[HuskerOmaha]

Hello again from Husker Country. Finally getting my lazy butt in gear and finishing this space out.
Time to get back into AVSforums!

Attached preliminary plans, hope to finalize in a month or so the layout.
Need to add a bunch more detail for the theater room.
SUGGESTIONS on basement plan and theater room would be great.


About the only thing I have for sure planned are these FOUR (4) Martysubs from GSG waiting to be built.
They are cut to take my 4-UXL-18s from Mach 5 audio that are currently in sealed setups in my family room.
This is entirely overkill, I know. I initially was going to do an open theater concept.

Here goes nothing, back to reading threads -

HO



@eljaycanuck; @nebrunner; @desertdome; @d_c; @dominguez1; @Scott Simonian; @Archaea; @General Kenobi; @W00lly; @andersa; @jedimastergrant; @NightSkyMurals; @rkinmoval; @Brad Horstkotte; @beastaudio; @carp

 

[PreciseD]

Is that room already framed?

 

[HuskerOmaha]

Is that room already framed?

It is a walk-out basement, so the top wall in the PDF with windows and sliding door is finished across that whole side of the house.

Will need to do some work on it though with outlets/TV spots, etc.

 

[PreciseD]

Anyway to make the theater room space larger? Not sure how you are going to fit that many seats and those 4 subs in a room that small..

 

[HuskerOmaha]

Anyway to make the theater room space larger? Not sure how you are going to fit that many seats and those 4 subs in a room that small..

With the support posts, that's the only fit that made sense. The left wall of theater runs through one post to the wine room. There is another stack on the next wall to the left which is left wine room wall. So kind of how we were using that space. I actually was thinking of putting the AV rack behind the wine room backing to the theater space. Doing AT screen.

Not a huge room, but thought could squeeze a nice small theater in?
And yeah it may be more tighter fit, more like 3 seats and 3, or maybe a larger love seat style with singles on each side in back row (no door swing issue). Still wondering about those seats.

 

[PreciseD]

I think those seats are throwing me off.. They are not to scale right?

With a 12'-6" finished room width you should be able to fit a row of 3 seats, but many will say that is not ideal for spacing from surrounds. The rear row could use commercial seating with a row of 4 for spill over.. Again sound will be compromised for their seats since they will be against the rear wall..

Can you gain some length by going all the way against the foundation wall?

 

[HuskerOmaha]

I think those seats are throwing me off.. They are not to scale right?

With a 12'-6" finished room width you should be able to fit a row of 3 seats, but many will say that is not ideal for spacing from surrounds. The rear row could use commercial seating with a row of 4 for spill over.. Again sound will be compromised for their seats since they will be against the rear wall..

Can you gain some length by going all the way against the foundation wall?

I don't think the seats are to scale, but it is a professional design place, and I went and measured and the row of 4 does seem to fit if you don't buy the huge wide seats....

Good catch, the room WILL go all the way to the foundation wall. The designer mistook my direction when I said it would be an AT screen and I'd have the speakers and subs behind it, and that the martys were X by X, so he just moved the wall. It Will go all the way to wall, but you lose a few feet into room with AT screen of course. If that answers the question.

Just got suggested for the door to try a swing out or in murphy door for the pool cues. Sounds kind of fun?

Pool Cue Murphy Door

 

[PreciseD]

I wonder how bad it will rattle when your subs are rocking the house..

 

[NightSkyMurals]

I see I was tagged. Nice!

If you have any questions for me, go ahead and shoot me an email if you'd like. I'll be happy to answer them. Have you already written to me? I have a few customers in the Omaha area. Either way, if you are just in the planning stages, this is the perfect time to get in touch with me. I might have a good suggestion or two. Maybe.

Jeff

Hello again from Husker Country. Finally getting my lazy butt in gear and finishing this space out.
Time to get back into AVSforums!

Attached preliminary plans, hope to finalize in a month or so the layout.
Need to add a bunch more detail for the theater room.
SUGGESTIONS on basement plan and theater room would be great.


About the only thing I have for sure planned are these FOUR (4) Martysubs from GSG waiting to be built.
They are cut to take my 4-UXL-18s from Mach 5 audio that are currently in sealed setups in my family room.
This is entirely overkill, I know. I initially was going to do an open theater concept.

