[nathan_h]

Current status

• Projector: JVC RS500 calibrated by ChadB.
• Screen: Elite Screens Cinegray 5D.
• Speakers: Fronts - Revel M16, Surrounds - Revel M8, Subs - dual Rythmik F15HP (center is also a M16, not pictured in this photograph, but it replaced the wood console)
• Treatments: about 100 square feet of absorption, mostly 3.5 inch thick rock wool and fibberglass panels.
• Processing/Power: Anthem 720 AVR.
• Sources: ATV4k, Sony UHD 800, Chromecast, Music Hall turntable.

(Yes if I had full run of this room, I'd have painted it dark grey -- or at least dark brown -- and have dark panels. And instead of a drop down ALR screen, I'd build a false 2x4 wall on the screen wall, with in wall speakers and an acoustically transparent screen. But this is in theory a guest room and a temporary setup. So.....one does what one can.

http://imgur.com/a/zjCbW98

is a good example of the challenges that this room presents for images. The Cinegray 5D screen, while not without some compromises in terms of a little hot spotting and shimmer, does a remarkable job when set up correctly in such a room.)

----

The story

Almost 15 years ago I built my last dedicated theater. That chronicle is here.

(Before that I had a theater in a spare bedroom and a couple living rooms.)

It was really nice to have a dedicated space that wasn’t significantly limited by an existing room as my prior efforts had been. It was built in an existing detached garage. So there were sone limitations especially with height.

Sure building a room from scratch involved a lot of work and learning but I was finally able to try all the ways of putting a room together, and all kinds of different speakers, amps, subs, treatments, seating positions, screen types, and so on....and about 12 or 13 years into that 15 year journey I had it dialed in enough that I basically stopped tweaking. Further improvement would've meant rebuilding the room from scratch, which I might have done if I had stayed in that house longer.

Fast forward to the present day, and we have moved into a new-to-us home......and my theater needs to fit into a spare bedroom, again, for a couple years until we can build an outbuilding for a workshop and theater.

This temporary setup is the subject of this thread.

Layer on top the need to not do construction in it that compromises turning it back into a bedroom, and I’ve got to get smart about my approach.

I’d love to get ideas from the collective hive mind. Eventually we’ll build a garage and that will really just be an excuse to build a theater to my preferred dimensions an specs. But that’s a couple years away, at a minimum. I “need” something reference quality in the interim!

 

[nathan_h]

The raw state.

For the first time the building is recent enough that I have proper architectural drawings of the room.

(UPDATE: Actual measurements:

12'6" deep/long
10'9" wide
8'10" tall

but since the projector is in the closet, one closet door is open, making the room sort of a little longer at one point. I've dumped some large six in thick panels into the closet in the hope that bass entering gets gobbled up a bit but I am sure this will impact modeling and mean measurements, as usual, matter more than predicted response based on room dimensions.)

I should state that sound proofing will not be a goal. If it were I’d be building another room within a room but there simply isn’t enough space to do that from what I can see.

Ive been a front projection guy for 20 years, and my general plan is to to that again.

I believe that by mounting the projector in the closet, I’ll have enough throw with my JVC RS500 and most likely replacements to have a decent sized screen, since the room with closet is 15 feet deep.

I only need one rom of seating, probably a three person couch. This should let me keep it off the back wall.

I currently use a 8’ wide woven 2.37:1 Seymour av EN4K screen. I’d love to put that on the screen wall with in wall Revel or Triad speakers behind it. But that is an exterior wall, so placing in wall speakers there my mess with the exterior insulation.

There is also a window there. I don’t necessarily worry about losing the window, but the window is right where the center speaker would go behind the screen...

I like to sit about 7.5’ from the screen, so the couch in the rom should clear the door at the back.

I need to do the math. Perhaps I could built a false wall literally four inches off the front wall, kind of a baffle wall, place the speakers in it, and the screen on it.

Or maybe there is an orientation I haven’t thought of?

The other option is a roll down screen in front of the windows, black out blinds on the windows, and just have speakers on wall or in the room, even the center in front of the window. It might have to be a slightly smaller screen but also being closer to me will look similarly large.

And even if I need to move the screen off the wall almost a foot, it looks like I could have a larger screen than I have now though especially if I go with a 16*9 screen it would have to be acoustically transparent again.

Would be nice to reuse my existing screen but that means “permanently” blocking the window since it’s a fixed frame screen with a false wall for mounting it and mounting speakers.

It would also be nice to have the room be more flexible so a drop down screen has appeal.

The room is painted to match the rest of the house a light tan color. At worst I’d repaint a dark brown in the same family....

