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Yes, I have done a lot of research and have had other projectors in the same room before this one. So I know the limitations and am willing to live with those that I can't remedy, for the sake of having a larger image. Everything I read implied that the 5050 was darker than it actually is, hence my disappointment. I can adjust it to make it satisfactory so all should be well in the end. I know I won't achieve its full potential but I think it will satisfy more than anything else that I can afford.
Here is some images in my not so optimal room with a ALR screen. The screenshots is in comparison to my light grey wall with lights off. As you can see I also have a gloss white door to the right and a gloss white ceiling. In time to come I will be painting these a different color, but the ALR is doing a great job IMO in getting the deepest black. I'm pretty new to projection so I'm learning on the fly but I'm over the moon with the PQ (including black levels) I am getting. And with more room treatment it is only going to get better. I didn't spend 2K on a projector not to spend few extra hundred to get the best I can from it.
So I think when talk about the 5050 base performance, perhaps your room and screen base performance is more sub par than the projector
 

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I've seen that. May try some things. My questions were about the projector's base performance with black, which I'm finding to be less than I inferred from the various reviews and posts. But being adjustable, I can get it to where it satifies even if a lot less than perfect.
To be frank, you haven't seen your projector's base performance with black. You took a projector and slapped it up in an environment that wasn't at all designed for such a projector.

People on these forums and a lot of reviewers spend a lot of time and money to optimize their rooms for projectors. They literally have the opposite of your room. So, when they exclaim that this projector has great black levels they are doing so with the context of having a really well optimized room. I'll go over some charts again, maybe I didn't explain it well enough.

Here's the Epson 5040 in 3 different types of rooms. Remember, people around here typically have the Optimized Room or Ideal Room, you have the Living room:
3147080

To give you an idea of what these ADL percentages look like in test pattern form, here's this:
3147081


That 2% ADL pattern isn't too far off from a star field with maybe a smallish ship in it; mostly black. Well, at that ADL level you are seeing 60% worse contrast than those with ideal or optimized rooms. Also, at 1% ADL, which is for sure star field levels, you are seeing a 50% reduction That contrast reduction for sure isn't coming from our rooms making the image less bright. It's from the living room casting light back on the screen and raising the black level. No wonder your expectations weren't met when you were reading about people's experiences in rooms that would outperform your room by 50+%! But, not only that, you were using the projector in modes that are not going to result in the 5050's best black level performance. I'm not sure what you dialed the iris down to, and what other settings you have set. Maybe you have it now outputting the correct fL for your screen size. But then again, maybe not.

Unfortunately, your room is just not going to be able to take full advantage of the Epson 5050. Even a grey screen won't fix everything, but it will massively help. If you want some ideas on how you could treat the room to help reduce reflections then there are many people here that can help with that too.
 

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To be frank, you haven't seen your projector's base performance with black. You took a projector and slapped it up in an environment that wasn't at all designed for such a projector.

People on these forums and a lot of reviewers spend a lot of time and money to optimize their rooms for projectors. They literally have the opposite of your room. So, when they exclaim that this projector has great black levels they are doing so with the context of having a really well optimized room. I'll go over some charts again, maybe I didn't explain it well enough.

Here's the Epson 5040 in 3 different types of rooms. Remember, people around here typically have the Optimized Room or Ideal Room, you have the Living room:
View attachment 3147080
To give you an idea of what these ADL percentages look like in test pattern form, here's this:
View attachment 3147081

That 2% ADL pattern isn't too far off from a star field with maybe a smallish ship in it; mostly black. Well, at that ADL level you are seeing 60% worse contrast than those with ideal or optimized rooms. Also, at 1% ADL, which is for sure star field levels, you are seeing a 50% reduction That contrast reduction for sure isn't coming from our rooms making the image less bright. It's from the living room casting light back on the screen and raising the black level. No wonder your expectations weren't met when you were reading about people's experiences in rooms that would outperform your room by 50+%! But, not only that, you were using the projector in modes that are not going to result in the 5050's best black level performance. I'm not sure what you dialed the iris down to, and what other settings you have set. Maybe you have it now outputting the correct fL for your screen size. But then again, maybe not.

Unfortunately, your room is just not going to be able to take full advantage of the Epson 5050. Even a grey screen won't fix everything, but it will massively help. If you want some ideas on how you could treat the room to help reduce reflections then there are many people here that can help with that too.
Like I said earlier, people try to "force" a projector into a room that it doesn't belong in, then complain about the image quality. It's like trying to jam a square peg into a round hole. Use the money on an OLED instead.

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk
 

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You'll get the best blacks in a fully treated, fully light controlled room. Any bit of ambient light, will take away your deep blacks.

