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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Howdy, I've read the posts but have to ask my fellow members the tough questions. I currently have a Sony 1251 CRT Front Projector. I think the picture is great, but it's getting old and I think the power supply is going. Now being crt there is no native aspect ratio. So I don't want to go expensive what would you guys recommend for under $1000 and hdtv, I was looking at the HD1000U or the HD70 only because that's what a lot of people have here and it's under $1000. I don't care too much about specs because any I mentioned all ready will be a good pic. I was also looking at the Epson Powerlite 75c. Besides being $500 it sounds perfect 3 LCD, 2000 lumens, hdtv, the only draw back would be the 400:1 contrast ratio? I know a lot of people complain about this but would this be super noticeable, becasue in some plasmas and lcd tv they have contrast ratios this low? Also I don't care about HDMI or DVI as I have in wall component and my high end dvd player only has component out. Any suggestions would be good, thanks.
 

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Hi Cartierusm,


If you're coming from CRT FP ( I have a CRT and a digital ), you will REALLY notice the difference in black level if you choose a 500:1 projector if you watch in a dark room. Also, since that pj is a business class unit, it's tuned for bright graphic presentations, and won't do so well on video content.


I have an old Mits HC3, which is 500:1. It's quite bright and we just watch HDTV / Sports on it in the livingroom with the lights on. It does a good job for this type of content because of the brightness, and the fact that we have lights on destroys the CR anyway. However, on a couple of occasions we've watched a movie on it with the lights out, and the low CR stands out like a sore thumb.


I think you'd be much happier with either the HD70 or HD1000.


Jonathan
 

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A 500:1 Business PJ will be crap in comparison to a well setup and probably even a poorly setup CRT. Dark scenes will look horrendous. Contrast ratio is the most important aspect of image quality, especially if you value a rich image witih incredibly deep and rich dark scenes. It's what gives depth of image and the the the on/off contrast generally the better your dark scenes look (meaning black looks blacker). Your CRT is rated at about 15,000:1 on/off contrast, though a gamma corrected CRT is apparently capable of upto 700,000:1. This is the measurement between the brightest white the unit is capable of compared to the darkest black. The biggest reason CRT scores so high is because its black is so much darker than everything else and this is very noticeable in dark scenes. This is why you don't want anythin near only 500:1. That means the whites is only 500 times brighter than its darkest black.


I'd recommend the HD1000U. It will have a sharpness and detail advantage over an ES focus CRT, but it will still fall way short in dark scene contrast and blacks. Realism also isn't as good. Colors aren't as rich and deep either, but they're nice and bright.


If you're not using gamma correction you're already missing out on a big part of CRT's quality to begin with, so you might end up pretty happy with an HD1000u (especially with HD content). A custom gamma curve with a CRT really rocks though.


Good luck.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
MTyson, what is a gamma correction curve, is it something outboard or setting on the pj?


Also if I get the HD1000U should I be using a special screen, one of the grayish ones? Right now I have a normal gain 1 screen from Dalite.


Also, with my PJ I can set the aspect ratio to anything I want, how does that compare to the HD1000U? I know 4:3 and 16X9 will be fine but what about watching 235:1? Will it be all stretched out or squashed? Thanks.
 

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If you only want to spend $500 look at the Infocus IN72 at Abes of maine. By the way like the IN72 that epson is not HD. It only accepts an HD signal. You will be very pleased with the IN 72 if you sit 2x screen widths away
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
I think I've decided to go with the Optoma HD70 as the HD1000U won't fit on the ceiling my screen is too high for it and for me the height is perfect. I would still like to know from Mtyson about the gamma thing, the gray screen and 235:1 aspect ratios? Thanks.
 

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The gamma curve gives you greatly improved dark detail in dark scenes without needing to elevate your absolute black too high. You can even achieve true black fade to blacks with good dark detail. There are threads in the CRT forum. CRTs without gamma correction tend to badly crush dark detail and need the brightness elevated quite a bit to get decent dark detail without gamma manipulation (and even then it's not as good).


TSE makes a gamma correction circuit for CRT projectors. Also DVDs or downloaded video files run via Zoom Player pro with FFDShow can use a custom gamma curve. The newest FFDShow allows you to add custom points to the gamma and you can reshape the curve so that it mostly effects the dark end (raising dark detail dramatically while not elevating absolute black). Regular gamma correction is nice, but a custom curve is much better since it effects mostly just the dark end. If simply just raising the gamma to a higher number I recommend compensating by lower the contrast/white level via FFDShow a bit.


The HD70 really needs a good calibration due to its color accurracy issues. It calibrates to about the brightness of an X1 I hear, so I don't know if a grey screen would be a good idea or not for it, but a negative gain light grey screen is good for improving the black levels of a digital.


Digitals have a native aspect ratio which means with 2.35:1 content you will have dark grey bars above and below the the image. They will appear black in bright scenes, but not during darker scenes. The darker and lower contras the scene the grayer the bars and the blacks will look.


You can, however, get an anamorphic lens and run true 2.35:1 aspect ratio without the black bars and gain more pixels and brightness for 2.35:1 content. That's if the HD70 can do the vertical stretch required for the lens. A lens can be had for around $300 I believe.
 

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As MTyson said contrast ration particulary on/off is a very important parameter in PQ.

I would fix that CRT if the tubes are still in good shape and keep it along side whatever you get. A lot of folks have change of heart after living with a fixed panel display a while . At least you are going to have two PJ's to play with like compare and so forth.

Buy a dpj without white segment in its color wheel if you want it for movies or buy LCD.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cartierusm /forum/post/0


I think I've decided to go with the Optoma HD70 as the HD1000U won't fit on the ceiling my screen is too high for it and for me the height is perfect. I would still like to know from Mtyson about the gamma thing, the gray screen and 235:1 aspect ratios? Thanks.

There is not much difference between them in terms of offset. The 70 may not work with your screen height.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
As far as gamma correction I'm not running an HTPC so I wouldn't be able to do that, at least I think I'm guessing that FFDShow is software? The calculator on Mits websites is extensive if not confusing, nothing is labeled in the window, I mean I figured it out but took a while. As far as the calculator on Optomas site is too simple it doesn't account for celing or screen placement, just distance. My ceiling is 98" high and the top edge of the screen (the white part) is at 88" from the floor. Mits calculator says the screen can't be higher than 77 1/2" from the floor. That's too low. Any suggestions? Is this with a flat mount, do they accound for a tilting ceiling mount? where it dops down a little and you can angle the projector up?
 
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