And yes I should probably just get a 77“ OLED, orient the room ninety degrees differently, sit darn close and admit front projection defeat, but I can’t.

If there was a UST projector that was in the class of a JVC that would be seriously tempting. Then I could with the shorter orientation, perhaps.

Barring some other awesome plan maybe something like this screen?

One of the design principals of this room is that it won't be a dedicated space. Rather, this is a multi-use room that has to double as a guest room (think, sleeper sofa instead of theater chairs, the horror!) and retain the basic color scheme of the rest of the home.........while we save money to build a garage, which will incorporate a proper dedicated room. But that could be several years away...

An electric screen that rolls down, a projector that "hides away" in the closet, gear in the closet, etc, will be the approach.....

Heck, I would do in wall speakers (because they actually work really well!) but the screen wall has that closed cell insulation so it is essentially like a giant brick. So, there will be speakers in the room.

Perhaps the most concerning bit to me is:

This is the screen wall. Black out curtain/shade will be added in some fashion. But, this is the color scheme (but not the actual furniture -- this is the model home).

 

[nathan_h]

Reserved

 

[nathan_h]

Reserved

 

[nathan_h]

Reserved

 

[Everyone]

Putting your seating far enough forward facing the window to allow entry and access to the closet looks like you'd end up with less depth. Why not put the screen on the wall the door is on between the door and the corner, and seating along the opposite wall? Then you have the screen on an interior wall and can do your in-wall speakers behind it.

 

[craig john]

Here is my retractable Seymour AV UF "scope" screen. It's 115" diagonal 2.35:1 with retractable masking for 16:9. We sit 9.5' from the screen. Scope movies are completely immersive. 16:9 content comes in at about 96" diagonal, but we find it more than satisfactory at our veiwing distance:

Just another option.

Craig

 

[Mashie Saldana]

Or go for one of the new 83" OLED's.

 

[nathan_h]

Putting your seating far enough forward facing the window to allow entry and access to the closet looks like you'd end up with less depth.

Thanks for flagging that. At first I was worried, as well.

That said, after a little figuring and comparing with my current setup, and my math may be wrong, but I think I'll still have 8' of depth from eyes to screen. I use that distance now and it is ideal after trying various other distances.

Bonus: that would allow me to place the seating optimally for room modes, away from walls and with a little wiggle room back and forth to deal with geometry of bass response.

If I was trying to do two rows, this room wouldn't work in any reasonable manner but luckily that is not necessary at present.

Why not put the screen on the wall the door is on between the door and the corner, and seating along the opposite wall? Then you have the screen on an interior wall and can do your in-wall speakers behind it.

I would love to orient the room that way, though I wouldn't sit against the wall due to audio issues that that creates, but the throw distance is not adequate in that direction for an immersive screen. It would help immensely with the in wall speaker situation.

My alternative so far is that I might build a second wall, 4" thick, which will cover the window, allow placement of in wall speakers, and essentially leave the room in tact when I remove the wall at some future date.

--

But I readily admit I may be making assumptions that are limiting my choices so if something I am saying doesn't track, I'm all ears.

 

[nathan_h]

Here is my retractable Seymour AV UF "scope" screen. It's 115" diagonal 2.35:1 with retractable masking for 16:9. We sit 9.5' from the screen. Scope movies are completely immersive. 16:9 content comes in at about 96" diagonal, but we find it more than satisfactory at our veiwing distance:

Just another option.

Craig

That's as smart looking screen! Yes, something that drops down in front of the designate screen wall, plus good window blocking behind it, could be a very viable solution. And depending on how far off the wall the screen is I could optimize the size of the screen to preserve my preferred angle of view. Then I bust out some in room speakers close to the wall, and call it a day -- and when I need the room to not be a theater, the screen rolls up, the window covering comes off, and it just looks like a listening/sitting/perhaps even a guest room.

 

[nathan_h]

Or go for one of the new 83" OLED's.

You are not wrong.

That would be the sane thing to do.

I'm just so addicted to a 55 degree field of view that it would be hard to get used to a flat panel.

I'd have to sit six feet from the screen to achieve that.

It's not out of the question, though I'd lose my beloved center speaker matching and alignment

 

[Mashie Saldana]

You are not wrong.

That would be the sane thing to do.

I'm just so addicted to a 55 degree field of view that it would be hard to get used to a flat panel.

I'd have to sit six feet from the screen to achieve that.

It's not out of the question, though I'd lose my beloved center speaker matching and alignment

But on the other hand you will have a spectacular picture to enjoy. Also what's wrong with sitting 6 feet from the screen? It's not as if you are close enough to kick it by accident.

