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That was from his VW1000 which is a completely different projector than the xxx series. I don't think we've seen any of the xxx series that can properly reproduce the patterns.
Hopefully they have fixed the really bad issues in the new VW760 - I really hope so, at least it should be one par with the 1000.
I hope not it's only a VW675 with laser.

But something tells me it is.:mad:
 

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Just look at this thread as an example. People are up in arms about banding, resolution, HDMI bandwidth issues, etc. and it is extremely difficult to separate the wheat from the chaff.
We've had two reports of banding from professional reviewers, Ekki and GrobiTV. What we're trying to do here is figure out where the issue is and what is impacted so we can separate the wheat from the chaff. I haven't seen anyone up in arms or saying they aren't buying one of these. I personally want to know if this issue is out there and what is impacted. Unless you have one to test I think Juan is doing a good job answering questions and throwing different video and patterns at this. :D
 

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We've had two reports of banding from professional reviewers, Ekki and GrobiTV. What we're trying to do here is figure out where the issue is and what is impacted so we can separate the wheat from the chaff. I haven't seen anyone up in arms or saying they aren't buying one of these. I personally want to know if this issue is out there and what is impacted. Unless you have one to test I think Juan is doing a good job answering questions and throwing different video and patterns at this. :D
No, I understand. I feel sorry for poor Juan. The guy hasn't even set up his screen yet.

I am also interested about this issue because I have a 385 on order.

I guess what I would like to see from this forum is one specific section for testing and data collection.

If there were a centralized thread where users could post a designated set of forum supplied test patterns and images, make a few measurements like noise measurements, contrast measurements, etc. Then make a few user comments like what equipment was used, the nature of the environment, and how well the posted photos represent the actual screen image. Then we could encourage as many owners to participate as possible so we would have a good cross-section of working projector specs and images for people to reference.

In fact, I would like to see all the opinions and comments be forbidden from that specific data forum so that it would just be a collection of reference information on each projector. I think that would be a much more sensible way to get information on projectors than just reading hundreds of posts scattered through out the forum with random pictures and sometimes misleading information.
 

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I don't know how large scale it really is? Does it effect 20%, 50%, 70%, 90%? How do we know? There isn't enough data. Possibly the Sony engineer was making an educated guess rather than a detailed diagnosis of the problem.

That is the problem with these types of issues. We as consumers don't have accurate data to access the problems. We can only guess. Your opinions are just your best guess based on your experience and second hand reports from a few owners. I am not saying you are wrong. I am just saying that it isn't exactly a scientific method of testing and review.

Just look at this thread as an example. People are up in arms about banding, resolution, HDMI bandwidth issues, etc. and it is extremely difficult to separate the wheat from the chaff.
Between Kris and I, we've had 6 or 7 4K SXRD models at our disposal in our own homes/theaters and we report seeing these issues in some form or another on them all. We would have to have some pretty bad luck for both of us to receive "lemon" units every single time. It would also be a very specific educated guess to be singling out a single piece of hardware in these units causing most of these issues. I don't think it was a guess at all. I was told the man at Sony EU was a higher up so I doubt it was a guess.
 

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Chrismannn,

So the banding issue may be attributed to the Sony PS4 Pro. I think this sounds about right because other owners have reported similar banding with other display devices.

Does he mention anywhere in the video about problems with this color banding when playing 4K60Hz HDR10 content from a streaming or a blu-ray player device?
no, neither of them are talking about the input device. only the fact is emphasized that gamers could have banding problems.
in general this was only a short test and more will follow soon.

both ekki and heimkinoraum say that the vw285 is able to play 4k60p hdr10.
but grobi.tv in his video mentioned that the vw285 will show in the settings 10 bit although in the BR-device 8bit is displayed.
the reason herefore should be that the w285 will avoid handshake problems with high data rates.
 

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no, neither of them are talking about the input device. only the fact is emphasized that gamers could have banding problems.
in general this was only a short test and more will follow soon.

both ekki and heimkinoraum say that the vw285 is able to play 4k60p hdr10.
but grobi.tv in his video mentioned that the vw285 will show in the settings 10 bit although in the BR-device 8bit is displayed.
the reason herefore should be that the w285 will avoid handshake problems with high data rates.
Under the HDMI section in the menu there is an option to switch that on/off so it displays 10bit. But if you do there could be situations were you have handshake problems.
That's what I picked out off the video, I think it was from GrobiTV video.
 

