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Discussion Starter #1
Hi all...

This may be a well-known issue, though after some searching I couldn't find what I was looking for, so I thought I'd post about it.

I upgraded my HTPC about a year ago; it's running Windows 10 x64, and I'm using the onboard Intel 630 graphics.

Everything works pretty well, except for one thing - if I bring up some windows (browser windows, other apps, even some Windows settings panels), and minimize them for awhile, when I open them up again, they often will appear much smaller. The content will be the same, but the window itself will be smaller (so I have to drag out the corner to make it bigger again).

Since I'm running this on a 4k tv, and I want the icons and text to be readable, I've set general Windows display scaling to 200%.

When this window shrinking happens, it looks like the windows are about 1/2 their normal size; it's as if Windows SOMETIMES knows how to scale apps and its own components, but sometimes the apps think they are running in 100% scaling and their content would fit, but it won't.

I'm not sure why this happens only after a certain amount of time, and only when opening windows that have been minimized.

But it's damned frustrating.

I tried setting high-dpi overrides on apps, but with all combinations of settings, they always appeared blurry, so that's a no-go.

Anyone ever see this before, and have suggestions? Am I missing something, or is this a failing of Windows 10?

- Tim
 

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Hi all...

This may be a well-known issue, though after some searching I couldn't find what I was looking for, so I thought I'd post about it.

I upgraded my HTPC about a year ago; it's running Windows 10 x64, and I'm using the onboard Intel 630 graphics.

Everything works pretty well, except for one thing - if I bring up some windows (browser windows, other apps, even some Windows settings panels), and minimize them for awhile, when I open them up again, they often will appear much smaller. The content will be the same, but the window itself will be smaller (so I have to drag out the corner to make it bigger again).

Since I'm running this on a 4k tv, and I want the icons and text to be readable, I've set general Windows display scaling to 200%.

When this window shrinking happens, it looks like the windows are about 1/2 their normal size; it's as if Windows SOMETIMES knows how to scale apps and its own components, but sometimes the apps think they are running in 100% scaling and their content would fit, but it won't.

I'm not sure why this happens only after a certain amount of time, and only when opening windows that have been minimized.

But it's damned frustrating.

I tried setting high-dpi overrides on apps, but with all combinations of settings, they always appeared blurry, so that's a no-go.

Anyone ever see this before, and have suggestions? Am I missing something, or is this a failing of Windows 10?

- Tim
Do you leave your pc on when you shut your TV off? If so, windows gets the HDMI change event and internally changes resolution from 4K to 1080p or some smaller resolution, then resizes all the windows. When you turn the TV back on, the PC desktop reverts but those app windows dont.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Do you leave your pc on when you shut your TV off? If so, windows gets the HDMI change event and internally changes resolution from 4K to 1080p or some smaller resolution, then resizes all the windows. When you turn the TV back on, the PC desktop reverts but those app windows dont.
Yes, it's both my HTPC and my media server, so it's always running. Though I have noticed the windows changing even if I don't turn off the TV, just if they're minimized for awhile.

For the version of the issue that you mention, is there a workaround to make Windows STAY at 4k?

- Tim
 

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Yes, it's both my HTPC and my media server, so it's always running. Though I have noticed the windows changing even if I don't turn off the TV, just if they're minimized for awhile.

For the version of the issue that you mention, is there a workaround to make Windows STAY at 4k?

- Tim
It will happen anytime something changes the resolution. A game, movie, tv show, it really depends on what you're doing. Remote desktop into the device. The only solution is to keep the resolution the same or reopen windows after the resolution change. This isn't a windows problem. It's how the individual apps are programmed.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
It will happen anytime something changes the resolution. A game, movie, tv show, it really depends on what you're doing. Remote desktop into the device. The only solution is to keep the resolution the same or reopen windows after the resolution change. This isn't a windows problem. It's how the individual apps are programmed.
Well, I personally never change the resolution, and no app I use does that either, as far as I know - it's connected to my TV via my AVR's HDMI passthrough. I'm presuming the signal from the TV just goes away when I turn the TV off, but no resolution change happens. Wouldn't it be, then, that Windows is interpreting "lack of a signal" to trigger the reversion to a lower resolution?
 

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Well, I personally never change the resolution - it's connected to my TV via my AVR's HDMI passthrough. I'm presuming the signal from the TV just goes away when I turn the TV off, but no resolution change happens. Wouldn't it be, then, that Windows is interpreting "lack of a signal" to trigger the reversion to a lower resolution?
HDMI can change resolutions at any time. Each time something changes, an event occurs down the HDMI line and the device needs to read the EDID of the connected device to determine the resolution and capabilities. When your TV powers off, a generic EDID is sent down to your AVR which then passes it along or decodes it and passes along a lower capability EDID to your HTPC which causes the resolution change. So you are changing resolution by powering off your display.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
HDMI can change resolutions at any time. Each time something changes, an event occurs down the HDMI line and the device needs to read the EDID of the connected device to determine the resolution and capabilities. When your TV powers off, a generic EDID is sent down to your AVR which then passes it along or decodes it and passes along a lower capability EDID to your HTPC which causes the resolution change. So you are changing resolution by powering off your display.
I seem to recall there being some kinds of programmable EDID devices you can buy that will maintain the resolution you want; could installing one of those between the PC and the DVR fix this, do you think?
 

