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Discussion Starter #1,661 (Edited)
I have one of the Dayton titanic 4 models in a 15 inch version. Do you think that it would work in the box you just modeled ?


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That woofer has an EBP of 50.9 so it is tent polling in the Micro cabinet. Values of 70 and up usually do pretty well in Devastators. You could probably make it work, but I cannot say how good or not good sound quality will be. As you can see the woofer is ringing quite a bit in the cabinet, it is the green line, the TBW is the pink line. The pink line gets back down to zero fairly quickly. The TBW has a EBP value of 97, so it is very well suited to working in a high order band pass box, like a Devastator.






 

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@Red Five

I have a friend that bought 4 UM18s and he put them in 35”h x24”d x 26”w ported boxes. He play 95% music and he wants to switch to 21s but I thought I would ask the question here if a little larger Dev box would give him all he needs for music, nice low end but really good midbass.

Please let me know what you recommend

Thanks


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Discussion Starter #1,663
@Red Five

I have a friend that bought 4 UM18s and he put them in 35”h x24”d x 26”w ported boxes. He play 95% music and he wants to switch to 21s but I thought I would ask the question here if a little larger Dev box would give him all he needs for music, nice low end but really good midbass.

Please let me know what you recommend

Thanks


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The Mini 21" version 4 or version 5 would be well suited for that role. 19Hz tuned and 18Hz tuned respectfully and are well balanced for the multi purpose role. Music the UMs will have nothing on them... :) I am working on a Micro 21" Devastator V1 that is 20Hz tuned. That will most likely be 34x25.5x24 and really push hard anywhere north of 20Hz.
 

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The Mini 21" version 4 or version 5 would be well suited for that role. 19Hz tuned and 18Hz tuned respectfully and are well balanced for the multi purpose role. Music the UMs will have nothing on them... :) I am working on a Micro 21" Devastator V1 that is 20Hz tuned. That will most likely be 34x25.5x24 and really push hard anywhere north of 20Hz.

Okay perfect, thanks for getting back to me I will let him know. What driver will you be recommending for the Micro 21” Dev V1


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Discussion Starter #1,665
Okay perfect, thanks for getting back to me I will let him know. What driver will you be recommending for the Micro 21” Dev V1


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SAN214.50, 21DS115 and the NSW. The PSS would work, but it is way down at 20Hz but does great 30Hz up.
 

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Discussion Starter #1,667
Thanks so much


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I can also look at the 18DS100, it is something that sticks with 21"s. That will work in the current Micro 18". The current Mini 18" V1s in my setup can bring it with music it is ridiculous even in my large space. Four of those Micros would level UMs with small fractions of power for music.
 

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I can also look at the 18DS100, it is something that sticks with 21"s. That will work in the current Micro 18". The current Mini 18" V1s in my setup can bring it with music it is ridiculous even in my large space. Four of those Micros would level UMs with small fractions of power for music.

I think I might of mislead you a little bit, instead of his ported boxes with the UMs in it can he take his UMs and put them in one of your Devs and get good results or do the UMs not perform well in the Devs?


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I think I might of mislead you a little bit, instead of his ported boxes with the UMs in it can he take his UMs and put them in one of your Devs and get good results or do the UMs not perform well in the Devs?


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If you go up to post number 1661, the UM does even worse in a Devastator than the Titanic. EBP is around 32 on that woofer, I am looking for a value of 70ish or more for getting it to work well. The UM is well suited for a lower order band pass box, like the Sub Max V3.

You can see the impulse graph, the woofer is wobbling around after the pulse signal tells it to move and it does not settle down quickly. Air works like a spring when you shock it with a piston in a confined volume. There is energy in the air mass that was acted on and once the woofer no longer has its motor driving it into that air mass, the air mass will unload that energy back into the woofer. Unfortunately for the UM it does not have a stiff suspension to bring it back to rest and it also has a lot of mass, which is harder to slow down. The vented rear chamber in the Devastator also does not help with getting the cone to slow down, it takes a few cycles for the BR chambers to load the woofer. This all adds up to a bad fit for the UM.
 

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If you go up to post number 1661, the UM does even worse in a Devastator than the Titanic. EBP is around 32 on that woofer, I am looking for a value of 70ish or more for getting it to work well. The UM is well suited for a lower order band pass box, like the Sub Max V3.