Here goes nothing, back to reading threads -

HO



@eljaycanuck; @nebrunner; @desertdome; @d_c; @dominguez1; @Scott Simonian; @Archaea; @General Kenobi; @W00lly; @andersa; @jedimastergrant; @NightSkyMurals; @rkinmoval; @Brad Horstkotte; @beastaudio; @carp

 

[HuskerOmaha]

I see I was tagged. Nice!

If you have any questions for me, go ahead and shoot me an email if you'd like. I'll be happy to answer them. Have you already written to me? I have a few customers in the Omaha area. Either way, if you are just in the planning stages, this is the perfect time to get in touch with me. I might have a good suggestion or two. Maybe.

Jeff

Hey Jeff - yeah, you may have done our master bedroom and I may have upgraded the tube lights to the LED strips that work awesome. I think when my shades are up I can see the effect from 1/2 mile away. Might have to consider some mural work in the theater is all.

 

[HuskerOmaha]

I wonder how bad it will rattle when your subs are rocking the house..

Part of the reason I was considering an outside door for aesthetics, and an inside door for sealing purposes...I've seen a couple examples. I don't need this to be a 99.99% acoustic theater or done that well, going for the 95% version!

 

[Tedd]

Could you slide the front columns back a bit, and host a support post in the column. That could widen the room fractionally.

You also might treat everything in front of the column black, as a shadow box to absorb light coming off the screen. That would help to preserve/maximise you projector's
contrast ratio.

I also might be tempted to splay the side walls a wee bit. Surrender a few inches up front, and have them in the back of the room. Might let you center the seating better.

 

[Archaea]

Center a seat. As an enthusiast, you want at least one true center seat. Maybe your drafting professional doesn’t know the importance of that. But you do. @carp talked me into it in my current room and I’m glad he did.

Move the wine cellar room to make your theater a bit wider? Contact an engineer to see of the supports can be moved a few feet.
I agree, its going to be too tight in there for the displayed seating — I think my four Berkline theater seats are 14’ wide. So 3 would be a bit over 10’. Not much room for an isle unless you buy pretty small seats. Maybe couches instead.

For the rear row consider a riser with small subwoofers integrated in the top platform for tactile shake. The $30 JBLs used in the BOSS thread have proven their merit. Two or four of them go a long way for tactile shake! Carp has done that in his room and its a fantastic addition!

If you do move forward with the dedicated room, consider small line array speakers as surround speakers. They will allow for the nearest seating positions to not be blown away by volume due to a speaker being so close. IE I can walk up and put my ear right next to my line arrays at reference volume and it doesn’t seem too loud. Thats because my ear is next to one of 16 tweeters and one of four mids instead of just one tweeter and one mid — each individual speaker on a line array doesn’t have to play as loud, allowing for closer seat to speaker placement without getting blown out. JBL makes quite a few CBT speakers and if you watch ebay you can pick them up on great prices from time to time as a church or business remodels.
https://www.jblpro.com/www/products/installed-sound/cbt-series#.Xbwo6CVOmaM
Search for JBL CBT on ebay. Maybe the 50 series might be a match?

You were originally going with the open floor plan theater? Why the shift? Honestly, I think I may prefer the open floor plan given your space/layout options. You don’t have to double up on two AV systems on the same floor. I suspect if you do have two systems, your home theater space will be wildly underused in favor of the big tv/open bar area/game room. “Hey want to watch it in the small theater? Or the 40’ open game room?” Ummm, where we are is fine, I’m comfortable and the food and drink are right here”.
—Those glorious ported subs will then go unused!

For the big area you could consider rear projection with a series of mirrors and an AT/storage space behind the screen that would allow for full lights to be on in the open area without affecting the projected image. @JDontee has done that here in KC. Its really nice to be watching a big projected image with the lights on. The concept would fit an open floor plan perfectly!

 

[d_c]

Is it room within a room build? Full decoupling?

I'd do whatever it takes to get that room to 15' wide. I was able to move one of my lolly columns 3' without adding anything to the i-beam. I echo the 3 chairs per row max to get the center seat. It's nice to have a couch like you mentioned. My kid and her friends cram them in 6 wide on our couch in the HT. Maybe move the wine room to a different location and use the space for the av gear so that all the noise and heat is outside of the room.

How will you manage the air flow and climate control in there?

 

[HuskerOmaha]

Could you slide the front columns back a bit, and host a support post in the column. That could widen the room fractionally.

