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Discussion Starter #1
I have been using HX9V for a year now, bought it just for the video, and have been generally satisfied with the results, but lack of manual functions is something I miss. The quality fo photos is poor when watched in 100% - lot of smearing. Recently DSC-RX100 has been released and it looks like a decent photo tool, though I wonder how its video would fare.

I know I'd miss the zoom on HX9V, for both the video and photo, as well as 24mm wide angle.

I've been thinking about upgrading to RX100, but the price tag does not make it attractive and probably 5n would be a better choice instead.

What do you think?
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by YLK  /t/1416925/sony-hx9v-vs-dsc-rx100#post_22156372


I have been using HX9V for a year now, bought it just for the video, and have been generally satisfied with the results, but lack of manual functions is something I miss. The quality fo photos is poor when watched in 100% - lot of smearing. Recently DSC-RX100 has been released and it looks like a decent photo tool, though I wonder how its video would fare.

I know I'd miss the zoom on HX9V, for both the video and photo, as well as 24mm wide angle.

I've been thinking about upgrading to RX100, but the price tag does not make it attractive and probably 5n would be a better choice instead.

What do you think?

YLK - That's a tough one. Have you considered the $408 HX200V ? Higher still resolution and wider zoom range than the HX9V, available now and less money than the $648 RX100 - which won't be available until July.


Good luck with your decision!


Bill
Hybrid Camera Revolution
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Bill, thanks for the recommendation. What the two models have in common - and what is a decisive factor for me - is the size. 5N is a different animal which came to my mind when I began to consider prices. RX100 has a 1" sensor which in small body makes it so unique and attractive. HX200 is big - especially if you compare its overgrown size to the small sensor hidden inside...
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Unfortunately Youtube is blocked in China, cannot watch the clip. What's your opinion?
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by YLK  /t/1416925/sony-hx9v-vs-dsc-rx100#post_22159560


Unfortunately Youtube is blocked in China, cannot watch the clip. What's your opinion?

that youtube video is posted by sonyhongkong. i dont read chinese, but i cut and past the youtube info


About Sony 香港官方YouTube頻道

全新Sony香港官方YouTube頻道 緊貼Sony最新動態、活動花絮、廣告及幕後製作!



Cyber-shot RX100全高清拍攝示範- 自動偵測人面對焦


全新Cyber-shot RX100支援AVCHD 1920x1080i 50p 全高清逐行掃瞄格式,以每秒50格拍攝。


產品網頁: http://www.sonystyle.com.hk/ss/product/cybershot/rx100/index.jsp


Published on Jun 17, 2012 by SonyHongKong


video number 7

Cyber-shot RX100 示範短片 - 花式調酒展示有趣Picture Effect in Video

Cyber-shot RX100 的相片風格設定可用於Video Mode內,花式調酒係其中一個有趣示範,大家不妨玩下啦



產品網頁: http://www.sonystyle.com.hk/ss/product/cybershot/rx100/index.jsp



Published on Jun 22, 2012 by SonyHongKong


Sony首次舉辦"俾試招募"活動~ 數位被選中的幸運兒正在測試才剛發佈的全新Cyber-shot RX100中!作品還被用作我們的網頁素材~ 証明非專業的您也能用我們的RX100 拍出神級的照片!!!


i am more into video camera now. so i am going to buy the pocketable sony hdr gw77. it was announced on the same day as the sony rx100. i have the hx9v and sony nex5. hx9v takes not so good picture indoor, while nex5 is not handy and pocketable.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Thanks for the links and info. HK is on the better side of the Great China Firewall, I'm behind it, so no chance to watch the clips...


