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Discussion Starter #1
Howdy all. I have a unique problem! I have started a couple of other threads thinking there were some settings for my VSX-821 receiver, but I have just come to the conclusion that my 2-18" subs drown out my little polk monitors. No matter what setting I choose, in really bassy scenes, you can't hear words, talking, music, etc, just the explosions and rumble (which is awesome by the way)


As with everyone else, I am budget restricted. I don't really have a set budget, but $2,000 or $3,000 is just not going to be an option. Surely there are some quality speakers for more like $1,000 or $1500 tops if I can build it over time.


I also would like for it to be in a wood texture if at all possible. The black look is ok...but I just prefer a cherry or oak or something a little more matching my tastes. I also don't really want to be back here trying to upgrade again in 6 months because it wasn't that much of an improvement. If I have to piece the system together due to budget I'm fine with that.


I have been following the Klipsch a little bit, I like the look of the Klipsch WF 35 front corners, WC 24 Center, and WB 14 surrounds Newegg has them on sale frequently and I think could all be had for around $1000, and in expresso. I also wouldn't rule out the RF series if they are tht much of an upgrade, but it appears they are only in ash black. I'm also open to other models, I know someone on here always pushes the Bic audio speakers, and like I said don't necessarily care what the brand name is, just want something to match big subs and produce good audio, and for some reason I keep thinking I need a big horn loaded tweeter because these little 1" dome tweeters in the polks are absolutely not cutting it. I know I'm all over the place, but just looking for some advice. Thanks
 

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Before looking at replacing the speakers, have you covered all the bases regarding receiver settings and level matching? Is it possible yours subs are just running way too hot? Do you have a SPL meter to check speaker and subwoofer levels?


Before throwing in the towel with the Polk's, check and re-check everything. If possible, please post your receiver configuration. Be sure the main speakers are set to small and crossed over, and run the test tone built into the receiver and listen to see if the front and center speakers are too soft compared to the subwoofer; using an SPL meter to aid in this listening session is preferred, as it will give you an exact number concerning SPL levels.


If you're set on new speakers check out Salk Sound (SongSurrounds), Philharmonic Audio (Philharmonitors) and Kef.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
I do not have an SPL meter, but I wouldn't be opposed to getting one. I had another thread on here where some people were helping me make sure it was set up correctly. I could never get it to go into a dynamic mode or mccac (I think??) I do have it crossing over at 100 hz and set to small speakers. I also boosted the decibles +6 center channel and +4 front corners and heard a slight improvement, but still not really even close.
 

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You may be running the subwoofer way too high in frequency, so that the sub overlaps the front speakers too much and muddies up the sound; that sounds like your problem.


I assume you are using the Polk Monitor 30s, which will go down to 60-70 Hz with no problem, so set them to a lower limit of 60 Hz


Your subwoofer should be set to roll off above 60 HZ; NO HIGHER. Turn its gain way down, also, and gradually and slowly turn it up until you get enough low bass. Limit subwoofer operation to BELOW 60 HZ!


Try that and see if you don't get a big improvement.



For some front speakers that would be a major improvement in sound quality over the Polks, you may want to consider getting a pair of the KEF C3 speakers, which are only $329 per pair at the KEF Direct website.
 

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Agreed. A lower crossover setting may help, depending on what speakers you have. Could you share the specific make/model of all of your speakers and subs?


However, before doing anything else, you should work on getting MCACC working. It will help you a lot for optimizing your setup. Here is the official MCACC thread on AVS . I would recommend reading around in it and seeking help there.


Just in case you haven't done this, be sure that you have your subs set to bypass mode or the crossover is turned on the sub is all the way up. Use the bass management crossover settings on your receiver to handle the crossover with your speakers.
 

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Have you ran a frequency sweep of your subs to see if you're getting a large peak somewhere? My guess would be that is the case around 50-60hz, lowering the crossover like suggested will reduce this somewhat.


If you still are interested in a cheap set of speakers that can keep up with your subs, and likely be superior to those klipsch.

http://speakerdesignworks.com/NS6project_1.html

http://speakerdesignworks.com/StenIIproject_1.html


I'm assuming if you have a pair of 18" subs that they're DIY, no reason not to go this route with the speakers.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by commsysman  /t/1416459/subs-drown-out-my-speakers#post_22146668


You may be running the subwoofer way too high in frequency, so that the sub overlaps the front speakers too much and muddies up the sound; that sounds like your problem.