You also might treat everything in front of the column black, as a shadow box to absorb light coming off the screen. That would help to preserve/maximise you projector's
contrast ratio.

I also might be tempted to splay the side walls a wee bit. Surrender a few inches up front, and have them in the back of the room. Might let you center the seating better.

Good ideas here with you guys. I wouldn't mind pushing the column over (so I need to find a structural engineer, eh?). I'd just need to find another location for a wine area, could wrap that into that popcorn bar area maybe towards the top. I dunno. Or just tell wife sorry. If I could move the column over a few feet, get us to 14-15', would be nice. Probably the max I'd go if dedicated otherwise starts looking weird with the sliding door to outside.

Center a seat. As an enthusiast, you want at least one true center seat. Maybe your drafting professional doesn’t know the importance of that. But you do. @carp talked me into it in my current room and I’m glad he did.

Move the wine cellar room to make your theater a bit wider? Contact an engineer to see of the supports can be moved a few feet.

For the rear row consider a riser with small subwoofers integrated in the top platform for tactile shake. The $30 JBLs used in the BOSS thread have proven their merit. Two or four of them go a long way for tactile shake! Carp has done that in his room and its a fantastic addition!

If you do move forward with the dedicated room, consider small line array speakers as surround speakers. They will allow for the nearest seating positions to not be blown away by volume due to a speaker being so close. IE I can walk up and put my ear right next to my line arrays at reference volume and it doesn’t seem too loud. Thats because my ear is next to one of 16 tweeters and one of four mids instead of just one tweeter and one mid — each individual speaker on a line array doesn’t have to play as loud, allowing for closer seat to speaker placement without getting blown out. JBL makes quite a few CBT speakers and if you watch ebay you can pick them up on great prices from time to time as a church or business remodels.
https://www.jblpro.com/www/products/installed-sound/cbt-series#.Xbwo6CVOmaM
Search for JBL CBT on ebay. Maybe the 50 series might be a match?

You were originally going with the open floor plan theater? Why the shift? Honestly, I think I may prefer the open floor plan given your space/layout options. You don’t have to double up on two AV systems on the same floor. I suspect if you do have two systems, your home theater space will be wildly underused in favor of the big tv/open bar area/game room. “Hey want to watch it in the small theater? Or the 40’ open game room?” Ummm, where we are is fine, I’m comfortable and the food and drink are right here”.
—Those glorious ported subs will then go unused!

For the big area you could consider rear projection with a series of mirrors and an AT/storage space behind the screen that would allow for full lights to be on in the open area without affecting the projected image. @JDontee has done that here in KC. Its really nice to be watching a big projected image with the lights on. The concept would fit an open floor plan perfectly!

I don't know, over time I got talked into doing a dedicated space. Movie experience, you know? I kind of liked the idea of breaking the basement up into different spaces instead of one huge open space. I get your idea of the open idea, we might just be too far gone for that, but haven't started yet! But want to get started, its been 5 @#$#@ years.

Good ideas on the line arrays. I dig that idea. Would be really cool. subs in the floor? sure why not. Those 4 marty's won't be enough anyways. @rkinmoval already has me needing a knee wall too. Gonna need that 15' width I guess.

Is it room within a room build? Full decoupling?

I'd do whatever it takes to get that room to 15' wide. I was able to move one of my lolly columns 3' without adding anything to the i-beam. I echo the 3 chairs per row max to get the center seat. It's nice to have a couch like you mentioned. My kid and her friends cram them in 6 wide on our couch in the HT. Maybe move the wine room to a different location and use the space for the av gear so that all the noise and heat is outside of the room.

How will you manage the air flow and climate control in there?

I wasn't sure how far I'd take the decoupling. If we are talking to the ceiling, above is the kitchen, and the master is on the other side of the house (above bar in pdf). So, noise isn't a huge concern. Rest of rooms are all 2nd floor. The right wall and bottom wall are poured walls. Open to ideas. Could always have a less formal wine room in the storage area back by HVAC. It was just a fun piece to put in the basement and dressed up with stone, etc. for the wifey. So will try to probs keep somewhere.

I was going to add a 3rd HVAC zone just for the theater, I had the company out and my system can do it without impacting more ceiling. Or I could make the whole basement one, but figured I'd run basement on the main level zone, and maybe move a thermostat to a location on main level that made more sense than where they have right now. Thoughts?
I thought about putting returns in a couple of the bump outs where the line arrays/surrounds would go. Anyone ever done that?

