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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I think the 10HT and PLV60 have been exhaustively compared over on The Big Picture and the consensus is the PLV60 beats the pants off of the Sony in both contrast, black level and brightness. But there are some problems related to dust and alignment.


I too would like to know if anyone's seen an 11HT. I also saw a well set up 10HT and was very impressed.


Dan
 

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I can confirm that the PLV-60 blows the 10HT out of the water. And the ideal combo is a PLV-60, a Panasonic RP-91 and Stewart Grayhawk (my set up). I was very close to buying the 10HT last Fall and held off because of a move. Now that I have the PLV-60, I'm glad I reconsidered.


I did have two dust blobs, but after confirming with Sanyo that opening the unit for routine cleaning did not void my warranty (I would still recommend calling Sanyo and getting confirmation with someone by name b/f doing anything), I undid a few screws, pulled the cover back and it was a breeze.


This site settled my nerves as to how easy it is to resolve the dust blob issue and has some nifty shots of the PLV-60's innards (even one with the unit on!)...
http://www.blarg.net/~anderson/plv60.htm


BTW since dusting the unit, I haven't had a problem.


Just my $.02,

Flexx
 

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Flexx,


What are the end results with the Panny on your Sonyo? Any of that "graininess" or "screen door" from the proper seating distance or do you get a smooth-detailed film-like image?


When all is said and done...and the lights are out and you watch a movie with space-shots like 2001 or lots of night-scenes like Dark City...do you feel satisfied with the blacks or do they still leave something to be desired?


have you seen HD on your projector?


If you've got some pat review you can cut and past into a reponse i'd also love to read that!


(also, did you see a properly calibrated 10HT before you got your Sanyo or did you just get it based on reviews?)


-dave
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by DanHouck:
I think the 10HT and PLV60 have been exhaustively compared over on The Big Picture and the consensus is the PLV60 beats the pants off of the Sony in both contrast, black level and brightness. But there are some problems related to dust and alignment.


I too would like to know if anyone's seen an 11HT. I also saw a well set up 10HT and was very impressed.


Dan
Sorry Dan, but I don't think that there has ever been an unbiased direct comparison of the 10HT and the PLV-60. I hope that eventually (maybe at one of the big shows) this can be done. I would love to see a 10HT calibrated by Don Munsil and Steve Smallscombe compared to an optimally calibrated PLV-60. It would help put a lot of questions to rest, and maybe save some people a lot of money.


pkurtis


 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Mike:

Very nice essay on de-dusting--thank you!


What are the details of your setup? Screen size, distance to seating?


Thanks.


Dan
 

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Just saw a calibrated 10HT last night at someone's home.


WOW. I can't believe how good the image was...and how supurb this projector was at scaling DVD images to fill the panel without noticable grain or harshness.


Toy Story 2, The Dark Crystal, Crouching Tiger and Sense and Sensibility all looked stellar (3 of those are Sony titles...hmmmm....)


Naturally the blacks weren't inky black...but it certainly seemed not too bad a trade-off considering everything else this projector did right. And HDTV...WOW!!! It was like having a window on the wall!!!


So...any 11 reviews yet? Wasn't that puppy supposed to ship sometime in July? Let's hear it...I want to know about those black-level issues on the new unit!


Also, has anyone really done a fair comparison of a maxed (calibrated to the max for black level) 10 HT and the Sanyo 60? Dust blobs and "grain" with DVD input have me wondering about the Sanyo...but I'd love to see that projector too now that I've gotten a good taste of the 10HT (I live in the Wash DC area if any of you have a Sanyo you'd like to show off).


-dave
 

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It is my understanding that the 11HT is nothing (well maybe a little) more than a tweaked 10HT. I have heard that it is speculated that Sony was under pressure from the Sanyo unit which uses Sonys LCD, yet performs better. For Sony, this was a slap in the face so they had to show the market that they were attempting to beat the Sanyo. However, from a few test reports I have seen (both here and The Big Picture), the 10HT can acomplish most of what the 11HT has to offer. The only trick is that the 10HT needs to be tweaked to produce what the 11HT looks like out of the box. Now, that does not mean that the 11HT could look like a 12HT (<--example, _not_ real), but rather the 10HT has more room to play. BTW, there are some _very_ easy and dramatic tweaks for the 10HT.