I did not know about GW77, but wonder how it will fare in low light with its tiny sensor. Waterproof body is a real incentive though.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by YLK  /t/1416925/sony-hx9v-vs-dsc-rx100#post_22159603


I did not know about GW77, but wonder how it will fare in low light with its tiny sensor. Waterproof body is a real incentive though.

the sony gw77 has same sensor as sony cx580. and on sony u.s.a website, some sony cx580 user complaint about grainy indoor video (with little light present) , but ok for outdoor and normal indoor video. the customer review in bh photo say the sony cx580 is great in low light.


i love my sony hdr-550, but don't carry it with me all the time cause it bulky like the nex 5. i carry my samsung galaxy ii cellphone all the time, but video and photo is just ok and not great, at lease the gw77 is handy and pocketable, and take better video and photo than cellphone,


the next generation gw77 will have bigger sensor. but my kid is growing up and i don't want to miss the memorable video waiting for sony to introduce a gw77 with hdr550 sized sensor.


by the way, my wife went to thailand last year and took video with hx9v, and video came out very good.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
It seems that you also prefer portable still/video cameras over the bigger ones, even if the quality would suffer a little bit. I often climb mountains, carrying everything on my back; hence cannot take any full size DSLR. I like HX9V because it is small, light and portable. Besides there are very often situation when I can shoot video with it while the object thinks I'm taking photos - at best. Not to mention the smaller the less intimidating.

Problem is HX9V is a poor performed when it comes to still photos - hence the idea of buying RX100.


Enjoy being the father of a little one - they grow so fast and it is so easy to forget when they were little babies - and video is a great way to preserve the memories, both for you and the child.
 

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ylk, here is an article i found. i post the entire text just in case the great wall won't allow you to read ny times.


State of the Art

A Pocket Camera That Rivals the ProsBy DAVID POGUE

Published: June 27, 2012


This is a review of the best pocket camera ever made.


But first, a history lesson.


For years camera makers worried about competition from only one source: other camera makers. But in the end, the most dangerous predator came from an unexpected direction: cellphones.


Today, more photos are taken with phones than with point-and-shoot cameras. On photo sites like Flickr, the iPhone is the source of more photos than any real camera. No wonder sales of inexpensive pocket cameras are going down each year.


Cameras in phones are a delightful development for the masses. If you have your camera with you, you’re more likely to take photos and more likely to capture amazing images.


But in a sense they are also great for camera makers, which are being forced to double down in areas where smartphones are useless: Zoom lenses. High resolution. Better photo quality. Flexibility and advanced features. That’s why, even if sales of pocket cameras are down, sales of high-end cameras are up.


Now you know why the time is ripe for the new Sony RX100. It’s a tiny, pants-pocketable camera that will be available in late July for the nosebleed price of $650.


Or, rather, won’t be available. It will be sold out everywhere. I’ll skip to the punch line: No photos this good have ever come from a camera this small.


The first reason is easy to grasp. The Sony RX100 has a huge one-inch sensor — the biggest ever stuffed into a pocketable zoom camera. That’s not as big as the sensors in S.L.R.’s and other lens-swappable cameras. But it’s about four times the area of the previous pocket-camera photo-quality champs, like the Panasonic XZ-1 and the S100. (The RX100’s shiny black metal body looks exactly like them.)


A big sensor means big pixels, which gives you less grain in low light, better color depth and great dynamic range — the spectrum from darkest to lightest pixels.


A big sensor is also a prerequisite for that professional blurry background look. The RX100 easily achieves those soft backgrounds, a rarity in compact cameras.


The other star factor in the Sony is its Carl Zeiss lens, whose maximum aperture (lens opening) is f/1.8. That’s the widest aperture you can buy on a pocket camera. That, too, helps explain its ability to blur the background, and its spectacular results in low light.


(As on any camera, that aperture shrinks as you zoom in. When you’re fully zoomed on this camera, you’re down to f/4.9. That’s still better than the Canon’s fully zoomed aperture — f/5.9.)


But you know what? All of that is just shutterbug-speak for, “This camera takes amazing photos.” If you want to know what “huge sensor” and “big aperture” mean in the real world, stop reading and savor my annotated slide show of sample photos. There’s a small sampling at nytimes.com/personaltech , and a larger one at http://j.mp/LdUu4h .


