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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I know this is probably an old topic, but since the release of the Trilogy on DVD is not slated until 2005 sometime I was curious...


Which version truly is the ULTIMATE COLLECTION?


There is a '95 release of the DEFINITIVE COLLECTION LD, and there is a '97 release of the SPECIAL EDITION LD.


They are both 9 discs in CAV with lots of bonus literature, with THX digital enhancements. I know that the '95 release does not have the any of the new material that was added like the '97 release does (and the theatrical re-release in theatres), but is that it?


Which one is regarded as THE LD set to own???
 

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I have both though they are not right in front of me so I may leave some things out but:


The "Definitive" is not Dolby Digital encoded and is not the "special editions" of the trilogy. It features quite a bit of ancillary material on the making of and the like but not as much as we have all become accustomed to with some DVD releases. Also this collection is CAV so there are more breaks.


The "Special Edition" collection is of course the "special editions" of the trilogy and offers Dolby Digital soundtracks. There is really no extra material. This collection is CLV.


As far as which is better I can't answer that. I like them both. I guess it really depends on how you feel about the special editions. Some people loath them.
 

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The THX ('95) versions have the original films and I'd get those. I also have the '97 re-release versions with the changes and AC-3 sound myself. The THX versions are usualy available on E-bay for $10 to $20 each. The AC-3 sets usually sell for $150 or more. Best wishes!
 

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Much as the P/S films are hated -- the early releases were obviously not LTX and were time compressed to boot to make them fit on 1 disc.


As best as I an tell there were 2 versions of SW in 1983 -- one released by 20th Century at 116 min. and one from Fox Video at 118 minuted plus a CAV 5 sided version. There was P/S Fox Video version from 1992 -- is this the same transfer or was there anything else different besides adding a Digital sound track. Were the 116/118 versions the same other than the labelling and compression and what was the reason for 2 separater studios

releasing the same disc simulaneously. I'm pretty sure I knew that at one time, but have long since forgotten.


Empire Strikes had a CLV and CAV from 1985 again with the CLV being time compressed. There was a 1992 P/S version as well. Same or different than the earlier release.


RotJ had a 1986 CLV only P/S and 1992 P/S version. Best as i can tell there wasn't an equivalent CAV disc.


That 9 versions of P/S -- correct? Am I missing any?


Letterbox:

1989 and 1992 Special Widescreen Edition SW (any differences)

1999 Spec. Ed. Widescreen ESB

1990 Special Ed. Widescreen RotJ

1993 CAV Trilogy Definitive Edition 9 disc

1995 THX 'Faces' Set CLV

1997 SE Trilogy 5 disc -- that is still strange not to make it a 6 disc box.


Are there any other domestic discs?
 

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I have both box sets. As was stated previously, it really depends on how you feel about the whole original vs. special edition issue. I purchased the Definitive Collection first because I prefer the original cuts without the extra effects. But I also wanted to see how much better the second release was in terms of audio/video performance.


Oddly enough, I just watched A New Hope tonight. First I put in the SE version, and I watched it up until the Cantina scene. I then decided that I couldn't stand to see Han's silly digital dodge maneuver, so I put it away and pulled out the Definitive version. I watched some of the earlier scenes in order to compare the two before I got back to the Cantina scene.


I noticed no difference in image quality between the two on my 32" Wega with a Pioneer CLD-79. Differences might be more noticeable on a larger screen or better LD player, but I couldn't see them.


As far as the sound is concerned, I think the PCM track on the Definitive Collection passed through my Onkyo 797 (using Pro Logic II) was much better than the Dolby Digital track on the SE set. Much more powerful with better imaging for the background music. The Dolby Digital track sounds muffled in comparison.


I bought both sets in January on ebay. I paid $80 shipped for the Definitive Collection and $110 shipped for the SE set. If I had it to do over again, I'd just get the Definitive Collection.


Greedo shooting first = crap
 

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I have the THX CLV Originals. They ain't DVD, but they still look very good and they also sound excellent. If the DVD's end up being the so called Special Editions, I'll pass on the first two, as I HATE the changes. I am no fan of JEDI, other than the last third, so I'll buy that one for the Luke/Vader/Emperor stuff, which i absolutely love.
 

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I have the Special Edition AC3 "cgied" :D and the THX CAV 1993 edition.


I agree with you guys that the PCM on both editions in fact sound natural, warmer, more detailed and most of the time as thunderous if not more than the AC3 edition. ( reminds me I haven't compared the AC3 and PCM track of TPM :D !! ).


I don't know if anyone noticed but the AC3 edition of ESB, when Lando comes back to rescue Luke hanging on that ladder, the score has been altered, shortened, as far I remember ( been some time I haven't listened to both editions ).

I find the image on the AC3 edition to be however cleaner, less video noise.


for die hard fans, both edtions "should" be owned :D


the scene with the Emperor and Luke and Darth, together with the ongoing battle against the incomplete death star is amazing!
 

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Discounting the variable of which one has better content, I would say the CLV SE is the better version. They did more than just add special effects and add cut scenes. In the orignal empire strikes you will notice the background slopes of the mountain veiwable through the translucent dash of the speeder. On the Special Edition this is reduced quite a bit. It has to do with the way they superimposed bluescreen effects in the old days. With the special editions the digitally corrected it.


Another reason is that you can see digital artifacts on the orignal LDs and a lot less on the Special Edition. They must have used a more primitive loss type compression.