So in a nutshell, it looks like Sony took some 10HT's, applied the tweaks that produce the best results, and now call it the 11HT. I have heard that the 11HT will support 1:1 pixel mapping with computer input on the 11HT, but I'm not sure if that was ever confirmed.


Adam
 

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Not true. The Sanyo uses the 10HT LCD panels. The only reason Sanyo and others can now buy those panels from Sony is because Sony is coming out with the 11HT which uses brand new LCD panels. It has a new scaler which has 3:2 pulldown, improved contrast amd does do 1:1. It is not, in any sense, merely a tweaked 10HT. Had Sony not come out with the 11HT, it would have maintained its prior policy of refusing to sell 10HT chips to anyone.
 

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Quote:
Mike:

Very nice essay on de-dusting--thank you!

What are the details of your setup? Screen size, distance to seating?
I'm glad my de-dusting page is helping people out. Note that someone on The Big Picture Forum asked Sanyo if opening the case really voided the warranty, and they were told it does not.


I don't have a real screen yet -- I'm planning to order a 96x54 GrayHawk soon. I'm projecting onto a big gray sheet at the moment, so I'm expecting a big improvement! Viewing distance is around 10 feet from the screen. The screen door effect is noticable when projecting a solid color over the whole screen, but not (to me) when watching movies. I'm currently using a 480i DVD player, but will eventually be using a HTPC to feed DVD video scaled to 1360x768. I'm very happy with this projector, though I admit I only have seen a few other projector models to compare against.


-Mike
 

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Mike, I enjoyed your website quite a bit. So you know, at least the XP21N has a panel that can be removed to reveal the three panels without taking off the whole case. My problem is that I sprayed 3 canisters of CO2 into the panels and my dust blob is still there. NOW WHAT? By the way, if my blob is green, what panel is it on?
 

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Here's a review by a guy who saw the 11HT in Seattle recently. Didn't sound too impressive for the price.
http://www.avsforum.com/ubb/Forum10/HTML/006882.html


------------------

Jim Lauritzen


[This message has been edited by Jim Lauritzen (edited 07-26-2001).]
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Jim:


Maybe that's why they've delayed bringing it out--to address some of the stuff this guy noticed.


Dan
 

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Hi Jaron,

Quote:
By the way, if my blob is green, what panel is it on?
If you are projecting what should be white, and it looks greenish-blue, you have dust on your red panel.

Quote:
problem is that I sprayed 3 canisters of CO2 into the panels and my dust blob is still there. NOW WHAT?
First, move the projector around a little to make sure the discoloration isn't due to your screen/wall. If you're convinced that it's the panels, and blowing air doesn't help, then your problem is out of my league. If it were me, and the blob was really bothering me, I'd contact Sanyo tech support.


-Mike
 

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<<Flexx,

What are the end results with the Panny on your Sonyo?>>


Un-friggin believable. I have the PLV-60, Panny RP-91 and Stewart Grayhawk 92" Communicator.


<<Any of that "graininess" or "screen door" from the proper seating distance or do you get a smooth-detailed film-like image?>>


The better the transfer, the more impressive the image. If the dvd is a sub-par transfer, or from a grainy source, expect a magnified grainfest if you're used to a smaller direct view monitor/tv. Like all quality equipment, the PLV-60 brings out the best and worst of the sources fed to it. I don't see the screen door at 10 feet unless I squint so hard I see the screen door of the house next door and the vitreous liquid in my eyeballs starts jetting out of my tearducts http://www.avsforum.com/ubb/wink.gif


<<When all is said and done...and the lights are out and you watch a movie with space-shots like 2001 or lots of night-scenes like Dark City...do you feel satisfied with the blacks or do they still leave something to be desired?>>


First, let me say, I was (and still am) one of those contrast/deep black fanatic, and no, you will *not* get CRT blacks. However, that being said, the PLV-60 has excellent contrast for an LCD projector. Also, most importantly, I always was reading about "contrast" on these forums as if it = black level. I learned real quick that while you're black level may not be "black," the contrast - that is the differential between the lightest and darkest parts of the image - *is* the important thing and what determines if the image appears "washed out." I felt the Sony 10HT had a "washed out" image, and after seeing the Sanyo (after I bought it), I was sold (I actually did have a 2 week no Q return policy just in case).