There you’ll see what makes the RX100 such a revelation: insane amounts of detail and vivid, true colors. Hand-held twilight photos. A burst mode that can fire 10 frames a second. And macro shots — supercloseup — that will curl whatever’s left of your hair. A typical S.L.R. can’t get any closer than 10 inches from the subject with its included lens; the RX100 can nail focus only 2 inches away.


The RX100 is as customizable and manually controllable as an S.L.R., but it also has some impressive automated modes. They include Illustration (turns the photo into a colorful line drawing), High Dynamic Range Painting and the bizarre but sometimes enlightening Auto Crop. It creates a duplicate of your portrait, cropped in what it considers a better way. Sometimes, it’s right.


And Sweep Panorama. You swing the camera around you in an arc, pressing the shutter button the whole time. When you stop, there, on your screen, is a finished, seamless, 220-degree panorama. It’s the ultimate wide-angle lens. Canyons, crowd shots, Wal-Mart interiors — you won’t believe how often it’s useful.


For self-portraits, you can set a timer as usual. Or use its even smarter mode, in which the camera waits until it sees your face in the frame. Then it fires a shot every three seconds until you leave the scene.


As usual on today’s compacts, there’s no eyepiece viewfinder, a loss you may mourn. But the three-inch screen remains clear and bright even in bright sunshine, thanks to an extra white pixel Sony has nestled in among every set of red, green and blue.


The 1080p video capture isn’t quite the same festival of crispness as the photos. But you can use all the photo effects while filming. And while recording, you can zoom, change focus and even take still photos.


Sony has taken the debatable step of bringing back in-camera charging. That is, there’s no external charger for the 330-shot battery. Instead, the camera is the charger, whenever it’s connected to a USB jack, like the one on your laptop, or a wall outlet. Pros: No charger to pack and lose. Cons: You can’t charge a spare battery while you’re out shooting.


As with its role model, the Canon S100, you can program the function of the Sony lens ring. It can control zoom, focus, exposure, aperture, whatever. But unlike the Canon’s ring, the Sony’s ring doesn’t click as you turn it — sounds that get picked up when you’re capturing video.


On the hand, you don’t feel clicks either. The ring spins freely, which gives it a glassy, skidding feeling when you’re adjusting a setting with natural stopping points, like ISO (light sensitivity) or shutter speed.


That’s not the only niggling downside. The biggest one, of course, is that there’s very little room for physical buttons. All of the RX100’s hundreds of functions are packed into five buttons on the back, a mode dial on top, the ring around the lens and a four-way clickable ring on the back.


Novices will find it overwhelming. Then again, it’s fairly clear that this isn’t a camera for novices. Besides, eventually it all makes sense. You learn to press the Fn button whenever you want to adjust a photographic setting, or the Menu button to adjust a camera-setup setting.


The camera has a 3.6X zoom lens. The Canon S100 zooms more (5X zoom). On the other hand, the Sony takes 20-megapixel photos, versus 12 on the Canon.


Ordinarily I’m not a fan of cramming more pixels into a camera as a marketing ploy. High-megapixel photos take longer to transfer, fill up your hard drive faster and are overkill for most printing purposes.


But on Sony’s sensor, these are really useful pixels. You can crop away a huge part of the photo and still have lots of megapixels left for big prints; in effect, you’re amplifying the zoom.


One last downside: In certain photos, when I adjusted the overall contrast in Photoshop later, I noticed some vignetting — darkened areas at the corners.


This is an ideal second camera for professionals. And it’s a great primary camera for any amateur who wants to take professional-looking photos without having to carry a camera bag.


Of course, $650 is crazy expensive. You can buy a full-blown S.L.R. for that much.


