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This is a picture of my X8500 in total free air and no extra fans, so you can have a baseline for comparison. You can see my 13 speaker lineup in my sig and I'm not shy about volume settings. The Receiver never gets beyond warm to the touch (and it's to the rear) and I have never been concerned with the operating temp affecting longevity
That may well be, but heat can destroy electronics. So what is the big deal about investing in a $100 fan (AC Infinity) to protect a $4K hobby/investment?
 

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or if it's that big of a deal, spend half the money on one of the cheaper AC Infinity options like I did :)
 

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or if it's that big of a deal, spend half the money on one of the cheaper AC Infinity options like I did /forum/images/smilies/smile.gif
yeah I purchased a fan for my sc 95 from ac, it cost like 30 bucks and it works great. Before I got the fan the receiver would be extremely hot to the touch, now since I got the fan it is barely warm.
 

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Just putting a reply here, as I've been asked this before in a couple of places:
"what makes you choose the X8500H over the SR8012/ AV8805 in the end"

I have owned many Marantz amps as well as Denon ones and I like their sound. So it was a hard pick... but the processor wasn't for me since it was more expensive and processors don't keep their value well. Not only do you need to budget for a power amp, you also need to get a whole bunch of cables and there's more room for noise and interference..

As for the 8012, it looks great and I don't use 13 channels actually. But what I like are
- the potential for HDMI 2.1
- the flexible amp arrangements
- the dialogue feature
- better build quality
- network control function is nice
- extra USB for my fan
- better power - my Dynaudio speakers don't feel starved at all

the 8012 has a few features I like too
- the toroidal tranny
- real radio (the AVC 8500 doesn't have a RDS radio)

I got a good deal on the 8500 and I've never looked back /forum/images/smilies/smile.gif
Yeah I got a pretty good price on it as well. Think I am close to pulling the trigger, I am coming from a pioneer sc 95 outlaw 5 channel amp and emotive bass x 2 channel amp
 

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That may well be, but heat can destroy electronics. So what is the big deal about investing in a $100 fan (AC Infinity) to protect a $4K hobby/investment?
His point being an external fan is simply not required if the unit barely gets warm to the touch as should be the case with open ventilation as his pic shows. ;)
 

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I’ll have one of these in the cabinet soon. If I’m only using the internal amps for four Atmos speakers and two Zone2 speakers, it should stay relatively cool right? Cabinet has vents in bottom and open in the back and will be about four or so inches from the wall.
 

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That may well be, but heat can destroy electronics. So what is the big deal about investing in a $100 fan (AC Infinity) to protect a $4K hobby/investment?
You pays your money and you makes your choice. As an Electrical Engineer, I agree with the observation that heat is the enemy of electronic devices and one should do what one needs to do if it is excessive. My point, as @jdsmoothie has observed, is that my X8500 in totally free air doesn't need extra cooling. YMMV. I sit with my right ear 3' from the X8500 in my 12'x14' HT, so any fan noise would be undesirable. I'm very glad that I don't need a fan, quiet or otherwise. YMMV. I have an X4400H in my LR which is inside a glass front/open back console with only 6" of clearance above and to the rear of the receiver. I have a rear exhaust fan on it because it needs one. Full disclosure: I bought both Denons from @jdsmoothie.
 
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I’ll have one of these in the cabinet soon. If I’m only using the internal amps for four Atmos speakers and two Zone2 speakers, it should stay relatively cool right? Cabinet has vents in bottom and open in the back and will be about four or so inches from the wall.
I used this only as a preamp and it gets pretty hot, had to install an Aircom for safe.

Even the NAD M27 got hot, only the Emotiva XPA-DR3 stayed cool, maybe because it´s class H
 

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This is a picture of my X8500 in total free air and no extra fans, so you can have a baseline for comparison. You can see my 13 speaker lineup in my sig and I'm not shy about volume settings. The Receiver never gets beyond warm to the touch (and it's to the rear) and I have never been concerned with the operating temp affecting longevity
Same here.....

That may well be, but heat can destroy electronics. So what is the big deal about investing in a $100 fan (AC Infinity) to protect a $4K hobby/investment?
Absolutely but electronics are meant to run hot, in this case we have the trust the designers at Denon. Lets face it, if there was a design issue's it would have been fixed on new units.
 

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Absolutely but electronics are meant to run hot, in this case we have the trust the designers at Denon. Lets face it, if there was a design issue's it would have been fixed on new units.
I find it hard to believe that electronics are meant to run hot. Why then do newer PC's run much cooler than in years previously? ----X---- (contradiction):)
 

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I find it hard to believe that electronics are meant to run hot. Why then do newer PC's run much cooler than in years previously? ----X---- (contradiction):)

More like electronics can tolerate high temperatures, but lifetime will generally be reduced. There are some exceptions, like the automotive electronics, which are intended to operate in extreme environments. Consumer electronics are less forgiving, however.
 

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I used this only as a preamp and it gets pretty hot, had to install an Aircom for safe.

Even the NAD M27 got hot, only the Emotiva XPA-DR3 stayed cool, maybe because it´s class H
Thanks for the heads up!

More like electronics can tolerate high temperatures, but lifetime will generally be reduced. There are some exceptions, like the automotive electronics, which are intended to operate in extreme environments. Consumer electronics are less forgiving, however.
Not to mention that overall build quality of today's electronics leaves much to be desired. I'm not spending a 100 bucks but, would something like this be quiet enough? Surely that'll keep the temps down a few degrees.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B012CL2V3I/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
 

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Thanks for the heads up!

