[alacazam]

Can anyone tell me if WCIA is broadcasting in either DT or HDTV 24hr. a day? I Just installed new antennas and on my Hughes e86 receiver it shows WCIA-DTas being channel 3.1. antennaweb.org says it should be channel 48. I guess the receiver has remapped it to 3.1 but I am not getting ANY signal what so ever??? Not getting any signal for WICS channel 42 in Springfield either? I am using Winegard Prostar 9220 antennas up about 35ft. and I do get WAND and another local DT station on channel 23 I believe.

Could my problem just be that the antennas need more directional adjustment? I was very careful in my installation to try and get the antennas as close to the advertised degree settings as possible but is it possible that I could need more adjustment? Do I have to be EXACT on the money as far as the antennas being set to the degrees stated at antennaweb.org? Thanks for any help!

 

[Ken H]

Be specific with topic titles, see my edit.

 

[jdmcdonald]

It'c complicated.


WCIA and WCFN are both transmitting digitally from TWO

sites, and CBS is NOT HD.

That is, there are TWO physical channels ... 48 and 53 ...

that will get you both CBS and UPN.


48 is halfway between Champaign and Monticello, and

53 is much closer to Springfield. 48 is on the same tower as

the actual physical ch. 3 analog, and 53 is on the same tower as

49 analog.


All are PITIFULLY low power, but here in Champaign ch

48 comes in very strong ... 53 is absolutely invisible. In Springfield

48 will be invisible ... try punching in 53 by hand and trying to ffind

a signal.


WICS ch 42 is also pitifully low power and low antenna height

but is on the air. It is on the same tower as WICS analog.


Currently WICD ch. 41 is suffering from a wrong PSIP setting and

takes avbbout 15 seconds to tune in on my Samsung box ... I have no idea if WICS is sick too. Try tuning by hand to ch 42.



If you are IN Springfield you should be able to get them all. They will

drop off rapidly to the west.


Doug McDonald

 

[alacazam]

Thanks for the reply. I live in Decatur ( forgot that info which would help quite a bit ) I think your answer is probably my problem. I thought I would ask BEFORE climbing back up and changing anything. Like I said in my first post, I can only receive Channels 17-DT and 23-DT. Both these Transmitters are just maybe 5 or 6 miles away from where I am located. So from your explaination of what is going on I guess I won't be receiving any Champaign or Springfield stations soon will I? Do you happen to have any information when they will be powering up more so we will be able to receive them?

 

[jdmcdonald]

Ch 48 is full height and 31 miles .... you should be able to get it

with a good antenna, even at low power. A mast mounted

preamp will help. Ch. 53 should also be workable.


The NBC stations are another matter .... they are Sinclair and

pathetic. Low height and power. I doubt if you will get them

until they are full height. Then it will be easy to get WICS even

at low power.


Try 48 and 53 first. Again, NOTE: you will not get more channels

by getting both ... they both transmit both CBS and UPN.


Doug McDonald

 

[alacazam]

Thanks for your help Doug. I am going to give the antennas a little adjustment when I have time and someone can be here to watch the signal strength meter while I do the adjustment. I know I should be able to get these stations. Any ideas or suggestions are apreciated. I really don't want to invest in more equipment right now if I can prevent it.

Carl

 

[MAX HD]

Quote:

Originally posted by jdmcdonald It'c complicated. WCIA and WCFN are both transmitting digitally from TWO sites, and CBS is NOT HD. That is, there are TWO physical channels ... 48 and 53 ... that will get you both CBS and UPN. 48 is halfway between Champaign and Monticello, and 53 is much closer to Springfield. 48 is on the same tower as the actual physical ch. 3 analog, and 53 is on the same tower as 49 analog. All are PITIFULLY low power, but here in Champaign ch 48 comes in very strong ... 53 is absolutely invisible. In Springfield 48 will be invisible ... try punching in 53 by hand and trying to ffind a signal. WICS ch 42 is also pitifully low power and low antenna height but is on the air. It is on the same tower as WICS analog. Currently WICD ch. 41 is suffering from a wrong PSIP setting and takes avbbout 15 seconds to tune in on my Samsung box ... I have no idea if WICS is sick too. Try tuning by hand to ch 42. If you are IN Springfield you should be able to get them all. They will drop off rapidly to the west. Doug McDonald

Doug,you're right,this is confusing.At any rate,I need some help concerning reception of WCFN UPN49,that I had a couple of weeks ago.The receiver I use is an RCA ATSC11,which is very similar,if not identical,to the Samsung T-151.After doing a channel scan the receiver locked on and saved several channels from the Decatur,Champaign,Springfield area.