But every time you transfer a batch of its pictures to your computer, you’ll understand why you spent that money. You’ll click through them, astonished at how often it’s successful in stopping time, capturing the emotion of a scene, enshrining a memory or an expression you never want to forget. You’ll appreciate that the RX100 has single-handedly smashed the rule that said, “You need a big camera for pro-quality photos.”


And if you care at all about your photography, you’ll thank Sony for giving the camera industry a good hard shove into the future.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/06/28/technology/personaltech/a-pocket-camera-even-pro-photographers-can-love-state-of-the-art.html?pagewanted=all
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Thank you for the article, very much appreciate posting it for me!


I had a look at RX100 in a local Sony shop here in Shanghai. The camera looks neat, very "professional" for a P&S, "substancial" in hand, but I definitively prefer the feel of the light and portable HX9. Shame the still photos from the latter are so poor, and there is hardly any chance that Sony will listen to the customers and release a FW to allow less Jpeg compression.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by YLK  /t/1416925/sony-hx9v-vs-dsc-rx100#post_22173454


Shame the still photos from the latter are so poor, and there is hardly any chance that Sony will listen to the customers and release a FW to allow less Jpeg compression.

sony post record annual loss $5.6 billion and 4th consecutive losses. the new ceo promised to put sony back to profit this year.


that is why i think from now on, sony will have to put good stuff into their new product. so consumer will came back and buy their product. or they will run out of business.


cannon still making money. so they are in no hurry to upgrade canon camcorder to newer technolgy and stay with 2meg photo, no 60p, and no so good stabilizer for their videocamera. i am waiting for canon to upgrade the hf g10 ( with better stabilizer, 60p and at least 12 megapixel photo). and i will definitely buy one.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by bsprague  /t/1416925/sony-hx9v-vs-dsc-rx100#post_22178018


Best selling camera at Amazon and you can't get one yet??? Or read a "real" review.
Best Selling Cameras on Amazon

Bill

lot of pre-order sales.


one review this from amazon


Very decent pocket camera, June 29, 2012

By E. Leung "[email protected]" (CO) - See all my reviews

(REAL NAME) This review is from: Sony DSC-RX100 20.2 MP Exmor CMOS Sensor Digital Camera with 3.6x Zoom (Electronics)

I bought it to "replace" my Nikon D90: I need a really small camera to go with me on my hiking trips, which I found even a D90 with a 24-120mm VR is too heavy for me. Originally I was considering Fuji X10, but delayed my purchase because of the WDS issue and eventually buying RX100 instead.


In short form:


Pros -

Solid build in compact form factor, and light

Very good wide angel performance

"Manually adjustable" flash

Reasonable ISO performance at its size (1600)


Cons -

Becomes f/2 after going up just 1mm in focal length

Lacking in telephoto performance; hoped it can do f/4 instead of f/4.9

No direct flash activation button

Want faster boot and shutdown time

Too much pixels; 12Mp or 16Mp may be better, especially if it can boost "usable" ISO to 3200


In long form:


The camera itself is very small, really small enough to fit in my pockets. However, most of the time it will come with me in my bag instead. Since it tightly fits in my pocket now, I don't expect it to fit in my pocket when I get the leather case which comes with the camera a month later (out of stock for now). RX100's boot and shutdown is around 3 seconds each. Wide angle at 28mm f/1.8 is really amazing, especially that it also have pretty short minimum focus range (roughly less than 10cm). Telephoto, one the other hand, is a bit weaker at 100mm f/4.9 with a not so great minimum focus range of around 60cm (really rough measurement). Even though the camera is having f/1.8 as the biggest aperture, it goes up very quickly to f/2.0 when the focal length just go up 1mm from the widest; However, it keeps itself in f/4 until going pass 66mm, which is fine, which is much better than many lenses already. The picture quality is very good (bokeh is pretty nice), and I see its "usable" high ISO is 1600, which is prefect for outdoor activities but a bit lacking for indoors.