 

[d_c]

I think it's all-er-nuthin for the soundproofing approach. Clip and channel all the way around with double drywall and greenglue at the least if you are soundproofing and decoupling. It's more hours, more money, more thought and parts getting wires and hvac through, building double doors, sealing cracks, etc. If not decoupling, I'd at least mass load the space between the ceiling joists with double drywall and green glue, and insulating all the walls with safe-n-sound - it really helps with the bass.

 

[NightSkyMurals]

I'd love to help you get a really cool night sky in there. Just let me know if you have questions. Again, the design stage3 isn't too soon to start asking questions. I have a little Info. Sheet that I can send you too, if you want to email me.

Hey Jeff - yeah, you may have done our master bedroom and I may have upgraded the tube lights to the LED strips that work awesome. I think when my shades are up I can see the effect from 1/2 mile away. Might have to consider some mural work in the theater is all.

 

[carp]

It sounds like it might be too late but I really like the one big open room idea too. A friend of mine had his basement done last year and he has a 30 ish x 40 ish space with a huge full bar area, game area, and HT on the other side. When the lights go out for a movie you don't care that you aren't in a dedicated room.

Also, with a BOSS setup you won't have to worry about having a larger area to fill the with bass, BOSS will give you all the tactile feel you would ever want down to the single digits and the audible volume from your subs combined with this will be plenty.

 

[HuskerOmaha]

It sounds like it might be too late but I really like the one big open room idea too. A friend of mine had his basement done last year and he has a 30 ish x 40 ish space with a huge full bar area, game area, and HT on the other side. When the lights go out for a movie you don't care that you aren't in a dedicated room.

Also, with a BOSS setup you won't have to worry about having a larger area to fill the with bass, BOSS will give you all the tactile feel you would ever want down to the single digits and the audible volume from your subs combined with this will be plenty.

@Archaea

Open room = $$$$ savings.

If I did do that, I'd probably have the screen on the right foundation wall.
Keep the popcorn area on the top with cabinets, and maybe even run a partial wall back towards the bar area for a left contain area? Essentially keep the length of wall that would currently be the back wall of theater? Then mirror that on the right side like I was going to anyways to put that post in a wall? So about 12' run on each side. Theater screen ends up on a wall that could be roughly 16', so decent side room for light treatment. Angles seem like they'd work.

Then the AT screen, etc still all fits nice, all the subs behind, etc. I'd have some room to right of theater footprint for the wine room/AV equipment, whatever. Pool table maybe rotates vertically? Maybe only one row of real theater seats then? 4? Hmm. Not opposed to it. Be easier for me. Not sure what you do to maximize effectiveness of any treatments for sound/light? Probably need to do some reading on this approach. I did like that one Castaway maybe or whatever that was an open room, have to go digging.

 

[jedimastergrant]

I like all the suggestions so far. The advantages of a dedicated room are worth it if you can make the room bigger. For a 12' width I would choose a non dedicated room and probably do something like what you described. The sound proofing is kind of an all or nothing and if you choose that path it can be a colossal headache. A small space can be really frustrating and it limits your options. So just to reiterate that a larger non dedicated space is so much easier. My room is 15x19 and I think it is too small. A smaller room could mean going with thin in walls for your surrounds and in ceiling for height channels for likely more cost and less performace. It limits your options for placement of your LCR and so many things. Not to mention the heating and cooling concerns. But, if you can make the room bigger then go for it. I have no regrets about converting my plans (right in the middle of framing) to a dedicated space.

I see that you mentioned your kitchen is located above the theater space. You will likely get to hear every dish rattle even with sound proofing. You might consider doing something under the subfloor to mitigate footfall from the floor above. That could be a constant source of frustration. I put double 5/8'' drywall with a green glue layer and it did help quite a bit with my before and after testing. But it won't do much to keep sound from escaping from the theater to the kitchen.

I would still go with a center money seat even if you are going to go with the non dedicated route. The location of surround channels and treatments is a bit of a concern but I'm sure it can be solved for. I wonder if your equipment room could be located on the "bottom" of your plans where your screen was going to go if it were a dedicated space. And possibly your wine room could be moved a bit to somehow make an even wall for that side of the theater so speakers and treatments can be easily placed there. Lots of possibilities.