAT reaaallyy made a huge difference, Try that first and you won,t need a new PJ. Just keep it below 92" wide preferrably about 88" NEC,S absolutely rock brother! don,t defect!!!
Regarding the astig /flare adjustments are you referring to the menu option for astig in the center and sides available in the focus submenu? I can do that easily if that is what you are referring to. As far as raster centering are you also referring to electronic adjustments?


I just discovered the focus pot and looked into the lens and corrected the tube focus. It was off. Now I see the line and dots above on the tube. Is it absolutely necessary to take the lenses off to get proper tube focus?) I redid the phosfor grain optical focus as well. Now I see a clearer pic but still on the screen I do not see the dots.


I will do a little search for the astig / raster thing unless you can give me a quick rundown of what you are referring to.


Thanks a million. In 2 hours I think I will have perfection .... maybe.
Astig/flare involves zeroing the electronic astig settings and static convergence in the menus and then adjusting the CPC magnets on each tube for a nice round dot and even flare/halo around the central dot. Before astig is done one should do raster centering to make sure the raster is being painted dead center of each tube. Raster centering on the PG's is done by adjusting the centering magnets on the deflection yokes. Adjusting the centering magnets affects astigmatism because you are changing where the beam hits the phosphor so therefore the cpc magnets must be adjusted to correct this. On the other hand, adjusting the cpc magnets has an effect on raster centering, so therefore one has to go back and forth between the two until it is perfect...


Try doing some searches, this has been covered a lot and there is lots that I have left out...
The astig flare adjustments and raster centering I was talking about are all MECHANICAL in nature, if you've ONLY used the electronic controls, then your machine is a LONG way from being setup optimally. You might try reading and reading and reading every post you can find on the NEC's. They almost can't be beat for sharpness, but you got to put in the time.

I don't think even a seasoned pro could do a really good astig flare/ raster centering on an NEC in two hours. You need to run some video every 20/30 minutes or so when you're setting up/tweaking your projector, or else the changes between running just a test pattern and running full video will show in a less acurate setup.
Quote:
Originally posted by gn2
Marquee 9501. There is one I would upgrade to, but I won't mention it as it would just beg too many questions.

Keep your present pj. If its been tweaked and tweaked, the difference between its picture and that of a 9" is negligable, and not worth the HUGE price that you would most likely have to pay.
here we go again with the Marquee 9501 being only negligibly different than a 6pg. Did i read this wrong or do you really believe that? Not worth the price? for you maybe.
Well the differences are IN THE TUBES...Paul probably got USED tubes from god knows where and slapped them into the 9501 he used to have, set it up and was not happy with it...that would be my guess.


The XG135LC I USED to have was a nice step up over the PG9200 and XG750 that I have now...NO HALOS around bright objects and increased contrast and brightness makes a big difference IMHO..and the blacks...wow.


I am not saying that a PG Xtra is not a great projector, because it most definitely IS A GREAT PROJECTOR...BUT the liquid coupled projectors are better to my eyes anyways for the above mentioned reasons...
were were you on the other thread when i needed you?
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