The flash can be tilted up manually as a bounce fill-in flash, though I have to go through the menu instead of using a shortcut button to activate the flash. I tried to use my "old" MS Pro Duo card with the camera to no avail, so I keep using it with another older 4GB SD card instead. With the 4GB card installed, the camera reports that it has capacity to store around 160 photos in RAW and JPEG (small). I generally shot my photos in RAW for archive but upload JPEG to Facebook directly instead of using LR4 to convert and upload, hence my settings preference. I have no idea about its battery performance, but it should be adequate for one-day use in my case. The camera takes Micro USB for charging and comes with a [email protected] USB charger, and it seems that I can charge it by my computer. However, computer USB port generally supplies 500mA at most, which is 3 times lower than the charger, so I don't think it is a good way to recharge the camera. Yet, using Micro USB, it means I can also use a more generic "portable battery" that works for many devices instead of buying a spare battery, though it may seems more bulky.


end of review




i read from mirrorless rumor site that panasonic is coming out with it's own high end pocket camera next week.


**

The high end compact camera market just restarted (RX100, EX2 and LX7)

While mirrorless interchangeable system is our main thing it’s still interesting to see whats going on the the high end side of the compact cameras. They very often offer a real good image quality for a real pocketable size.


So it happens that David Pogue from the New York Times (Click here) writes about the new Sony RX100: “No photos this good have ever come from a camera this small.”. And latest rumor suggest that Panasonic will launch a similar camera (the LX7) next week! A bit less spectacular are the leaked specs of the EX2 with tiny 1/2,33 inch sensor (leak at Photorumors)


How big the interest in these cameras is…is also proved by the Overall camera ranking at Amazon (Click here to check it out). The ranking includes all cameras, compact, mirrorless and DSLR and the RX100 is on top!

http://www.mirrorlessrumors.com/
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Very interesting review on Amazon. Basically confirms my concerns re wide angle, zoom. My serious problem is with the smooth surface of RX100, since S90 slipped from my hands many times. RX100 is a camera that has to be operated with two hands, while slightly bigger mirrorless micro43 has grip big enough to make it possible to operate with one. But then the size becomes a problem...
No perfect camera.


Thanks a lot for the heads up re LX7 - I was not aware at all such camera will be released soon. I'm very curious how it will compete against Sony. Panasonics has been releasing very decent "professional" P&S, with good glass, so if big sensor is added upon it the final result should be very interesting.
 

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I'm definitely going to rent one to test when it's available. Great review and sample video from Andrew Reid at EOSHD here .


I have to admit, like the HX9V, I'm absolutely blown away by the image quality that Sony can pack into a small camera - and they've also done a great job of including full manual control of video and RAW stills - but I am disappointed that there's still no viewfinder, mic jack or ability to record videos longer than 30 minutes. Sigh.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by brunerww  /t/1416925/sony-hx9v-vs-dsc-rx100#post_22217562


I'm definitely going to rent one to test when it's available. Great review and sample video from Andrew Reid at EOSHD here .

I have to admit, like the HX9V, I'm absolutely blown away by the image quality that Sony can pack into a small camera - and they've also done a great job of including full manual control of video and RAW stills - but I am disappointed that there's still no viewfinder, mic jack or ability to record videos longer than 30 minutes. Sigh.
Bill,


When you do rent one, please comment on some of the things Markr041 has read in the manual. He posted them on this thread: Sony HDR-GW77: waterproof, dustproof, shockproof small HD camcorder .


He wrote that the RX100 manual says:


"If you use a function such as zoom while shooting a movie, the sound of the camera operating will be recorded. The sound of the MOVIE button operating may also be recorded when you press the MOVIE button to stop recording."


"During movie shooting, the digital zoom always operates when the zoom scale exceeds 3.6×, even if [Digital Zoom] is set to [Off]."


"[Clear Image Zoom] is not available while recording movies. The camera zooms slowly while recording movies."


He also noted that the zoom speed is not variable.


Bill
 
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