WCIA was in the channel list remapped as 3-1 and 3-2 if memory serves me correctly,and WCFN was listed seperately as TV-49-1 WCFN-DT.I'm tying to figure out if WCFN actually came in on DT-53,or came in on DT-48 and remapped to 49-1.Right before I did the channel scan I noticed Analog UPN49 was blasting in full tilt,which prompted me to do the scan.


Any help on this is greatly appreciated.Here's a link to my site that shows the screengrab,with the channel banner overlay.

http://community-2.webtv.net/GregBarker/DXPHOTOS/


Thanks

 

[jdmcdonald]

I can only help by saying that on Ch. 48 you get 3-1 and 49-1. I've seen

NOT [edited] a peep from 53.


The only guaranteed ways to tell whether you are getting 53 or 48

is either to simply punch in 48 and see what happens, and then

punch in 53 and see what happens, OR use antenna pointing

as a clue, using a directional antenna.


Doug

 

[MAX HD]

Quote:

Originally posted by jdmcdonald I can only help by saying that on Ch. 48 you get 3-1 and 49-1.

Ok,you're saying that WCIA DT-48 is running two sub channels,one as 3-1,and one as 49-1? I've seen a lot of station remapping where one DT carries multiple nets,but they always remap to the main channel(ie Ch3 in this case),then to the designated sub channel,not to the subs analog counterpart,in this case 49.


Well,I guess this is not much screwier than one of your semi-locals that came on the air recently.WUSI-DT-19 in Olney,IL whose analog channel is on 16 remapped to Ch2-2 to 2-5 with four subs and the channel ID slot was "CH3".See the pic on my website.


Thanks

 

[alacazam]

Doug,

I tried adjusting the antennas both directional and up and down with NO added results. The ONLY stations I receive are 23-1 and 17-1 WAND. I wonder if this has anything to do with my Hughes HIRD E86 receiver not being the ideal receiver for what I am trying to do? I've read where Hughes receivers are supposed to be terrible at receiving off air digital signals. Would a Preamp help that much if my case given I am getting NO DT signal? What all would you suggest doing given the results I have at this point?

Thanks again for any help and suggestions.

Carl

 

[jdmcdonald]

Well, the Hughes does not have the best reputation. The Samsung

T-351 (and older T-151 ... get the new one) is supposed to be better

in some ways. However, it has a poor RF noise figure and a

cheap Recoton preamp helps 4 dB. A quality 7775 or 7777 will

help a bit more.


But remember ... if you get first rate analog pictures on CBS, NBC, and

UPN, you will get no better from their digital signals.


I can give no advice, other than to note that returns from Best Buy

are free and they sell the STBs and the cheap preamps.


Soon you will be able to get PBS from WILL-DT, channel 9,

no problem. That assumes you have a VHF antenna, of course.


Doug

 

[alacazam]

Well,

I guess I'll try the Preamp first and then possibly the Samsung receiver. No I do not have the VHF antenna, Just (2) Winegard Prostar 9022's which are dedicated UHF Yagi style antennas. I just BARELY get an analog signal (VERY SNOWY) from Springfield WICS analog which I don't understand either???? I feel it should be a lot better that it is. Well I thank you for your help and if you think of anything else I should know or something I should try just post it. I check in here most every evening.

 

[jdmcdonald]

9022 antenna and no signal from WICS in Decatur??


If this has been true for a long time there is something terribly

horribly wrong ... you should get a great picture. WICS is 28 miles

from Decatur, 1.5 megawatts analog power, on a 1200 foot tower.


Either you are behind a corn processing plant or there is something

broken somewhere, or you didn't test early this summer ....

WICS and WICD are playing around with their antennas and towers

and they may be at low power at the moment for WICS ... call and ask.

WICD has been up and down, but at 15 miles to me they have never

ceased to have a great analog picture.