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Discussion Starter #10
That may work There are probably software solutions also. How many windows are involved? And what apps?
Well, mostly browser windows (Chrome, in most cases); also Slack, and a few other apps I use regularly (I can't recall right now, since most of my use of this computer, besides as a media server, is for browsing and media consumption in the browser, or using a player like PowerDVD, VLC or MediaMonkey). As mentioned, it seems that even some Windows settings panels have changed size.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
I just ordered a cheaper EDID emulator; I'll report back with my results when I get it. :)
 

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I just ordered a cheaper EDID emulator; I'll report back with my results when I get it. :)
Yea we could trap the resolution change event and resize windows manually using an autoit script via software.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Yea we could trap the resolution change event and resize windows manually using an autoit script via software.
I suppose that's possible; though how would we know what the original windows' sizes and positions were, so that we could restore them accurately?

If this emulator works, perhaps I won't have to worry about that, anyway. :-D

I appreciate all your help, in any case!
 

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I ran into a similar problem with Windows 10 and the solution was quite surprising. If you have a mouse with a wheel, just press <ctrl> and scroll up or down to change the size of the image at the time. Oddly, the size selected is remembered upon your next visit.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
I ran into a similar problem with Windows 10 and the solution was quite surprising. If you have a mouse with a wheel, just press <ctrl> and scroll up or down to change the size of the image at the time. Oddly, the size selected is remembered upon your next visit.
What context is this in? I'm talking about the size of, say, browser windows themselves, not the size of their content.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Yea we could trap the resolution change event and resize windows manually using an autoit script via software.
Hi again...

Well, I got the EDID emulator, and tried it out. When I connected the TV to the computer via my AVR's HDMI passthrough port (with the EDID emulator), it didn't fix the issue.

Then I connected the TV directly to the computer (without the EDID emulator), and had the same issue.

Then I connected the TV directly to the computer, this time WITH the EDID emulator, and the problem appeared to have gone away.

So my guess is that it's a combination of issues - the problem was as you suggested, that the EDID loss was causing Windows to change the resolution (down, then up when the tv's back on), but also the AVR (a Marantz NR1509) doesn't SEEM to be passing through the EDID properly. Though that doesn't seem to make sense, either, since the EDID emulator is connected to the output side of the AVR's HDMI passthrough port.

Still kind of a mystery, given the above.

I'll keep things as they are for the moment (not using the HDMI passthrough) to see if things stay working correctly. This would mean, however, that I can't play audio on the AVR, just on the TV (though perhaps I can pipe a separate audio channel from the computer to the AVR - might have some sync issues, possibly, though).

Anyway, thanks for seemingly pointing me in the right direction. I'll keep experimenting and see what I can work out.

- Tim
 

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Discussion Starter #18
Well, using an alternate audio connection (optical in this case) won't help, because the TV needs to be connected to the AVR's HDMI output, otherwise I can't change the AVRs settings (easily, anyway, since the front panel's display isn't very helpful), nor will I be able to watch discs or listen to CDs from my disc player (unless I want to connect the tv to that device directly as well).

Looks like I'm out of luck, unless I can find a way to get the AVR honoring the EDID stored in the EDID emulator.

sigh

- Tim
 

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Discussion Starter #19 (Edited)
@markmon1

I tried the EDID emulator between the AVR and the computer, as well, and that didn't work either (in fact, it didn't work at all, and if I turned the AVR off and back on, the AVR reported not getting a signal from the computer at all).

HOWEVER... I decided to do some more searching, and found a registry hack to get around this issue, and so far it seems to be working... what it does is, it sets ALL monitor configurations for the graphics driver to be same same (you probably only need to set one, but for lack of knowing what that one is, and not wanting to try them all, I just set them all)... here is the page I found the solution on: How To Prevent Windows 10 From Resizing & Relocating Open Windows After Resuming From Sleep | Performance Computer

I found I also needed to set the "ClipBox" values, otherwise the dimension of windows along that ClipBox dimension could be incorrectly sized as well.

So, I'm glad I found that. Hope this helps someone else in the future!

EDIT: Actually, I found an even simpler way to accomplish this:

1. Delete the following registry keys (NOTE: This will remove Windows's idea of what monitor configurations you have. Since I only have the one TV, deleting them all was fine; if you use multiple monitors, you may need to alter these instructions):
HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Control\GraphicsDrivers\Configuration​
HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Control\GraphicsDrivers\Connectivity​
HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Control\GraphicsDrivers\ScaleFactors​
2. Reboot computer
3. After rebooted, turn off TV/AVR/BOTH, wait a bit (10 seconds is probably fine)
4. Turn TV/AVR back on
5. Reboot computer
6. Look in the registry; the 3 groups above should have been recreated, and there should be 2 entries under each of them, one for the actual TV, one for the "NOEDID" value from when the TV/AVR was off. Under each of those entries in Configuration, there will be a "00" entry and a "00\00" entry.
7. Export the Configuration group into a .reg file
8. In the copy, in the Configuration group, replace all the entries under the "NOEDID" group with those from under the actual TV group
9. Run the modified .reg file. This will make the "NOEDID" group the same as the TV group, so that when you turn the TV/AVR off, it uses the same settings, so nothing actually gets changed.

You can probably not even do the rebooting, but I do it for completeness.
Also, you can just replace all the keys manually, from within the registry, but I found it more convenient to do it in a .reg file.
 
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