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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
12x12 room 10' ceiling

90% movie watching, 10% music (or less)

Denon AVR E-400

SLS Q-Line Gold 7 speakers like crossover around 120hz


I have the opportunity to by the SVS at $550

the Rythmik is $599

the VTF-2 is $596


I'm torn between the three, any opinions?


Edit: I added a third choice
 

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Are you buying the SVS new from SVS directly? If so, I would easily take the PB12-NSD. Better warranty, cast driver, etc.
 

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Both are popular subs, and if you read enough testimonials, you'll find fans of each. Trying to find someone who has heard both in the same room might be really hard.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
I added a 3rd choice, the HSU, because it is down firing (kids) and tune-able.


I'm wondering if I'm giving up bass going with the regular price Rythmik or Hsu, rather then taking the on-sale PB12

The Hsu seems to check more boxes, I just do not know about output, seems the VTF-3 is more on par with the PB12 but it's completely out of my budget. I'm already stretched to $600 which is $100 over my max
 

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I own a lv12r and absolutely love it, however I'd have a hard time saying I'd rather have it then the pb12nsd for the same price.


Performance wise the two are prolly pretty close. The sound quality of the lv12r is amazing in its price range for a ported sub. On the other hand I would imagine the pb edges it out in output (just guessing) and it has a better warranty and slightly better built.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by basshead81  /t/1520399/svs-pb12-nsd-or-rythmik-lv12r-or-hsu-vtf-2-mk4#post_24433005


That is a tough call, but since you mentioned kids I would say VTF-2 for the downfiring design.

+1


Or the Outlaw LFM-1 Plus.
 

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I'm guessing the PB12 will have the cleanest deep bass output. I think the VTF2 or Rythmik would have more mid and upper bass output. Since you are more into movies, I would probably swing for the SVS because $550 is a great deal for one, but I think they would all be pretty close. The SVS has a metal grill which may also be able to protect the driver from kids if it is not easily removable.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by shadyJ  /t/1520399/svs-pb12-nsd-or-rythmik-lv12r-or-hsu-vtf-2-mk4#post_24433900


I'm guessing the PB12 will have the cleanest deep bass output. I think the VTF2 or Rythmik would have more mid and upper bass output. Since you are more into movies, I would probably swing for the SVS because $550 is a great deal for one, but I think they would all be pretty close. The SVS has a metal grill which may also be able to protect the driver from kids if it is not easily removable.

The PB12 had issues with the grill rattling and falling off a spirited levels. I would say a child could probably yank it right off. I believe the PB2000 grill was redesigned to address that issue. Kudos to you for actually recomending a SVS product. Although I doubt you would be able to tell which sub is cleaner in room with source content.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by basshead81  /t/1520399/svs-pb12-nsd-or-rythmik-lv12r-or-hsu-vtf-2-mk4#post_24433951


The PB12 had issues with the grill rattling and falling off a spirited levels. I would say a child could probably yank it right off. I believe the PB2000 grill was redesigned to address that issue. Kudos to you for actually recomending a SVS product. Although I doubt you would be able to tell which sub is cleaner in room with source content.

I think this is true a lot of times. We do tend to get all caught up in how the different major ID subs would sound in a room. I really do believe that one might sound better in one room and one in another that has more to do with room interaction with the particular frequency response of the sub than distortion levels, and then it will depend on what source content one listens to. (lol)
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by shadyJ  /t/1520399/svs-pb12-nsd-or-rythmik-lv12r-or-hsu-vtf-2-mk4#post_24433900


I'm guessing the PB12 will have the cleanest deep bass output. I think the VTF2 or Rythmik would have more mid and upper bass output. Since you are more into movies, I would probably swing for the SVS because $550 is a great deal for one, but I think they would all be pretty close. The SVS has a metal grill which may also be able to protect the driver from kids if it is not easily removable.

Thank you

Does this mean the Rythmik or Hsu will extend up higher to meet my smaller 120hz 4" woofer satelite speakers or will the SVS do just fine for that too?
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by f430  /t/1520399/svs-pb12-nsd-or-rythmik-lv12r-or-hsu-vtf-2-mk4#post_24437624


Thank you

Does this mean the Rythmik or Hsu will extend up higher to meet my smaller 120hz 4" woofer satelite speakers or will the SVS do just fine for that too?

What he is saying is that he believes that the Rythmik or HSU could have the potential to play louder at those frequencies (not sure I would agree with that). Meanwhile, the PB12 would work very well with speakers that require a 120hz crossover.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by cel4145  /t/1520399/svs-pb12-nsd-or-rythmik-lv12r-or-hsu-vtf-2-mk4#post_24437646


What he is saying is that he believes that the Rythmik or HSU could have the potential to play louder at those frequencies (not sure I would agree with that). Meanwhile, the PB12 would work very well with speakers that require a 120hz crossover.

Correct. These subs will all play flat up to 120 Hz. With the Rythmik, you need to use the 'line-in' input and not the LFE input, or else the high rolloff starts at 100 Hz, which will leave a bit of a gap for a 120 Hz crossover. You ought to think about getting better speakers, as such a high crossover localizes the sub which draws attention to itself and weighs the soundstage in its direction. The sound will feel lopsided to the sub's position. However, if you get another sub and place it in an adjacent side of the room with respect to sub #1, they may balance each other out and get rid of localization.
 

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^^^^^


Actually, it's the LFE input that gets you the extended FR on the Rythmik subs.


And according to the spec page , the LV12R is rated to be flat to 300Hz (yikes) when using the LFE-in.


But agree that the better solution would be to get speakers that are flat down to at least 80Hz....if possible...IMO.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by shadyJ  /t/1520399/svs-pb12-nsd-or-rythmik-lv12r-or-hsu-vtf-2-mk4#post_24439366


Correct. These subs will all play flat up to 120 Hz. With the Rythmik, you need to use the 'line-in' input and not the LFE input, or else the high rolloff starts at 100 Hz, which will leave a bit of a gap for a 120 Hz crossover. You ought to think about getting better speakers, as such a high crossover localizes the sub which draws attention to itself and weighs the soundstage in its direction. The sound will feel lopsided to the sub's position. However, if you get another sub and place it in an adjacent side of the room with respect to sub #1, they may balance each other out and get rid of localization.

If I got a front firing sub and put it on the viewing wall would that help with the lopsidedness?


I can't afford good speakers AND a good sub
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by f430  /t/1520399/svs-pb12-nsd-or-rythmik-lv12r-or-hsu-vtf-2-mk4#post_24444255


If I got a front firing sub and put it on the viewing wall would that help with the lopsidedness?

If you put your sub in the front sound stage that would definitely be better to help with reducing localizing the bass than putting it somewhere else in the room, since the front sound stage is where most of the sound comes from. But it wouldn't matter really if it's front firing or not.
 

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One workaround is to put the sub directly in front of the listening position, like under the center speaker. The further he places it to the left or right, the further the sound stage gets anchored in that direction.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by shadyJ  /t/1520399/svs-pb12-nsd-or-rythmik-lv12r-or-hsu-vtf-2-mk4#post_24444623


One workaround is to put the sub directly in front of the listening position, like under the center speaker. The further he places it to the left or right, the further the sound stage gets anchored in that direction.

Thank you!

I think I will do that, put the sub under the center, and move the receiver and everything else to the back of the room.


Then maybe I won't have to mount the center to the wall, it can just sit on the sub.


Excuse the mess, I have been waiting all week to unpack and listen, so I just grabbed whatever I could to hold everything up when I had 1 hour to spare today.


 
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