The good news is that soon they will be at full power and height and

eventually ... well before Hell freezes over ... in HD. You WILL be

able to get them with no problem .... unless you are really

truly behind something really big.


Doug McDonald

 

[alacazam]

Doug,

Not behind anything at all except a Maple tree about 30 ft. away. BEFORE I adjusted the antennas yesterday I did not get anything in the way of an analog or Digital signal. After doing the adj. Up and Down and Horizonal I now get a VERY Snowy picture (analog) for WICS (20) in Springfield. Fox (55) Springfield analog is the exact same picture, VERY Snowy. I just find ALL this hard to believe after reading what all the other people are getting in the way of stations and Digital signals.

I have EVERYTHING BRAND NEW, RG-6 Coax, Antennas, Mast Mounted Antenna Combiner, Antennas and I use the Good Snap n Seal Coax connectors. I wasn't TRYING to get a good analog signal so I didn't TRY to adjust the antennas for that purpose. I was just trying to get a WCIA-DT signal and when I finished I went through the channels and found I did have WICS and WRSP analog but very snowy??????

Carl

 

[MAX HD]

Carl,

What are you doing using (2) Prostar 9022's?


What model number combiner are you using,and what is it for?


Greg B

 

[jdmcdonald]

I normally get "very snowy" signals from 20 and 55 too .... BUT ....

I'm in Champaign and using a Rat Shack double bowtie antenna

set in the window. You are 40 miles closer!


What you have is a broken something. The center conductor in

one of the F connectors is bent over and not connecting to the other

side, or the center and shield are shorted somewhere, or

something equally horrible. Or a preamp in the line that is either not

powered up or overloaded or just plain broken.


Get a portable TV and a long extension cord and start at the

antenna and see where the problem is.


As to two prostars, he PROBABLY has one pointed east and

one west. Hopefully two downleads and a switch at the TV ....

but with all-digital he may be able to just use a combiner ...

I can do that ... use two narrow angle Yagis and combine,

works fine for digital, not so good for analog. But I don't need

Yagis here in Champaign except for 27.


Doug McDonald

 

[alacazam]

Yes, 2 Prostar 9022's, one East 62 degrees and one West 259 degrees. Winegard CC787 2 set coupler used to combine the signals from both antennas to one downlead (Coax). If I had some sort of break or serious problem why do I get WAND-DT 17-1 and WBUI-DT-23-1 PERFECT? I guess this is what has me so puzzled. If I didn't get those so good I would understand some sort of installation or equipment problem. I have these installed about 30ft. up with no obstructions except for the Maple tree I mentioned earlier. I assume my antenna salesperson told me the correct orientation of the antennas. "The LONGEST portion af the antenna pointing towards the station with the V reflecting the signal back to the longest portion of the antenna. Like this, STATION ___________> Well, I tried, hope you understand.



Carl

 

[alacazam]

By the way Doug. I do not have a Preamp installed. That was my next POSSIBLE attempt. I am also wondering if these antennas are TOO directional? Would I be better off with the Channel Master 4028 or the 4 bay model which I can't remember the model number? I'm NOT GIVING UP!!!! I am going to try whatever suggestions you guys come up with. I may have to wait until the weekend so I have help.


Carl

 

[jdmcdonald]

You are getting WBUI and WAND because they are so close.


Before you worry about anything else, you need to get perfect pictures

on 20 and 55. I'm in Champaign and I get watchable pictures

on them with a bowtie antenna 20 feet off the ground. You should

also get respectable pictures on 3 and 12 with those monster

antennas.


Disconnet the combiner and try one antenna at a time. Combiners

are very bad for analog. First, they will generate ghosts. Second,

you will lose signal because part of the signal coming in on

one antenna will simply radiate out the other.


Don't buy ANYTHING yet ... those antennas are NOT too directional.

Just fix whatever is wrong.


Doug

 

[alacazam]

Doug, Thanks for the information. I'm sure you are correct. Well I am going to do just what you said and disconect the combiner, run from one antenna at a time, do some adjusting until I get the 20 and 55 in with a GOOD Strong picture. I will probably not be able to do anything until the weekend so I will be back on here after I either find the source of the problem or I am STUMPED AGAIN. Stay Tuned for my update. :>)



Thanks for your help and advise again.


Carl