[blast67]

I saw a thread regarding plumbing and not wanting to hijack it, I wanted to ask for some help also. My unfinished basement was stubbed for a bath and has a pump imbedded in the concrete to pump the waste to the main waste drain located below the ceiling (however none of the piping from the pump to the drain exists). Also there are no vent lines located in the basement. My house a a couple of studor valves located elsewhere, but is it okay to install them on a sump pump? I've thought about installing two of them in case one of them malfunctions. I've heard it's possible for them to quit working and that's why some codes don't allow them. I think perhaps they are relatively new to the industry and had to get some kinks worked out of them and some places are slow to adopt newer technology. Anyway, I'd hate for one to quit working on the pump. If it was just a sink I wouldn't care so much.

Also, if there is a vent on the pump, are vents required for the sink, toilet and shower drains which all flow into the pump?

Thanks for the help. While I can handle electrical, I'm a novice when it comes to plumbing. I also apologize for this post having to do nothing with my theater build, but I know a lot of you have experience with whole basement remodels.


Matt

 

[BIGmouthinDC]

Not all sump pumps have vents.

There was a thread started today that had some pics of one without.

IMHO unless the sump cover is air-tight there isn't much of a need for the vent.

 

[Vcook]



Quote:
Originally Posted by blast67 /forum/post/15503533


Also, if there is a vent on the pump, are vents required for the sink, toilet and shower drains which all flow into the pump?

DO NOT flow all your sinks, toilets, showers to your sump pump. You're confusing a sump pump/pit with an ejector pump/pit.

 

[javadoc]

I'm with Big on this one. If the sump system doesn't already have a vent, it doesn't need one. Studor valves are great if you're relocating the bathroom and cannot access the roughed in plumbing vents, but for your plumbing needs and not the sump.


HTH!

 

[blast67]

Thanks for the replies. I may be using the wrong nomenclature. The pump is not one that pumps water from the foundation. It was one installed by the builder when I asked for a bathroom to be stubbed in the basement. There are no pipes installed coming in or out of it that are visible above the concrete. If it doesn't need a vent, then that's great, but won't I still need some vents somewhere on the system? I'm out of town on business right now, but I'll research it more carefilly when I get home.

 

[BoblK]

If it is the drain line from the bathroom or a sink that is connected to the pit then it is a waste pump. If there are no lines coming out of the pit are you sure that there is a pump in the pit or has the pit been put in so you can install a pump?


If there is no pump then you can by one and install it yourself but I am pretty sure you do not want a studor valve. You would want to vent the waste pump outside or you would potentially have a wonderfull smell in the basement all the time

The lids to the pit have a rubber seal installed for two good reasons, not just to prevent a potential overflow. (the other reason is odors)


I have one in my finished basement that is connected to a full bath and a bar sink that I recently had to pull to change the diaphram pressure switch that had failed. That type of switch is used in place of a float. The pressure switch plugs into the wall outlet and the pump plugs into the back of the pressure switch plug. When waste water rises, the pressure switch closes and the pump is activated. When the pit is pumped down to a lower level then the pressure switch opens and the pump shuts off. Remember to install a check valve on the outgoing line from the pump.


Liberty pumps or Hydromatic pumps are two brands of popular waste pumps. You can google both.


BobK

 

[BoblK]

Forgot to mention - the incoming waste line is below the basement floor grade so there is no incoming line above ground that you would see. Typically you see two lines above the floor: A 1 1/2 to 2 inch line to vent the pit to the outside ( or to your existing plumbing vent system) and the 1 1/2 to 2 inch waste water line from the outgoing side of the pump - Usually to an overhead waste water ( 4 inch) drain line.


BobK

 

[Old]

as others mentioned, you're probably talking about a Sewage Ejector Pump, not a sump pump.

These are for when your drain line is above ground.


I put one of these in in my old house. I do not believe you can put a studor vent to it. (I'll confirm this answer later) You must have it vented to the outside.