You can see the impulse graph, the woofer is wobbling around after the pulse signal tells it to move and it does not settle down quickly. Air works like a spring when you shock it with a piston in a confined volume. There is energy in the air mass that was acted on and once the woofer no longer has its motor driving it into that air mass, the air mass will unload that energy back into the woofer. Unfortunately for the UM it does not have a stiff suspension to bring it back to rest and it also has a lot of mass, which is harder to slow down. The vented rear chamber in the Devastator also does not help with getting the cone to slow down, it takes a few cycles for the BR chambers to load the woofer. This all adds up to a bad fit for the UM.

Okay perfect thanks for the clarification


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Discussion Starter #1,671
I have a lot of stuff in the pipeline; The Micro 18" V2 seen below, Micro 21" V1 34x25.5x24, The Devastator 21" Version 7 48x30x20, The Dual 15" (needs work to handle 15TBW100s) and also the Hiwell BMD 24". If you have intentions of building one of the above options soon, please say something :)


Here is the Micro 18" V2, 18Hz tune and capable of handling 18DS115s, which the sim is based on at 1000 watts. Velocity sits at 22.7m/s with an active high pass filter, this is stupid good for that woofer... it will handle 2000 watts of power into the 18DS115 :) The 18DS100 is another good option for this enclosure.



 

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@Red Five, how do you think the Shallow Devastator I just built compares to the Mini Devastator in the mid bass range? Do you have a mini Devastator 20" deep? If so, I will probably get rid of the shallow version and build the mini. Tonight I'm going to try those filters ya'll were talking about yesterday on my thread. So far I've noticed a good bit of low end extension, but not as much mid bass as I was hoping for. But this could be a room mode.
 

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Discussion Starter #1,673 (Edited)
@Red Five , how do you think the Shallow Devastator I just built compares to the Mini Devastator in the mid bass range? Do you have a mini Devastator 20" deep? If so, I will probably get rid of the shallow version and build the mini. Tonight I'm going to try those filters ya'll were talking about yesterday on my thread. So far I've noticed a good bit of low end extension, but not as much mid bass as I was hoping for. But this could be a room mode.

Are you looking for full extension or just MBM duty? The Minis will have much more mid bass. The BMDs are only a few db hot at 80Hz vs the 20Hz region, the Minis are more like 15db hot in that range. Edit: let me rephrase that, if you want full extension I would have to move up into the Devastator V7 to hit the 20in depth. Way more mid bass than a BMD, but not as much as a Mini. An MBM can be done in 40x30x20 from my experience.
 

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MBM duty. My 24s will handle the low stuff. I built these because it was the only option 20" deep.
 

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Discussion Starter #1,675 (Edited)
MBM duty. My 24s will handle the low stuff. I built these because it was the only option 20" deep.

This is cruising at 1000 watts of power with about 28 to 29Hz tune. That is a gain of 8db on the left corner, usually you see about 115db around 20Hz.



 

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I have a lot of stuff in the pipeline; The Micro 18" V2 seen below, Micro 21" V1 34x25.5x24, The Devastator 21" Version 7 48x30x20, The Dual 15" (needs work to handle 15TBW100s) and also the Hiwell BMD 24". If you have intentions of building one of the above options soon, please say something :)


Here is the Micro 18" V2, 18Hz tune and capable of handling 18DS115s, which the sim is based on at 1000 watts. Velocity sits at 22.7m/s with an active high pass filter, this is stupid good for that woofer... it will handle 2000 watts of power into the 18DS115 :) The 18DS100 is another good option for this enclosure.
I was unable to get a quote for the hiwell driver, so I wouldn’t work on that unless it becomes more available
 

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I can modify everything on my cabinets except the port height. What does the Mini look like with a 2.5" port height?
 

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Discussion Starter #1,678 (Edited)
I can modify everything on my cabinets except the port height. What does the Mini look like with a 2.5" port height?

Chopping it at 40" tall and leaving the port at the current length should look like this, around 27Hz on the tune. You should be able to retro fit a top hatch assembly for accessing the woofer. The cutout is probably below the top of the baffle, you might have to drop a manifold in there to cover that up.

 

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How about leaving the rear chamber and cab height alone, and just shortening the qw?

It will look funky and have wasted volume, but should work well.

Chris
 

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Discussion Starter #1,680
How about leaving the rear chamber and cab height alone, and just shortening the qw?

It will look funky and have wasted volume, but should work well.

Chris

Are you suggesting cutting the front open and putting a stopper in the QW? That would be the easiest thing.
 
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