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Discussion Starter · #21 ·
Well I took the multi-switch out of the picture and it still occurred. So I tried unplugging from the back of the UTV. When I noticed it was really hot where the cables plug-in. I unplugged for five minutes and plugged back in and I was able to change to any channel without issue. So I am wondering if the heat right on the cable connections could be an issue. I propped the UTV up about 1 inch off the ground hoping the better airflow will reduce the heat and solve the problem.


Of course it has been in the exact location for several years without issue but I guess dust and stuff is probably building up inside.


I could be completely off base but from my work in computers I know that heat can cause some mighty strange things to happen.


We shall see if it continues to work for 24 hours and on.
 

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As others have mentioned if you have a desktop fan or maybe a USB fan you could try and rule out heat buildup as a concern.


An hour (or more) or so to "cool down" when making changes can also be helpful...


Hopefully the internal fan is still working and the vents are clean. If you decide to open the UTV for cleaning be sure to pull the access card FIRST!!


Keep us posted.
 

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Discussion Starter · #23 ·
Well it worked for a few days and this afternoon I went to record something and it was back on the searching for sat message. Unplugged the connections and it came right back. There does seem to be a lot of heat around the back vent of the UTV right on the cables which were pretty hot.


I have the UTV raised up around an inch or more so there is plenty of air flow now. I guess it is time to crack it open and see just how much dust has accumulated over the years.


And if that doesn't work my last try will be a USB fan.
 

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"Unplugged the connections and it came right back"


Have you been able to determine if you need to pull both connections or just one or the other on the UTV to get the signal back?


Have you swapped locations with the "Non-UTV" to see if cable connections from the wall to the receiver is bad? It's been a long time I've had issues with a "bad cable" but if you have a weak (RG-59 or damaged RG-6) cable in the setup I'd try swapping cables around to see if that changes anything. I've actually used "Non-RG6" cables on my UTV and DTivo without a problem but your "non-UTV" might have issues with that...


Heat Tip:


I've done this downstairs were I don't have a lot of space to work with. Instead of "stacking" the UTVs... I've got one standing on end. The power supply side (front left) is sitting on bottle caps and the internal fan side (front right) is facing up.


This does appear to effectively dissipate the heat without the use of additional fans.


Not everyone has the space to do something like this but it may be worth a try. It may look odd but you could even try tilting the UTV 30-45 degrees and remove the heat that way.


If you go with a fan... you might see past threads on this forum were I've mentioned my internal "PC Slot Blower Fan" modification. You take a PC Slot Blower Fan and flatten the "slot" plate and using twist ties or some machine screws you can attach it inside the back UTV vent above the tuners and power it off the Hard Drive...


Keeps it cool and doesn't cause any damage to the UTV's case, allowing you to return the UTV to "out of the box" condition with very little effort.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by cedeveloperx /forum/post/14987223


... I went to record something and it was back on the searching for sat message...

Wait - this seems to be a _new_ problem. As I understood it before, only the NON-UTV receiver was having the problem. The way I read the above quote, it is now the actual UTV that is searching for sat?
 

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Discussion Starter · #26 ·
No, it is the non-UTV that has the searching for Sat. The problem however seems to originate from the UTV and possible overheating. I still haven't had a chance to crack it open and check to see how much dust has built up. But it seems to go for a few days vs instantly now that I have it elevated.


I am also experimenting with turning it off at night, however I know that really doesn't do much since it technically doesn't really turn off.
 

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While the heating issue is something to address (I have a laptop cooler under my UTVs), the only thing I can see this doing to the signal is changing the tolerance and therefore the output voltage of the UTV jacks which I could see confusing the multiswitch somewhat, but this is not something that I can see confusing another receiver while the UTV continues to get clean signal.


With ENORMOUS respect to lgodave (he's been here a long time and has helped more than his fair share of folks), i still gotta believe that an upgraded, powerered, multiswitch is the answer here. HOWEVER, as I'm not the one paying for said multiswitch, I do agree you should try EVERYTHING else first.


Good Luck! When (if) you do fix the problem, please post the solution here.


--Eric
 

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I'm more then willing to try a powered Multi-Switch. It can rule out some issues.


Everyone's experience will vary... As someone had mentioned a powered switch might "mask" the issue if the powered switch "fixes" the problem.
 

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Discussion Starter · #32 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by lgodave /forum/post/15034651


A powered multi-switch? I'll keep my fingers crossed.

Well that was a waste of time and money. It actually works worse with the powered multi-switch. I didn't have a chance to get all the details but now it fails immediately where as at least before I would get 1-3 days before the sporadic channels stop working.
 

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I probably said it early on but you might want to "bypass" EVERYTHING and hook your Receivers up directly to the Dish LNB!


Some extension cords, "known" (store bought "high quality") good cables, and a "portable" (or not) TV or two. Not a pretty sight but if that causes issues (since you have already bypassed the Multi-Switch) then it's likely the Dish LNB or the Receiver(s).


Since our suspected "fix" only made things worse (not better) then I'm leaning toward a bad cable run (or two).