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No, I understand. I feel sorry for poor Juan. The guy hasn't even set up his screen yet.

I am also interested about this issue because I have a 385 on order.

I guess what I would like to see from this forum is one specific section for testing and data collection.

If there were a centralized thread where users could post a designated set of forum supplied test patterns and images, make a few measurements like noise measurements, contrast measurements, etc. Then make a few user comments like what equipment was used, the nature of the environment, and how well the posted photos represent the actual screen image. Then we could encourage as many owners to participate as possible so we would have a good cross-section of working projector specs and images for people to reference.

In fact, I would like to see all the opinions and comments be forbidden from that specific data forum so that it would just be a collection of reference information on each projector. I think that would be a much more sensible way to get information on projectors than just reading hundreds of posts scattered through out the forum with random pictures and sometimes misleading information.
Juan is fighting the good fight for sure. This is how legends are born :p. I like your idea a lot and definitely excited for the folks getting these first and a blind buy no less. Everyone is doing the community a great service.
 

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Under the HDMI section in the menu there is an option to switch that on/off so it displays 10bit. But if you do there could be situations were you have handshake problems.
That's what I picked out off the video, I think it was from GrobiTV video.
yes, you're right. when in the settings hdmi will be switched from standard to improved than the vw285 displays 10bit for a successful handshake. the br-device is just showing the real 8bit and so banding can occur.
 

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I don't know how large scale it really is? Does it effect 20%, 50%, 70%, 90%? How do we know? There isn't enough data. Possibly the Sony engineer was making an educated guess rather than a detailed diagnosis of the problem.

That is the problem with these types of issues. We as consumers don't have accurate data to access the problems. We can only guess. Your opinions are just your best guess based on your experience and second hand reports from a few owners. I am not saying you are wrong. I am just saying that it isn't exactly a scientific method of testing and review.

Just look at this thread as an example. People are up in arms about banding, resolution, HDMI bandwidth issues, etc. and it is extremely difficult to separate the wheat from the chaff.
I don't think we are looking at a situation where the projector does not meet the design requirements. My thought is that Sony knows about this issue and could not fix these problems without incurring additional costs that would put the price point or profit point too far away from their target. As long as the projector can show netflix 4k and play UHD movies then they have satisfied 98% of the population. I think we are an extreme niche group. Most people buying these projectors are getting them installed by their contracted AV Specialist company.

Remember that most people that are not on this forum will see banding while gaming and not give a second thought to it. One of my employees just can't understand why he would ever need more subwoofer than his single 10" sunfire and thinks it can produce "all the necessary sounds" in a movie. He thinks I am crazy for having the two JTR 18" and two dual 15" Seaton Submersive.
 

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Since early signs show there might be banding with 4k hdr at 60Hz, i just wanted to know would this banding issue be solved if HDR was to be switched off? Or is 4k 60 Hz in itself a problem?
Would it be possible to do something like 4k 60Hz SDR with REC 2020 (Wide color gamut)?
@TheBrandon @Seegs108 Anyone?
 

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Since early signs show there might be banding with 4k hdr at 60Hz, i just wanted to know would this banding issue be solved if HDR was to be switched off? Or is 4k 60 Hz in itself a problem?
Would it be possible to do something like 4k 60Hz SDR with REC 2020 (Wide color gamut)?
@TheBrandon @Seegs108 Anyone?
I don't have a 385 to test but the easiest way to test would be to force a 4K 60p signal at 8bits to see if the issue is gone. This is easy to test on a PC with a game. I'm not sure of the capabilities of all these UHD BD players so I don't know how easy to test this out on them .
 

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No, I understand. I feel sorry for poor Juan. The guy hasn't even set up his screen yet.

I am also interested about this issue because I have a 385 on order.

I guess what I would like to see from this forum is one specific section for testing and data collection.

If there were a centralized thread where users could post a designated set of forum supplied test patterns and images, make a few measurements like noise measurements, contrast measurements, etc. Then make a few user comments like what equipment was used, the nature of the environment, and how well the posted photos represent the actual screen image. Then we could encourage as many owners to participate as possible so we would have a good cross-section of working projector specs and images for people to reference.

In fact, I would like to see all the opinions and comments be forbidden from that specific data forum so that it would just be a collection of reference information on each projector. I think that would be a much more sensible way to get information on projectors than just reading hundreds of posts scattered through out the forum with random pictures and sometimes misleading information.
Greg,

You seem very knowledgeable about the potential issues we are seeing. Would you be willing to provide a very brief update post every time new information comes in, in order to understand where we are. You could title it "UPDATE".