Not to mention that overall build quality of today's electronics leaves much to be desired. I'm not spending a 100 bucks but, would something like this be quiet enough? Surely that'll keep the temps down a few degrees.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B012CL2V3I/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
I've had mine for 3 days now and haven't heard a peep out of it but I have it set at only 2 out of 5 as far as fan speed. I've noticed quite a difference when viewing blu-ray discs as opposed to streaming where the temperature will only reach around 90 or below when streaming but reached 100 when I watched Godzilla (2014) the other day which is on disc.
 

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I've had mine for 3 days now and haven't heard a peep out of it but I have it set at only 2 out of 5 as far as fan speed. I've noticed quite a difference when viewing blu-ray discs as opposed to streaming where the temperature will only reach around 90 or below when streaming but reached 100 when I watched Godzilla (2014) the other day which is on disc.
You will hear the fan come on, but that is dependent upon what temperature you have set the AC Infinity unit to be activated in Auto mode, where mine is set at 83F. A lot of sound coming out of the speakers will tend to mask out the fan noise, but if there is silence, you will hear it.
 

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I find it hard to believe that electronics are meant to run hot. Why then do newer PC's run much cooler than in years previously? ----X---- (contradiction):)
I worked, for many years, on sub-systems and components supplied to the military. Rest assured they are very concerned about reliability and under Mil-STD-883 required burn-in. Integrated circuits typically have two failure mechanisms which show a peak in failures at 25°/77°F at 1,000 hours and again at 10,000 hours with random failures in between.

Burn in was done to get the integrated circuits past that first hump. Instead of running them at 25°C you can increase the temperature by 10°C and cut the time -> 500 hours; go to 45 ° -> 250 hours; 55°C -> 125 hours; 65°C -> 62.5 hours; 75°C -> 31.25 hours etc. etc.

Heat does impact early failures, of course most devices do not fail during burn-in. It does show heat is a stressor and I will keep my AVR at a moderate temp with my T8. Others can do as they choose. It can be argued that early on the hot temps could cause a failure of an integrated circuit while it's still in warranty. Of course that also stresses capacitors and I would think most components...

And, no, i don't think hotter temps would make for a "warmer" sound;) Maybe it would raise the noise floor due to heat exciting electrons :confused:

Enjoy the hobby whatever you decide:D
 

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...

And, no, i don't think hotter temps would make for a "warmer" sound;) Maybe it would raise the noise floor due to heat exciting electrons :confused:

Enjoy the hobby whatever you decide:D
I think the feeling of difference in sound from startup cold to the warm operational condition in an amplifier comes from the valve amp times when the difference was noticeable.

I believe, modern solid state amps "sound" nearly the same when powered on cold and when reaching the warm state. At least it is impossible to tell difference for a normal human ear.

An indicator of the assured life time of modern electronics, at nominal operation conditions, could be the warranty time that manufactures give. So, if kept below "nominal" temperature conditions, the integrated circuit parts will live longer and the electrolytic capacitors will take longer to dry.
 

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I have taken a shot for your understanding.

The 8500 is the one to the left with the fan and blue LEDs on top. How much more open air can it get?
Sorry mate but that thing is getting damn hot and stops (with our without using the video card).


PS: See the NAS on the right shelf? It is protected with face masks (front and back) to protect from Maresia... :nerd:
Indeed your unit is clearly "open air" so as your unit is running hot, an external fan is required to cool the unit down.

I'm simply saying that those owners experiencing high heat from their Denon AVR (regardless of model) doesn't mean that ALL units of that same model are experiencing the same heat issue and therefore a general characterization of "model XXXX runs hot" is not warranted. And although not obviously true in your case, in many cases, when more ventilation is provided, the temp of the unit should drop.
 

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Indeed your unit is clearly "open air" so as your unit is running hot, an external fan is required to cool the unit down.

I'm simply saying that those owners experiencing high heat from their Denon AVR (regardless of model) doesn't mean that ALL units of that same model are experiencing the same heat issue and therefore a general characterization of "model XXXX runs hot" is not warranted. And although not obviously true in your case, in many cases, when more ventilation is provided, the temp of the unit should drop.

Mmhhh, why was my original post deleted?
 

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Mmhhh, why was my original post deleted?

I just received this:


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Original Post:
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/90-re...l#post59548476
Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ted99
You pays your money and you makes your choice. As an Electrical Engineer, I agree with the observation that heat is the enemy of electronic devices and one should do what one needs to do if it is excessive. My point, as @jdsmoothie has observed, is that my X8500 in totally free air doesn't need extra cooling. YMMV. I sit with my right ear 3' from the X8500 in my 12'x14' HT, so any fan noise would be undesirable. I'm very glad that I don't need a fan, quiet or otherwise. YMMV. I have an X4400H in my LR which is inside a glass front/open back console with only 6" of clearance above and to the rear of the receiver. I have a rear exhaust fan on it because it needs one. Full disclosure: I bought both Denons from @jdsmoothie .


I just had a look at your speaker set-up. Surely the Denon wont even realize you have speakers connected with those bookshelf speakers of yours.
Connect a bunch of big freestanding power consuming speakers and you will find out what we are talking about (we as those who are complaing about the overheating of the 8500 units).


Cheers
Caesar


Thank You,
AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Review"


What was wrong with my reply pointing out that these little bookshelf speakers don't bother the AVR 8500?
 
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