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk
There is no ambient light whatsoever in the room. It's all from the projector. I think everyone is missing my point. A projector that has excellent black will look black on a full black image even in a white room since that's the only light there is. The worse the projector is at black, the lighter the screen gets. And the scattered light washes it out even more. The 5050 seems to me to start out with black level higher than I expected based on reviews and forum experiences.
 

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To be frank, you haven't seen your projector's base performance with black. You took a projector and slapped it up in an environment that wasn't at all designed for such a projector.

People on these forums and a lot of reviewers spend a lot of time and money to optimize their rooms for projectors. They literally have the opposite of your room. So, when they exclaim that this projector has great black levels they are doing so with the context of having a really well optimized room. I'll go over some charts again, maybe I didn't explain it well enough.

Here's the Epson 5040 in 3 different types of rooms. Remember, people around here typically have the Optimized Room or Ideal Room, you have the Living room:
View attachment 3147080
To give you an idea of what these ADL percentages look like in test pattern form, here's this:
View attachment 3147081

That 2% ADL pattern isn't too far off from a star field with maybe a smallish ship in it; mostly black. Well, at that ADL level you are seeing 60% worse contrast than those with ideal or optimized rooms. Also, at 1% ADL, which is for sure star field levels, you are seeing a 50% reduction That contrast reduction for sure isn't coming from our rooms making the image less bright. It's from the living room casting light back on the screen and raising the black level. No wonder your expectations weren't met when you were reading about people's experiences in rooms that would outperform your room by 50+%! But, not only that, you were using the projector in modes that are not going to result in the 5050's best black level performance. I'm not sure what you dialed the iris down to, and what other settings you have set. Maybe you have it now outputting the correct fL for your screen size. But then again, maybe not.

Unfortunately, your room is just not going to be able to take full advantage of the Epson 5050. Even a grey screen won't fix everything, but it will massively help. If you want some ideas on how you could treat the room to help reduce reflections then there are many people here that can help with that too.
I realize this. I'm talking about 0%. That should look pretty dark if the projector has good black. And on a 0% image it look awfully bright to me.
 

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Like I said earlier, people try to "force" a projector into a room that it doesn't belong in, then complain about the image quality. It's like trying to jam a square peg into a round hole. Use the money on an OLED instead.

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk
No one has posted that I've ever seen a shot of the screen showing a black-only image next to something that is truly black. To show how close, or far off the two are from each other. All the shots have bright portions which invalidates them for showing just how dark black can be in the room they're in. I'm not dissatisfied with images that have some bright in them, it's in images that have no bright in them or very little. Someone post a shot of a 0% field including the screen black frame or wall behind the screen. When I display such the screen is much brighter than the walls.
 

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To be frank, you haven't seen your projector's base performance with black. You took a projector and slapped it up in an environment that wasn't at all designed for such a projector.

People on these forums and a lot of reviewers spend a lot of time and money to optimize their rooms for projectors. They literally have the opposite of your room. So, when they exclaim that this projector has great black levels they are doing so with the context of having a really well optimized room. I'll go over some charts again, maybe I didn't explain it well enough.

Here's the Epson 5040 in 3 different types of rooms. Remember, people around here typically have the Optimized Room or Ideal Room, you have the Living room:
View attachment 3147080
To give you an idea of what these ADL percentages look like in test pattern form, here's this:
View attachment 3147081

That 2% ADL pattern isn't too far off from a star field with maybe a smallish ship in it; mostly black. Well, at that ADL level you are seeing 60% worse contrast than those with ideal or optimized rooms. Also, at 1% ADL, which is for sure star field levels, you are seeing a 50% reduction That contrast reduction for sure isn't coming from our rooms making the image less bright. It's from the living room casting light back on the screen and raising the black level. No wonder your expectations weren't met when you were reading about people's experiences in rooms that would outperform your room by 50+%! But, not only that, you were using the projector in modes that are not going to result in the 5050's best black level performance. I'm not sure what you dialed the iris down to, and what other settings you have set. Maybe you have it now outputting the correct fL for your screen size. But then again, maybe not.

Unfortunately, your room is just not going to be able to take full advantage of the Epson 5050. Even a grey screen won't fix everything, but it will massively help. If you want some ideas on how you could treat the room to help reduce reflections then there are many people here that can help with that too.
Again you're all missing my point. If I show a 0% pattern I'll see the best black attainable in my room. I never said I wanted perfect black. I just said that the starting point for black seemed a lot brighter than any comments I'd seen anywhere on the 5050. When I show 0% I see very little of the room but the screen is quite bright relative to the room. Which means that a lot more light gets out the lens than I would have expected. That isn't due to the room. it's due to the projector.
 

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Here are some more demos of my room. As you can understand the Iphone does not do the image justice but again you can get an idea of how it looks WITH the evironment.
It is lights ON, OFF and blackout curtains UP and DOWN





Here you can find more
 
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