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Thanks JD.

Can you elaborate on "Auto Lip sync delay (increase from 200ms to 500ms)"?


You state "analog --> HDMI conversion" under S920W, but earlier say it's removed in all models up to at least X2300.


Like others said, so far it looks like 2015's models are better because of the analog to HDMI video.
 

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Discussion Starter · #22 ·
Agreed. Analog to HDMI conversion is actually a very useful feature for many. Smells like cost cutting to me.
The vast majority of new owners buying a surround sound AVR likely have only HDMI sources, so dropping analog --> HDMI conversion actually makes sense.
 

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Discussion Starter · #23 ·
Thanks JD.

Can you elaborate on "Auto Lip sync delay (increase from 200ms to 500ms)"?


You state "analog --> HDMI conversion" under S920W, but earlier say it's removed in all models up to at least X2300.


Like others said, so far it looks like 2015's models are better because of the analog to HDMI video.

1. The new delay setting simply provides additional delay.
2. I actually say "No analog --> HDMI conversion"
 

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To bridge the gap between my budget and technology advancements I purchased, as mentioned before, a Pioneer 1124 to fill the void. If everything goes according to plan looking at a X4300 this fall. Although as others have noted a discounted X4200 could be might appealing.

To my question.

One of the things I do not like about the way the Pioneer, and other makes, is the logic for some of the program access. For Pandora it is not a discrete option. The way you access Pandora is cycle through the other on-line type apps. Makes it difficult to program a Harmony universal remote.

Internet radio-Pandora-Tunein-Airplay----etc.

How does the X4300 do this? Are the on-line streaming apps like Pandora assigned to their own discrete command or do you have to cycle through the different types of on-line apps?
 

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I love the fact that they added the Yamaha feature "RC Select" ................ this can be a very useful feature. This was one big advantage that Yamaha receivers possessed and it is nice to see Denon add this feature.
 

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Discussion Starter · #26 ·
To bridge the gap between my budget and technology advancements I purchased, as mentioned before, a Pioneer 1124 to fill the void. If everything goes according to plan looking at a X4300 this fall. Although as others have noted a discounted X4200 could be might appealing.

To my question.

One of the things I do not like about the way the Pioneer, and other makes, is the logic for some of the program access. For Pandora it is not a discrete option. The way you access Pandora is cycle through the other on-line type apps. Makes it difficult to program a Harmony universal remote.

Internet radio-Pandora-Tunein-Airplay----etc.

How does the X4300 do this? Are the on-line streaming apps like Pandora assigned to their own discrete command or do you have to cycle through the different types of on-line apps?

You first cycle through the various networking services and select Pandora and then select your saved station. Once it starts playing, you can then save your selection to one of the (4) Quick Select buttons on the remote. When you want to play it again, you can simply press the Quick Select which will not only power on the AVR but also start your Pandora radio station.
 

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"You first cycle through the various networking services and select Pandora"

Thanks but that's what I don't like about the way the Pioneer does things. I never did Pandora on my 3808.

No discrete command to go right to Pandora?
 

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1. The new delay setting simply provides additional delay.
What's the use case for more than 200ms of delay? Not that I have a problem with more range in case it's needed, but the only things I can think of are sitting 70 meters away from the screen to need that much delay, extremely badly made discs, and serious broadcast problems. :)


2. I actually say "No analog --> HDMI conversion"
Under the S920W heading: "Upgrading from the S720W adds ... analog --> HDMI conversion, ..."
 

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Discussion Starter · #29 ·
"You first cycle through the various networking services and select Pandora"

Thanks but that's what I don't like about the way the Pioneer does things. I never did Pandora on my 3808.

No discrete command to go right to Pandora?
Yes .. it's called a Quick Select as I noted. ;)
 

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Discussion Starter · #30 ·
What's the use case for more than 200ms of delay? Not that I have a problem with more range in case it's needed, but the only things I can think of are sitting 70 meters away from the screen to need that much delay, extremely badly made discs, and serious broadcast problems. :)



Under the S920W heading: "Upgrading from the S720W adds ... analog --> HDMI conversion, ..."
1. No clue, rather the setting has been increased.
2. Oops! Yes, my bad. Thanks for pointing that out. :eek:
 

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Sorry JD but Quick Select is not the same as a discrete command to go to Pandora. Will Quick Select work and can it be used in an Activity for Logitech Harmony remotes? Yes. Can use Quick Select and make an activity that works like presets on a car radio. Sure.