Personally I prefer parts of the orignal better (the original deathstar dog fight) and parts of the special edition better (bespin).
 

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I also own both sets, and to be honest, I personally think that the original "Definitive Collection" is the better set to have. It's actually the reason why I bought my first LD player. The Special Edition set is cool, but it almost seems like a "rush job." The DD mix doesn't really thrill me, but some of the changes that were made (Bespin, the attack on the 1st Death Star,) are cool to watch as well. Also, I like having both versions of the movie, so that I can show my kids when they're old enough. I just watched ANH:SE and ESB:SE last night, but I'm probably going to watch the original of Jedi tonight instead of the SE.


One other thing that was mentioned previously is the amount of extras available on the Definitive set, the amount is immense. Plus, you'll get the actual first commentary track ever done by George Lucas (The TPM DVD states that it has the 1st,) which is actually pretty cool to listen to.
 

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one thing I have not tried ( I wonder how that can be ??) is listening to the special edition PCM surround track instead of the AC3. go to do that. but I think I read somewhere the level was lower than on the AC3 track.


the definitive 1993 edition PCM has not that problem but don't take my word for it , I have to check.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Hmmm... It sounds like the consensus here is to go with the Definitive Collection, and of course I bought the SE on Ebay!!!


Some of you guys/gals have nearly convinced me to buy both sets, although I'll probably be sleeping on the couch the next week or so if I make this purchase. What to do, what to do... I guess if I am on the couch I can watch both versions.
 

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Other than the CAV and the extras, I don't think there is much difference between the Definitive Collection and the THX separates. You can get the THX ones fairly cheaply (like $10 a piece) if you just want the original movies.
 

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I have both (Definitive and DD Trilogy) but prefer the upgraded sound on the DD version. Not to be high maintenance but flipping those CAV discs every 30 minutes is a pain in the butt!


Jeff
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by thebland
I have both (Definitive and DD Trilogy) but prefer the upgraded sound on the DD version. Not to be high maintenance but flipping those CAV discs every 30 minutes is a pain in the butt!
If I didn't have a double-sided player, that would most certainly drive me crazy as well. Even having to change discs twice is a bit annoying. I'm thinking of backing them up on DVD for convenience, and just in case the official DVD release ends up being the SE only.


I pray daily that Lucas will follow Spielberg's lead with E.T. and put both versions out. Then the fans can decide.


Have to disagree with you on the "upgraded" sound. The PCM track on the original run through a PLII decoder is much better than the DD version.
 

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I am particularly complementary of the LFE on the DD version.


Bass not nearly as powerful on the DC.


Jeff
 

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Hold onto those laserdiscs. They may be the only way for use to enjoy the trilogy unmolested. :(

Quote:
As for the slightly more imminent Attack of The Clones DVD, McCallum confirmed that he’s currently persuading Lucas to provide a commentary track. But can we expect much of the four hours of footage that comprised the uncut film to crop up as a special Director’s Cut? "Oh you’re definitely going to get it all," assured McCallum. "With George… he’ll keep on changing the film till the day he dies."
From Empire Online
 

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Thirdkind: have you checked the PCM track on the 1997 edition ? I got to check it myself, probably never did ( as far as I remember ).


as Matt puts it rightly ( check my post today on the Empire news ), it seems Goergy won't give neither the 1993 nor the 1997 versions on dvd :mad:


guys, what would it take to copy those laserdiscs on dvd, and with a nice result (image, video). I suppose the PCM can be copied easily but it takes space... this is not a booleg idea but just for guys who spent mucho dinero for their laserdisc editions and would like a backup copy on dvd.
 

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I never even bothered to check the SE's PCM track. Maybe I'll do so this weekend. I'm sure I'll be all jazzed to try it after seeing AOTC tonight in Edgewater, NJ. DLP cinema dude :D


I don't have a DVD recorder, so I don't know how it would come out. I've heard some players have excellent filters that can actually clean up and improve the image of analog sources like LD. I'm also not sure if they're capable of recording a true PCM soundtrack bit for bit. Somehow I don't think it would fit on the disc. I think I might just pick up an extra set of the Definitive Collection and store it in a safe place in case the worst comes to pass.


I share your grief over the DVD release of the original trilogy. It has been rumored for years that Lucas wouldn't release the original untouched films on DVD. I won't give up hope yet since the DVDs are 3 years away, but it seems to be getting less and less likely.


If Lucas were smart, he'd release the original films AND the finished (i.e., ruined) Special Editions in separate box sets. I can guarantee you that most Star Wars geeks would buy both. Lucas gets to "finish" his films as he thinks they should be, and the hardcore fans would get the originals that they want so badly. Everybody wins, and Lucas makes a ton of cash.


I respect Lucas's work, but at some point Star Wars became not just a series of movies, but a cultural icon. It's more than George's pet project now--it belongs to all of us in a way. Make all the changes you want, Mr. Lucas, but don't take away our right--yes, our right--to go back and see the fine films we grew up with. Spielberg got it right with E.T.; so can Lucas.


Can you imagine Kubrick having wanted to go back to 2001 and redo all of the effects with CG? And then telling us that he would never again release the original on newer formats? Pick any older sci-fi film that you could go back and "enhance" with "better" effects, and whatever film you choose, it doesn't hold a candle to the popularity of Star Wars.


That's why it's so important that we get our originals.
 
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