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Are bipole surrounds counterproductive in a Dolby atmos environment? I was planning to add Svs ultra surrounds (Bipoles) as side/surrounds but I’m reading some conflicting feedback across various boards. I will probably ask the folks over at the dedicated Dolby atmos thread as well.
The general consensus is that direct radiators are best use in an Atmos setup due to more solid object placement. While only you can decide which you prefer, I'd certainly steer you this direction.
 

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Are bipole surrounds counterproductive in a Dolby atmos environment?
Bipoles are essentially monopoles with a 360 degree radiation pattern. You still get direct sound from the speaker, but with a lot more reflections added. Helps make the speakers less localizable and distracting but doesn't have the sort of pinpoint imaging that monopoles typically have (IF you want that in the surround field).
 

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Bipoles are essentially monopoles with a 360 degree radiation pattern. You still get direct sound from the speaker, but with a lot more reflections added. Helps make the speakers less localizable and distracting but doesn't have the sort of pinpoint imaging that monopoles typically have (IF you want that in the surround field).
Seating distance also plays a role in deciding. I went from a bi pole to monopole speaker and I get a lot more "hotspotting" due to the close proximity (4').
 

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Thanks for the info! I subscribed and already rented "Tenet" 4k so I only have to wait for it to show up. It was a pretty painless site to setup. Looking forward to watching it.
I've been a 3D-BluRayRental.com subscriber for almost five years now. In addition to an excellent selection of UHD BRDs, it should also be noted that their BRDs are the full-featured retail versions not the downgraded rental discs you get from some distributors on Netflix (and in some cases, Netflix can only provide the DVD version due to contractual limitations). I find that the two services complement each other; although the former is a much smaller-scale operation, they are very responsive via email and accommodating to user concerns. You do not even need to maintain a monthly subscription but can rent discs ad hoc (for a slightly higher per capita fee in some cases).

I am also a longtime subscriber to Netflix disc-by-mail (as well as 4K streaming), but their BRD service has diminished over the years to the point where I might not miss it anymore if Reed Hastings finally succeeds in killing it off.
 

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I've been a 3D-BluRayRental.com subscriber for almost five years now. In addition to an excellent selection of UHD BRDs, it should also be noted that their BRDs are the full-featured retail versions not the downgraded rental discs you get from some distributors on Netflix (and in some cases, Netflix can only provide the DVD version due to contractual limitations). I find that the two services complement each other; although the former is a much smaller-scale operation, they are very responsive via email and accommodating to user concerns. You do not even need to maintain a monthly subscription but can rent discs ad hoc (for a slightly higher per capita fee in some cases).

I am also a longtime subscriber to Netflix disc-by-mail (as well as 4K streaming), but their BRD service has diminished over the years to the point where I might not miss it anymore if Reed Hastings finally succeeds in killing it off.
You've lasted a lot longer than I did with the Netflix DVD plan. I was with Netflix DVD/BD from about 2006 to around 2015 or so when their content starting to get a lot smaller. It was also around the time that their streaming service was starting with 4k content. I switched over and never looked back. I'm glad that their is another service that provides 4k discs! :)
 

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Hello guys, investigating a bit of the guts of the avc x8500h, I observe that the front monobloc amplifiers are the ones that are closest to the display screen, I understand that they will have less interference but I also observe that all the stages have the same capacitors and capacitors. What should have improved performance on the front channels? And I wonder seeing that they are loose blocks, could these pieces be improved only in the two front
 

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Are bipole surrounds counterproductive in a Dolby atmos environment? I was planning to add Svs ultra surrounds (Bipoles) as side/surrounds but I’m reading some conflicting feedback across various boards. I will probably ask the folks over at the dedicated Dolby atmos thread as well.
I've found them to be useful in the rear back positions. Most of the time it helps to spread the sound especially since there aren't that many true 7.1 channel BR discs. It helps also in more awkward positions.
You can see what I do in my setup in my signature, cheers.
 