Is your basement completely underground?


In my old house the basement was mostly underground, but about 2' or so feet was above ground, so I was able to vent it out.


Oh, and yes, your shower, sink and toilet will all drain into the Sewage ejector pump, and utilize it's vent.


Old.

 

[Old]

Here is an answer to your question I got from my friend that is a pro...


My first reaction would be NO. They are typically used on 1 ½ & 2 gravity drain lines. I have not seen one on an ejector pump, not that they do not make one. When the pump kicks on, there is a good deal of suction taking place and if the holding tank is not properly vented, the suction will most likely suck the water out of the traps and allow sewer gases back in the house. You should check with the manufacture. You might need their data sheets to, one-- make sure it works, and two -keep the code official happy, if he asks.

 

[blast67]

Thanks Bob and Old.

I do in fact have a sewage ejector pump, and now that you've jogged my memory, it is a Liberty brand. It is installed as you mentioned, and has I recall, it has two connection points on the top.

This portion of the basment is almost completely below grade. My kitchen is on the floor above, but I don't see any expsosed vents that I could tie into. I could probably get a vent out the back of my house, but it would only be a foot or two above grade. (similar to what Old did at his "old" house). Did you just vent it straight out or did you run a vent pipe on the exterior up to the roof line? I didn't think a vent near my back deck would be a great idea, so that's why I was wondering if a studor would work.

Thanks for all the help.

 

[blast67]

Old--

You posted as I was typing my last post. Thanks for the professional advice. As I mentioned in my previous post, is it okay to vent straight out near grade level, or do I need to vent up to the roof line?


Matt

 

[Vcook]

Vents should exit at the roofline, not at ground level. Check your local code, this is pretty universal.

 

[Old]

Hi

I vented it out and up at the roof. I had a rancher so getting to the roof was simple

I hugged the pipe as close to the exterior wall at the inside corner where the house and the screened in porch met.

When it was above the roof line I terminated it as you would with any vent coming out of the roof

Old

 

[blast67]

Thanks for all the help. I found some posts on a plumbing website that were new since the last time I had checked and they pretty much agree with your advice. While it may be permissible (in some places) to put a studor vent on the pump along with some other wet vent piping, it is not recommended.

Now I need to decide whether I want to run a vent on the outside of the house (wouldn't be aesthetically pleasing) or somehow tap into some existing vents (PITA).

Thanks again. The people on this forum are great.

 

[ckaudio]

For future reference, any type of pump whether it be a sewage ejector pump or a mini wastewater pump hooked to a laundry tub ( if it uses a diaphram style pressure switch ) it will not work with a studor vent at all. The studor valve fights the pressure switch into an equalibrium........ the pump will click on and off with as little as a 1/2 cup of water running into the sump or crock. a mechanical float switch will work with a studor valve , although yes, most codes won't allow it.

 

[diknup]

I finished my basement and it includes a full bathroom which is now plumbed to empty into a sewage ejector. There is a studor valve on one of the two pipes coming out of the well where the ejector lives. Every time the ejector fires, the toilet turns into a momentary bidet, causing the water in the bowl to gurgle for a few seconds.


It seems like it's the result of some sort of back pressure equalization that I just assumed the studor valve was meant to address. Or am I just all wet?


A penny for your thoughts...

 

[Intricate1]

OP


You can use an AIV (Air admittance valve) or "Studor" vent as long as there is an atmospheric vent somewhere in the system. However using an AIV on the pit itself will cause problems usually because backpressure will force the AIV to close. I will post some sketches shortly. Venting just the pit will not be allowed nor will it work properly.

 

[Intricate1]



I would be happy to answer any questions you have.. and more than willing to assess your situation with some pictures/sketches.

Sorry the picture is so horrible.. my blackberry seems to be having lense issues.

 

[mystic_sniper28]

better to be getting a wet arse than a giser out the floor drain and soaking you and the whole area with water