Before you go ALL OUT and hike outside with your gear... have you tried testing your Receivers off the Multi-Switch with just ONE SWITCH INPUT?


Since you now have a Powered Switch that AMPS up the problem now might be a good time to try this. Connect only one of two inputs to the Switch (you'll have 50% of all transponders Even or Odd). Connect up your receivers and see if the problem appears then try the other cable run. With luck you'll see one is flaky.


As you mentioned certain channels were causing this problem... It's likely that if you find which Multi-Switch Input "controls" those channels you'll see the problem disappear. The only problem then is you'll only have half the channels. As a test you might see if you "split" your LNB to TWO Switches. Switch 1 has Input A and Switch 2 has Input B. You test that and see if it causes a problem. (UTV gets Switch 1 while "non-UTV" gets 2) Swap spots. Only thing to figure out with all the Switches you have available is if you can "Isolate/Shield" (as we wanted to try earlier) the Receiver by Splitting off the "Bad" feed in such a way that the "Bad" and UTV Recievers each get it thinks is a complete "Clean" feed.


I must consider this a while... (Off to sharpen some pencils)
 

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One other note. Have you determined if using just Tuner One or Two on the UTV "fixes" the issue with the other Receiver? Have you "always" tested using Tuner One or Two when running tests? You might see if the results change the other way.
 

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My credibility may be shot here, but I've re-read this thread and have come up with this inventory:


UTV always works - both tuners - even after changing outputs on multiswitch


other reciever mostly works but has problems ONLY when UTV is connected



This tells me:

1. both LNB outputs are good

2. the cables from the LNB to the multiswitch are good

3. after trying mulitple multiswitches all with similar results - they can't ALL be bad


This seems to leave 2 possible culprits: the 'other' receiver itself, and the wire run from the 'other' receiver to the multiswitch.


Dave mentioned some good ideas to test for, but I can't help but think "it can't be this hard, can it?"
 

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Good point. Keep it simple. Don't want a Rat's Nest "fix" but since bypassing the Multi-Switch (tested/swapped both runs?) seems to not fix the issue... We need to try and isolate if it goes "bad" when being fed the "bad" channels and if it's "good" (both units) on just the Locals/Kids Channels... The switch bypass still allows BOTH even/odd transponders IN, so we can't be certain what "flips" out the receiver.


I'm leaning on a wire run issue. Boiled down it seems the "other" receiver is having issues on certain channels/transponders which suggests (if it's not the receiver itself) that the cable run for those channels isn't OK and the UTV/Powered Switch is making the issue worse.


Have you verified/checked that all the cable contacts are good/clean? I can remember suspecting a grounding block as being bad... It could easily be overlooked. Water might get in there and cause issues... Remember dielectric grease/petro jelly is a friend on outdoor contacts...



You could use the couplers from the switch bypass to temporarily over-ride the grounding block...
 

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Discussion Starter · #39 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by MightyEric /forum/post/15068185


My credibility may be shot here, but I've re-read this thread and have come up with this inventory:


UTV always works - both tuners - even after changing outputs on multiswitch


other reciever mostly works but has problems ONLY when UTV is connected



This tells me:

1. both LNB outputs are good

2. the cables from the LNB to the multiswitch are good

3. after trying mulitple multiswitches all with similar results - they can't ALL be bad


This seems to leave 2 possible culprits: the 'other' receiver itself, and the wire run from the 'other' receiver to the multiswitch.


Dave mentioned some good ideas to test for, but I can't help but think "it can't be this hard, can it?"

A couple of other details, when the tech came he replaced the feed from the dish to the multiswitch. When the UTV is unplugged from the multiswitch I have no issues at all (although I haven't let is sit like that for reasons such as my wife would kill me).


I am really leaning towards a problem with the other receiver I just can't wrap my head around why it would only fail when the UTV is hooked up.


I have not replaced the run from the multi-switch to the other receiver which is what I will try next, it is an older cable but all contacts looked clean, since it is only a five foot run I can easily swap that one out. I will try that tonight when I get home (with and without the powered multiswitch).
 

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Discussion Starter · #40 ·
Well I figured something interesting out not sure if it helps.


I finally figured out why it would occasionally work for days and other times only minutes or seconds.


There are certain channels that only work after a reset (unplug the UTV) two of them are 7 and 512. There are other channels that always work like 290 and 292.


So if I reset and I am on 7 it comes back. I can then flip continuously between 7 and 512 without any issue. As soon as I go to 290 or 292 and then back to 7 or 512 they stop working. Once they stop working I get no signal on the even transponders (actually that occurs before switching back so once I switch to an odd the even is gone). My guess is 7 and 512 are on the even while the others are on the odd. As long as I stay on the even I am fine, once I venture to any odd one the moment I go back to an even transponder channel the evens are gone.


If I unplug the line into the multi-switch that corresponds to the odd transponders then I can flip to any channel and back and it continues to work (well the odd transponder channels are blank but the evens still show).


And last thing to keep in mind, when I unplug the UTV (both lines) then I can flip back and forth between even and odd without any issues.
 
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