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I've found them to be useful in the rear back positions. Most of the time it helps to spread the sound especially since there aren't that many true 7.1 channel BR discs. It helps also in more awkward positions.
You can see what I do in my setup in my signature, cheers.
Thats a really nice set up you have out there. Thanks for sharing. Great selection of HT equipment. So do you have the rear surrounds set up as bipoles or dipoles? I have been quite intrigued with these Omni directional speakers, due to their dispersive nature.

I currently have the Svs ultra bookshelves(monopoles) as side surrounds. The plan was to reassign them as rear surrounds once I get the bipoles.[/QUOTE]
 

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I am using SVS ultrasurrounds for side surrounds in Bipole. Really like how they disperse the sound between the rows.
 
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1. Refer to post #3 and do a "Factory Restore" and then update to the current firmware again to try and resolve the issue. Perhaps another UK member with a Front Wide configuration can comment ... or if not configured, as a test, set AMP ASSIGN = CUSTOM and assign another set of speakers as Front Wide and then confirm if audio is passing to them when using the Dolby Surround upmixer (DSU).
I did a factory reset. (took 5 mins), then checked for new firware, non found, then restored my settings from the USB, no change FW still active in DTS NX, and inactive in DSU.

Then I did a processor reset, after that it did 2 firmware updates, (took about an hour), restored settings from the USB, still no change.

I just wonderd if its an error in the update and I am the first and only person so far to use 9.1 with FW, DSU and the European model ?

I have had a support ticket out with Denon about this, but as I still have had nothing on an earlier one from before x-mas about ARC being unstable, I am not holding my breath on that front.
 

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Then I did a processor reset, after that it did 2 firmware updates, (took about an hour), restored settings from the USB, still no change.

I just wonderd if its an error in the update and I am the first and only person so far to use 9.1 with FW, DSU and the European model ?

That is interesting that before the reset, the receiver said that the F/W was up to date.

I have no experience with Speaker Virtualizer or Center Spread so I wonder if those settings have something to do with your issue.

After a reset I would try it with not restoring your settings. You could also try the 9.1.4 setting because the receiver does not know that you do not have top speakers hooked up.
 

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That is interesting that before the reset, the receiver said that the F/W was up to date.

I have no experience with Speaker Virtualizer or Center Spread so I wonder if those settings have something to do with your issue.

After a reset I would try it with not restoring your settings. You could also try the 9.1.4 setting because the receiver does not know that you do not have top speakers hooked up.
Good ideas I will try thanks (FW reset last as its most time consuming). It will not be centre spread as most of the tests I have done involve 5.1 input, where that option is not avaliable, but will check anyway.
 

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That is interesting that before the reset, the receiver said that the F/W was up to date.

I have no experience with Speaker Virtualizer or Center Spread so I wonder if those settings have something to do with your issue.

After a reset I would try it with not restoring your settings. You could also try the 9.1.4 setting because the receiver does not know that you do not have top speakers hooked up.
BINGO, got to the bottom of it. Its speaker virtualizer. Played a 5.1 source, DSU, with the virtualizer on, my normal setting (it does a great job, not as good as real height speakers I am sure). FW inactive.

Turned off virtualizer, and on come the FW speaker indicators. Turn back off virtualizer, off go the FW indiactors.

jdsmothie, you have enormous knowledge, surley this is a bug ?
 

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We have a magnificent av and I still think that xt32 is not up to the current eq .. it is decent but not Top as is the x8500! There is a huge difference to apply a curtain or leave it in full range to ear, it is very noticeable that something else is the best you can get out of your av. We need a powerful pc eq and the treble to be more natural at high volume
After reading the recent discussions/comments about the use of Audyssey Reference or Flat filter curves, I would like to contribute with this summary that I have learned on this valuable forum:

Reference:

The curve has a slight roll off at high frequencies.