 

[nathan_h]

But on the other hand you will have a spectacular picture to enjoy. Also what's wrong with sitting 6 feet from the screen? It's not as if you are close enough to kick it by accident.

This is true! Hmmmm.....

 

[Everyone]

I would love to orient the room that way, though I wouldn't sit against the wall due to audio issues that that creates, but the throw distance is not adequate in that direction for an immersive screen. It would help immensely with the in wall speaker situation.

My alternative so far is that I might build a second wall, 4" thick, which will cover the window, allow placement of in wall speakers, and essentially leave the room in tact when I remove the wall at some future date.

You're going to have to make some compromise no matter what with that space. I'd go with a retractable screen over building a wall in front of the window. Much easier to undo when it comes time to sell. Problem with that is it needs to be far enough forward for your center channel to squeeze between it and the window.

Your projector will have to be far enough forward in the closet for the pillar separating the doors to not get in the way.

120" 16:9 AT screen or smaller on the wall with the door and a UST projector. Sit far enough off the back wall to balance audio desires.

 

[craig john]

But on the other hand you will have a spectacular picture to enjoy. Also what's wrong with sitting 6 feet from the screen? It's not as if you are close enough to kick it by accident.

What's wrong with sitting 6' from a large flat panel? Well, for one, it places the CC either above or below the flat panel which would make for acute angles to the CC. The "ventriloquist effect" only works if the angles are not so acute as to make the direction of the CC readily apparent. I know myself well enough to know that it would never work for me to sit 6' from a large flat panel with the CC above or below it. I've seen enough of @nathan_h 's posts to suspect he is much the same way. But... maybe not...?

Craig

Edit: I think he's considering a JVC 4K projector, so he will still have a "spectacular picture" to enjoy. 🙂

 

[nathan_h]

You're going to have to make some compromise no matter what with that space. I'd go with a retractable screen over building a wall in front of the window. Much easier to undo when it comes time to sell. Problem with that is it needs to be far enough forward for your center channel to squeeze between it and the window.

Your projector will have to be far enough forward in the closet for the pillar separating the doors to not get in the way.

120" 16:9 AT screen or smaller on the wall with the door and a UST projector. Sit far enough off the back wall to balance audio desires.

I suspect lens shift will let me avoid the pillar in the closet.

The easy to undo part is useful since eventually I’ll build a theater in the garage....but for now there is no garage! It really is just a ”cabin” not designed for full time living yet....

 

[nathan_h]

What's wrong with sitting 6' from a large flat panel? Well, for one, it places the CC either above or below the flat panel which would make for acute angles to the CC. The "ventriloquist effect" only works if the angles are not so acute as to make the direction of the CC readily apparent. I know myself well enough to know that it would never work for me to sit 6' from a large flat panel with the CC above or below it. I've seen enough of @nathan_h 's posts to suspect he is much the same way. But... maybe not...?

Craig

Edit: I think he's considering a JVC 4K projector, so he will still have a "spectacular picture" to enjoy. 🙂

You guessed right. I have trouble with off axis center channels and horizontal speakers etc. So if I go the flat panel route the tv would be mounted too high, so the front three speakers could be identical bookshelf style ones all at the same height and orientation.

Or just a phantom center but that has its own issues.

And yes I will eventually upgrade projectors. Hoping to make the rs500 work until the next jvc generation which appears to be 2022 at the earliest. There’s enough other stuff to eat up money in a new house for 2021...

 

[nathan_h]

This may take some experimentation in the room to get a better handle on the trade offs.

 

[markmon1]

So you are going to put the projector in the closet, temporarily remote the closet doors (put in attic or something) and project from there? You can always put black velvet on the walls, ceiling around the screen. It can even be installed with thumb tacks, since its temporary. My velvet "temporary" thumb tack install was done in 2010 and just so happens to still be the main way it's installed. Someday I'll remove it and install it better.

 

[nathan_h]

If my measurements and math are accurate, I won't have to remove the closet doors, just open them when in use. 24 inches of depth should mean the projector can be mounted in there okay.

One of the design principals of this room is that it won't be a dedicated space. Rather, this is a multi-use room that has to double as a guest room (think, sleeper sofa instead of theater chairs, the horror!) and retain the basic color scheme of the rest of the home, while we save money to build a garage, which will incorporate a dedicated room.

So, an electric screen that rolls down, a projector that "hides away" in the closet, etc, will be the approach..... and I'm going to be working with these colors. This is the screen wall. Black out curtain/shade will be added in some fashion. So, this is the color scheme (but not the actual furniture -- this is the model home).