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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
i've wired up the audio and network, i just have video, ir, control, etc. to run to a couple of TV locations.


the other thing i want to do is modernize my security system. i've got door sensors, motion sensors, etc. all around the house running to a 20yr old system located far away from where i want it to be.


i dont want to rip up the house to rewire the doors (for example), so i am thinking i can just cut/splice/reroute the existing wires to a new set of runs from the attic to the control closet. I plan on cutting the wires in the attic, stripping the ends, and then tying back to a new run to the closet that i then can hook up to an Elk.


Any concerns with doing this? What kind of wire should i run - can i use Cat6 or do i need something else?


Thanks -
 

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sure you can re-use the wires, presuming they're intact and you don't hose the splicing. Given that it's security stuff, you may want to solder or heat-shrink them together.


For the type of cable, that depends on the sensor. I've been advised to not use CAT wire for powered stuff (ie, motion sensors), rather to stick with 18/4 for that. The passive magnetic stuff, ie door sensors, are fine with cat6.
 

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Cutting and splicing is always best to avoid. Throws a very big wrench into any troubleshooting you may have to do if something is not working correctly. Especially with an alarm system.


However if you really haaave to. I'd probably purchase a couple bix rails (Phone punch downs), and a bix holder and punch it all down nicely and cleanly. The nice and clean part is very important because as stated above, if something goes wrong you are going to have to trace through this area. Should be able to pick these up at any electrical wholesaler, they should do cash sales.


see this url : en,wikipedia,org/wiki/BIX


Alarm is run using station-Z wiring (22/4).


-Rob
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
thanks for the quick responses... i'll see if i can find a punch down block. that will make for a nice install in the attic.


The big question is 18/4 or 22/4? if I did 18 it seems like the only drawback would be the size/cost, correct? do i have to worry about signals get weak/lost on a thicker gauge wire?


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The cost difference is trivial, the bigger issue for me was that 18/4 barely fit in some of my sensors. That said, i'd still get 18/4, maybe stranded.


And, i'm a DIY'er so take this with a grain of salt, I think 22/4 may not have enough chutzpah to carry the power demands of some sensors. I dunno about that for sure, but that's what i'd look into. I went with 18/4 so I could take one bit of research off the table.
 

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I forget who it was on cocoontech, but someone had the same problem.


I have the same problem as well. I want to move my main panel to the basement, from a first floor closet.


What to do? Well, with the Elk, you buy...oh, I'll just look for the post, and link. I don't want to take credit away.
 

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Couldn't find the thread, but I learned a lot searching.


I think it's an Elk M1XIN that is used to replace the old alarm board - all of your exisitng sensors are wired to this zone expander, and then the M1XIN is wired through 1 or 2 cables (2 conductor data + 2 conductor power) to the main board location. In effect, your existing enclosure becomes a sub panel for your new alarm.


I'm sure other alarm systems offer the same thing, but the ELK installation and troubleshooting are fairly well-documented online.


Link to Elk zone expander:
http://www.elkproducts.com/products/..._Expanders.htm


Edit - at least I think that's the product I read that someone used for a subpanel, to replace an old alarm. Post over on cocoontech if you really want the details, in their security subforum. GL.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
well, this would be perfect! i'll read up on it and see if thats the case. it would save me from runnign 10+ more wires...


thanks for the info!


chris
 

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22 gauge is big enough for almost anything that is a reasonable distance from the panel.


I think there is a problem with the wire being too heavy if you are using addressable devices, but I don't really remember.


Tim
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisdias /forum/post/15568905


well, this would be perfect! i'll read up on it and see if thats the case. it would save me from runnign 10+ more wires...


thanks for the info!


chris

Post over at Cocoontech Security subforum, to get the details from somebody who has done this. I'm not even sure if that is the correct Elk device.


Maybe IVB knows more about the 'sub panel' approach?
 

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I'm sure Elk has an equivalent, but with my ademco panel I added (2) 4208SN serial expander units.


You run one wire between the expander and the control panel, and you connect up to 8 zones to the serial expander.


Each zone has its own description when it's faulted.


What's also nice is you can also add addressable devices on the same wire. So you run one cable from the (basement) control panel to the (attic) serial expander, and connect the 8 devices (motions, door contacts) to the serial expander. If you need another 8 zones, you just daisy-chain to the first one (you don't have to run another wire to the basement).


But say you want to add some smoke detectors-- you can get addressable smoke detectors (eg 5192SD) and tap right into that serial line (don't need another expander).


I'm sure elk has a comparable serial implementation.


Tim
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Neurorad /forum/post/15571412


Post over at Cocoontech Security subforum, to get the details from somebody who has done this. I'm not even sure if that is the correct Elk device.


Maybe IVB knows more about the 'sub panel' approach?

yeah, I use the subpanel concept. I actually only have the Elk main board in the main panel, then a single CAT5 run to a Data Bus Hub in a 2ndary panel. That data bus hub connects to 3 zone expanders, the wireless receiver, a serial expander, a few other things.


The 2ndary panel is big (48" x 24"), I had nothing close to that much room and ease of wiring in the primary location.
 
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