Maybe we can all decide what key issues we need to understand:
1.) Can it play 4k UHD HDR discs in 24p without banding? (then list the technical 4:2:2 or whatever :))
2.) Can it play 4k UHD HDR discs in 60p without banding? And if banding how many movies are actually produced like this?
3.) 60 Hz PS4 Pro UHD HDR without banding
4.) 30 HZ PS4 Pro UHD HDR without banding
5.) Some resolution test pattern?
 
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Since early signs show there might be banding with 4k hdr at 60Hz, i just wanted to know would this banding issue be solved if HDR was to be switched off? Or is 4k 60 Hz in itself a problem?
Would it be possible to do something like 4k 60Hz SDR with REC 2020 (Wide color gamut)?
@TheBrandon @Seegs108 Anyone?

@Chrismannn is the best source as he can properly translate what professionals are seeing that have hands on.
 

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Here's hoping it is possible, it would be a deal saver for me personally.
This matters a great deal to me as well. When Juan has his setup I am sure he'll want to verify things are working for his needs. He is not a gamer but may want to test for streaming.
 

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I don't have a 385 to test but the easiest way to test would be to force a 4K 60p signal at 8bits to see if the issue is gone. This is easy to test on a PC with a game. I'm not sure of the capabilities of all these UHD BD players so I don't know how easy to test this out on them .
Thanks for the reply buddy. Sorry for all the requests @Juan Granados but do you think it would be possible for you to try this? Maybe trying the same content on which you noticed the banding, but this time try it with 8 bit to see if the banding is eliminated. If it works then it would mean we can atleast play games in 4k with SDR (And hopefully wide color gamut) at 60Hz without banding, and it would also mean we could watch 60Hz movies such as billy lynn's long halftime walk in the same way and without banding!
 

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This matters a great deal to me as well. When Juan has his setup I am sure he'll want to verify things are working for his needs. He is not a gamer but may want to test for streaming.
Definitely, if it can be possible then i can definitely forgive not being able to do 4k hdr 60Hz, just because of the very good pricing on these models! Besides, some people actually prefer doing 4k SDR Rec 2020 over 4K HDR, so being able to do that for games is a compromise i'd be more than happy to make!
 

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Thanks for the reply buddy. Sorry for all the requests @Juan Granados but do you think it would be possible for you to try this? Maybe trying the same content on which you noticed the banding, but this time try it with 8 bit to see if the banding is eliminated. If it works then it would mean we can atleast play games in 4k with SDR (And hopefully wide color gamut) at 60Hz without banding, and it would also mean we could watch 60Hz movies such as billy lynn's long halftime walk in the same way and without banding!
I agree. If we can get better on screen resolution than the new JVC e-shift products and only have to put the PS4 Pro into SDR using an HD Fury then this might be acceptable. Not great but better than any other solution from Sony or another manufacturer.
 

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Greg,

You seem very knowledgeable about the potential issues we are seeing. Would you be willing to provide a very brief update post every time new information comes in, in order to understand where we are. You could title it "UPDATE".

Maybe we can all decide what key issues we need to understand:
1.) Can it play 4k UHD HDR discs in 24p without banding? (then list the technical 4:2:2 or whatever :))
2.) Can it play 4k UHD HDR discs in 60p without banding? And if banding how many movies are actually produced like this?
3.) 60 Hz PS4 Pro UHD HDR without banding
4.) 30 HZ PS4 Pro UHD HDR without banding
5.) Some resolution test pattern?
I don't think I know anymore than anyone else about these issues. I am getting my information from the same place you guys are and I don't have a projector to test.

Chrismannn speaks German and seems to know what it real and what isn't because he can understand the videos of the reviewers with the actual hardware.

If I understand Chrismannn correctly there is no issue with running [email protected] with HDR10. The new projectors handle the bandwidth fine. He said that there was no mention of an issue with banding when playing blu-ray [email protected] with HDR10. So that is good news as it suggests the hardware is fine.

He did say the reviewers were talking about banding issues in general with certain games under certain circumstances and that it was unclear about if this was a projector issue, a PS4 Pro issue, or just an issue in general with HDR10 Gaming that is due to programming of the game.

He did say that they were going to run more tests and report back.
 
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