I assume you are using the Polk Monitor 30s, which will go down to 60-70 Hz with no problem, so set them to a lower limit of 60 Hz

Your subwoofer should be set to roll off above 60 HZ; NO HIGHER. Turn its gain way down, also, and gradually and slowly turn it up until you get enough low bass. Limit subwoofer operation to BELOW 60 HZ!

Try that and see if you don't get a big improvement.

Limiting it below 60hz might work, but it might not; It's going to depend on room interaction. He should set the crossover where it sounds (and measures) best, experimenting with all options.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Hey guys I guess I should have given you the specifics up front. Currently I have a VSX-821, Polk Monitor 50's, 30's, and a CS1 Center. I also have dual ED A7s-450 in the front of the room, and two cheap kicker subs right next to and pointing out the couch I sit on for some extra punch in the seats.


I have the cross-over on the subs set to max (I think its 100hz) and then matched it to the receiver and have it set at 100hz as well. I did tinker with the setting on the receiver when I was trying to dial in the system, I think there is a 50hz/80/100/120/150/200 crossovers on the receiver but I may have to double check that as well. I will try it at the 80 hz and 50hz tonight and see if I cant figure out the mcacc settings, hopefully that thread will help.
 

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You should set the subs for 50 HZ max and turn their gain down some and go from there. Your front speakers should be set to go down to 50 HZ.


The definition of sub-bass is frequencies below 30 HZ.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
I mean, I will definately try it, I can understand how it would help with the sound. Just seems like to me there is going to be a lot of bass at 50-100hz that will not be as fantastacially reproduced by the monitors as opposed to the 18's.
 

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I'm a fan of a 80 Hz crossover. But you need to get MCACC up and running before you start tweaking.
 

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Try what others suggested but if it still doesn't fit your needs, Do you want new speakers or would you be willing to get some used ones? Only reason I ask is because you can get an older generation for speakers for a lot less than MSRP of new ones.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay1  /t/1416459/subs-drown-out-my-speakers#post_22147126


^^^ completely made up info about 30hz....

Yup. Maybe he meant the crossover on the sub should be set to max, as not to overlap with the receiver? It certainly didn't sound like that's what he meant, though.
 

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To the OP, you mentioned you haven't been able to get MCACC to work - is there a specific issue with the receiver you're running into? Do you have the calibration mic that came with that unit? This really should be your starting point. Adjusting settings is fine, but it's best done once from a baseline configuration i.e. once MCACC calibration has been performed.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Oh, Unless someone was just giving away some used ones I think I'd like to go new. I'm definately gonna tinker with it some more tonight first though. I do have the mic, but I was following the directions and just couldn't get it to go into that mode, I don't think it gave me the option to.

It would be like in the manual it said hit this button, and then this button, and then you will have options A B C D E & F.


Well, I'd hit that buttone, and then the other one, but I would only have options A B D & F. It wouldn't even give me the other options. I'll try again tonight, its been a week or two I'm not sure exactly why I couldn't get it except it wouldn't show up.
 

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Quote:
Howdy all. I have a unique problem! I have started a couple of other threads thinking there were some settings for my VSX-821 receiver, but I have just come to the conclusion that my 2-18" subs drown out my little polk monitors. No matter what setting I choose, in really bassy scenes, you can't hear words, talking, music, etc, just the explosions and rumble (which is awesome by the way)

Isn'nt that reality? Do you think one can hear a soldier talk on the field over exploding grenades????



Your solution: Subtitles
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuance  /t/1416459/subs-drown-out-my-speakers#post_22147381


Yup. Maybe he meant the crossover on the sub should be set to max, as not to overlap with the receiver? It certainly didn't sound like that's what he meant, though.

No. Contrary to what everyone else believes--and there have been heated discussions about this with him---Cman has repeatedly stated that people should not use the bass management on the receiver. The OP is definitely better off following the more conventional wisdom that everyone else offers. LOL
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by derekhonda  /t/1416459/subs-drown-out-my-speakers#post_22147427


Oh, Unless someone was just giving away some used ones I think I'd like to go new. I'm definately gonna tinker with it some more tonight first though. I do have the mic, but I was following the directions and just couldn't get it to go into that mode,

Definitely then ask in the MCACC thread I linked to above if you can't get it working. Most likely it's something that has been encountered already, and they can steer you in the right direction.


I think this might have already been mentioned, but if you get MCACC to work, it may set your front speakers to LARGE. Set all your speakers to SMALL so that the bass management will crossover all speakers with the sub. And then don't hesitate to override the crossover if it sets it higher and try 80hz.


BTW: That sounds like a pretty powerful bass setup you have for your room with all those subs
 
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