But that's not the same as a discrete command to take you right to Pandora.

My opinion is there needs to be discrete commands for main features.

Went through this same thing with TV's that did not have discrete commands to go to individual inputs. Had to cycle through them. Made programming something like the Harmony impossible. That practice stopped quickly. Vizio was really bad in that regard.

Wonder if the discrete command is available and could be added to the Harmony database.
 

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Discussion Starter · #32 ·
Sorry JD but Quick Select is not the same as a discrete command to go to Pandora. Will Quick Select work and can it be used in an Activity for Logitech Harmony remotes? Yes. Can use Quick Select and make an activity that works like presets on a car radio. Sure.

But that's not the same as a discrete command to take you right to Pandora.

My opinion is there needs to be discrete commands for main features.

Went through this same thing with TV's that did not have discrete commands to go to individual inputs. Had to cycle through them. Made programming something like the Harmony impossible. That practice stopped quickly. Vizio was really bad in that regard.

Wonder if the discrete command is available and could be added to the Harmony database.
We'll agree to disagree then as the Quick Select satisfies your use case.
 

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"We'll agree to disagree"

Disagree about what? I said it can work in a Harmony activity.

However Quick Select is not the same as a discrete command.

Are you saying Quick Select is the same as a discrete command to go directly to Pandora?

What if I want to use Quick Select for other things? Than Pandora is second fiddle?

Going to have to think this through a bit. Not all that thrilled about spending 1500 dollars on a receiver that presents me with the same kind of programming issues that impact usability as a 400 dollar unit. And yes at 1500 dollars stuff like this matters.
 

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Discussion Starter · #34 ·
"We'll agree to disagree"

Disagree about what? I said it can work in a Harmony activity.

However Quick Select is not the same as a discrete command.

Are you saying Quick Select is the same as a discrete command to go directly to Pandora?

What if I want to use Quick Select for other things? Than Pandora is second fiddle?

Going to have to think this through a bit. Not all that thrilled about spending 1500 dollars on a receiver that presents me with the same kind of programming issues that impact usability as a 400 dollar unit. And yes at 1500 dollars stuff like this matters.
That fact that it is a discrete command .. not only is it a single button on the remote but there is a discrete RS-232 command for it as well.
 

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"not only is it a single button on the remote but there is a discrete RS-232 command for it as well."

Then its not a cycle through it kind of thing.

One is not the other. And if there is a discrete command via RS-232 Logitech can add it to the database for the 4300.

If its a cycle through it kind of thing I'll not be buying one.

If its a discrete command it'll remain on my purchase list.
 

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But that's not the same as a discrete command to take you right to Pandora.

My opinion is there needs to be discrete commands for main features.
Well, those commands do exist if you use the serial or network interface. There are far too many--56 pages for my X4000--to include on a single hand-held remote.
 

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Well, those commands do exist if you use the serial or network interface. There are far too many--56 pages for my X4000--to include on a single hand-held remote.
But not too much for a smartphone.
 

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But not too much for a smartphone.
If you have a big enough screen, or can swipe between pages. For installation, setup, and testing purposes we often put quite a few command buttons on an iPad page.
 

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Got my 720 up and running yesterday. Comparing this to my 9 year old Yamaha receiver (also ~$500 at the time) I have some initial impressions.

Overall the unit seems sluggish. The UI is kind of clunky and doesn't respond to the remote quickly. Also, there seems to be a good deal of lag switching between sources.

Maybe this is stuff that can be improved with a FW update... I was just expecting a better user experience considering it's almost been a decade since I bought a receiver.

Finally, I watched Dead Pool last night on UHD and thought the 720 sounded really good. I guess that's really the most important thing! ;)
 

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Discussion Starter · #40 ·
Got my 720 up and running yesterday. Comparing this to my 9 year old Yamaha receiver (also ~$500 at the time) I have some initial impressions.

Overall the unit seems sluggish. The UI is kind of clunky and doesn't respond to the remote quickly. Also, there seems to be a good deal of lag switching between sources.

Maybe this is stuff that can be improved with a FW update... I was just expecting a better user experience considering it's almost been a decade since I bought a receiver.

Finally, I watched Dead Pool last night on UHD and thought the 720 sounded really good. I guess that's really the most important thing! ;)

Try doing a "soft reset" of the AVR by powering it off and unplugging the power cable for 10 minutes.
 
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