The first thing you notice when you mute the picture on the PLV-60 to get a "black" image is that - surprise - it's not "black." However, when you click the "no show" button again, the brightness of the video *slams* you in the face. I checked out Crouching Tiger, 2001, CE3K - all showed great detail in the shadows, and to my eyes, a very satisfying image. Also, next time you go to the local megaplex (no flames please, I know they're terrible and why we're here), look at the "black" level. You'll be surprised that contemporary film projection also doesn't have CRT blacks.


<<have you seen HD on your projector?>>


Unfortunately, no. I'll probably burn thru most of my lamp hours re-watching and re-discovering my dvd collection.


<<(also, did you see a properly calibrated 10HT before you got your Sanyo or did you just get it based on reviews?)

-dave>>


Yes, I did see a properly calibrated 10HT last Fall and was about to buy it, but had to postpone due to a move. I *never* saw the PLV-60 until it arrived on my doorstep, believe it or not. I read Jeff McNeal's review at thebigpicturedvd.com, read other folks thoughts on it (positive and negative) and made the jump.


Sometimes you wind up chasing your tail, never make a decision, and perhaps a life change or other circumstance may postpone your jump indefinitely.


Isn't it that way with most everything worth doing?


Cheers,

Flexx
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by Flexx:

The first thing you notice when you mute the picture on the PLV-60 to get a "black" image is that - surprise - it's not "black."
I don't know about the PLV-60, but on my 10HT muting the picture does look grayish. But if I then bring up the projectors menu, the background of the menu looks much blacker then the muted picture. So I don't know if muting is the blackest the projector can go. Any thoughts???


-apnar
 

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If you are interested in a Sanyo PLV-60 (like I am) it might be worthwhile looking at the Cinema 13HD from Studio Experience. Its a reworked Sanyo for Home Theater. I talked to Hank Nance at Studio and they offer a 30 day satisfaction money back guarantee. It is about $500 more than the street price of the Sanyo. Supposedly the 480i problems have been addressed, the contrast and lumens are maximised giving blacker blacks.

Unfortunately I am off on an overseas trip for about a month , and have to delay on the wholething. Maybe somebody else can evaluate it and post the findings by the time I am back.

The Url is: http://www.studioexperience.com
 

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Concerning the 10HT mute, it is not the lowest black level. Using a measurement system like SMART (from Steve Smallcombe) shows that the mute corresponds to an IRE level above 0 which varies depending on brighness and contrast levels. It is not meant to represent IRE 0.


------------------

Tom Pfarr
http://www.toad.net/~tpfarr/Hometheater.htm
 

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I own a Sony 10ht that I have tweaked around a bit and I keep hearing about the Sanyo so I was wondering if anyone would like to come over and do a fun little comparison. In my HT I have a 110" Grayhawk, a Hughes HD STB, JVC 723 progressive dvd player, AVIA and a sound meter. I think we could put some y spliters on my component switch, perhaps hack together some kind of lens mask and A/B test both projectors on the screen at the same time. The HT room is fairly well light controlled, I get a little light bleeding in around the blackout shades late in the afternoon but it is not bad. I think it would be fun to do a little amateur shoot off, compare out of the box settings, check the fan sound levels then apply some of the well known tweaks and see what we think.


I live in Oakland Hills (Montclair Dist.), CA, so if you live nearby and would be interest in bringing your projector over let me know and we will set up a time.


The gauntlet it thrown, who will take up my challenge. http://www.avsforum.com/ubb/wink.gif


Regards,


Brian

 
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