This is intended to limit the high frequencies reverberation that occur in normal Not acoustically treated rooms. With this Reference curve, the high frequency squeaky sound, that may be annoying for the ears, is reduced.

Of course, this is dependent on the room characteristics and how good has been the Audyssey room compensation calculations for each particular case.

Sometimes, for some rooms and for some people, the Audyssey filters applied to medium to high frequencies result in a kind of distortion or added artifacts. That is why some prefer to Not apply the Audyssey filters above certain frequency and prefer the sound without ‘manipulation’ even if the room shape generates some reflections or reverberations. This is what can be done with the App. Some people says that it’s better (for them) to cut the Audyssey room compensation to 1 Khz, or even lower down to 300-500 Hz to EQ only for the Bass.

Flat:

When people have treated the room and the wall reflections and reverberation are low enough, there would not be any need to have the slight roll off at high frequencies. Then it can be better to have a Flat response.

The flat response enhances the treble frequencies in comparison with the Reference Curve. That’s why you may hear better some details, if you don’t mind the reverberation caused by your particular room.

The Denon Manual says: “Flat Selects the calibrated setting which is optimized for small rooms where your listening position is closer to the speakers”. If you are closer to the speakers, perhaps you notice less the reflections/reverberation, because the main sound coming from speakers is dominant.

Curtain at about 1KHz (Reference vs Flat)

I assume that there would not be any difference as the Reference will provide the frequency roll off at frequencies above the curtain (filters not active). The Flat would behave the same in this case.


Conclusion:

We have some settings to play with. You should choose the settings that make you hear best or like best. It depends largely on the room acoustic behaviour, the listener ear, and his preferences.
For sophisticated adjustments, there would be need of additional equipment to measure, calibrate and get response curves. Them with the aid of the App, a particular custom EQ curve can be set.

You can change the settings to look for what is best for you. But If you don’t find too many differences, Forget it, and Enjoy the Music, Films, Series, Concerts.

Sure, the sound can be enhanced more and more and more. But how much amount of improvement? I personally started with the App, Reference Curve, limited to 1 KHz. I have made some A-B comparisons with Reference/Flat, remove limit 1KHz, remove Audyssey. But as the changes for comparison are not A-B immediate in some cases I ended up leaving as it is and Enjoy the Music and Series/Films/Concerts as I proposed above.

Maybe it is my ear, that is not very sophisticated, or perhaps it is that life is short and there is much, much Content waiting to be listened.
 

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Reference versus Flat comes down to room accoustics and listener preference (or what one thinks one hears). Personally, I prefer Reference after A-B'ing the two.
Being curious, What type/amount of room treatment do you have? If any?
 

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Being curious, What type/amount of room treatment do you have? If any?
None. Just a living room converted into a home theater and for no other purpose. So following Floyd Toole with leaving stuff in the room (couch, rug, record racks, pictures & posters on walls, etc), I found it more than reasonable, not that it couldn't be improved.
 

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BINGO, got to the bottom of it. Its speaker virtualizer. Played a 5.1 source, DSU, with the virtualizer on, my normal setting (it does a great job, not as good as real height speakers I am sure). FW inactive.

Turned off virtualizer, and on come the FW speaker indicators. Turn back off virtualizer, off go the FW indiactors.

jdsmothie, you have enormous knowledge, surley this is a bug ?
Turns out this is by design. Front Wide are not active when the Speaker Virtualizer is enabled.
 

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I am using SVS ultrasurrounds for side surrounds in Bipole. Really like how they disperse the sound between the rows.
Same here! I love these surrounds since I do not have rear surrounds and these give me an extra effect of rear sound.

I'll be comparing the 8500 Denon as a processor only to the Marantz 8805 and giving my impressions in the coming weeks. Since I do not need the amps in the 8500, I want to see if the Marantz is better in the processing department. I know the SINAD is better on the Denon but that's not as important with EQ enabled and real listening. I'll keep whichever one sounds better to my ears. :)
 
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