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Help...Maybe someone with more techno-know-how can help me here...


I have a 95FD and my AVR is the 94TXH, connected via HDMI. What setting should I be using for audio? I mean do I have the DVD player decode and send to AVR or just send raw from DVD and let the AVR decode. If anyone can give me specific settings I would appreciate it. Thanks much.
 

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Not sure what you mean here, but there are some newer receivers like the vxv-94 with HDMI 1.3 that can decode TrueHD and DTS-HD MA. In fact, right now that is the only way to listen to DTS-HD MA, as no players currently support decoding it internally.

The Denon decodes DTS-HD MA internally, and the 94TXH may process it via 1.3 HDMI but it is not decoding it unless your blu-ray player can send the signal bitstream to it. (Per Pioneer Teck)
 

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Originally Posted by bdraw /forum/post/13369119


According to blu-raystats.com, the only titles with DD+ is "The Pat Metheny Group: The Way Up - Live" and "Planet Earth (US Version)." And if you think that's bad, there isn't one that has DTS-HD HR (DTS's equivalent to DD+)

Not true, Rambo First Blood has a DTS HD Track, I have it at home.
 

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Originally Posted by mchad /forum/post/13369228


Are you saying that the 95fd does not decode DTS MA internally? If so, that is a bit confusing. Last night, while testing, I was switching back and forth between the DTS MA soundtrack and the DD5.1 soundtrack (in french) on THe Day After Tomorrow, (using the analog 5.1 outs) and the difference was very substantial?

Thanks for posting the preliminary results of your experimentations. If I understand it correctly, you had the 5.1-channel ANALOG outputs of the Pioneer 95FD connected via high-quality audio cables to the ANALOG inputs of your sound processor: and you had the OPTICAL digital-stream output of the Pioneer connected to the OPTICAL input of your sound processor. Then, you played a BR disc containing DTS MA audio and switched the ANALOG outputs of your sound processor back and forth to compare the resulting sound reproduction through your speakers. With the exception of the DTS MA audio, that is what I did myself a few days ago. I used the BR version of the movie IMMORTAL BELOVED whch contains a Dolby True HD audio instead of DTS MA. I also noticed an improvement in the sound reproduced by my B&W and KEF speakers, but I was convinced by other posts here that what I was noticing as improvement in sound quality might have been due to the fact that the Pioneer 95 FD uses superior hardware to that used in my Sony AV Receiver. Your report now incourages me to experiment again before coming to any conclusions. I agree with other posts here that indicated the confusion created by the table and subnotes on page 44 of the manual. However, according to the results of your experiments, could it be possible that the Pioneer 95 FD is first converting the DTS MA encoding into 5.1-channel PCM and then doing a digital-to-analog conversion to send out the analog-audio signals via the 5.1-channel analog outputs? That would explain the "very substantial" you observed.


If Chris is reading these posts, would he, please, offer his comments about this very important issue? Thanks!
 

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Originally Posted by OzzieP /forum/post/13370277


The Dennon decodes DTS-HD MA internally, and the 94TXH may process it via 1.3 HDMI but it is not decoding it unless your blu-ray player can send the signal bitstream to it. (Per Pioneer Teck)

I am sorry, but I do not understand your post. You said that "The Dennon decodes DTS-HD MA internally", but you did not indicate what the Dennon is. Is it an AV receiver? Then you said that "The 04TXH processes it ia 1.3 HDMI but it is not decoding it unless your blue-ray player can send the signal bitstream to it". Will you, please, explain what you meant by DECODING and PROCESSING?
 

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MF70

Sorry for the confusion, any more confusing and I will qualify to write pioneer mauals.



The Denon3800BDIC Blu-ray player is what I was refering to(my bad). My understanding is this unit actually decodes everything internally.


When you send PCM out the analogs of a BR player to your reciever, the reciever lets it simply pass thru, it does get amplified but no processing takes place it goes right to the speakers after amplification. All of the decoding is done onboard you BR player assuming your BR-player does this not all BR players decode the HD audio tracks. For a receiver to actually decode the HD audio it needs to receive the bitstream via 1.3 HDMI from the BR Player and then something like a 04TXH can decode it.



mchad

Do you think what you are hearings is Multi-Channel PCM then?
 

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Originally Posted by madkaw /forum/post/13370429


Not true, Rambo First Blood has a DTS HD Track, I have it at home.

All of the earlier Lionsgates movies contained a DTS-HD HR track on them, but they have since switched over to 7.1 PCM.
 

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Originally Posted by OzzieP /forum/post/13371733


MF70

Sorry for the confusion, any more confusing and I will qualify to write pioneer mauals.



The Denon3800BDIC Blu-ray player is what I was refering to(my bad). My understanding is this unit actually decodes everything internally.


When you send PCM out the analogs of a BR player to your reciever, the reciever lets it simply pass thru, it does get amplified but no processing takes place it goes right to the speakers after amplification. All of the decoding is done onboard you BR player assuming your BR-player does this not all BR players decode the HD audio tracks. For a receiver to actually decode the HD audio it needs to receive the bitstream via 1.3 HDMI from the BR Player and then something like a 04TXH can decode it.


mchad

Do you think what you are hearings is Multi-Channel PCM then?

Thanks, OzzieP, for the clarification. Now you eally CAN write manuals for any high-end company!!!
 

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Originally Posted by MF70 /forum/post/13370587


However, according to the results of your experiments, could it be possible that the Pioneer 95 FD is first converting the DTS MA encoding into 5.1-channel PCM and then doing a digital-to-analog conversion to send out the analog-audio signals via the 5.1-channel analog outputs? That would explain the "very substantial" you observed.


If Chris is reading these posts, would he, please, offer his comments about this very important issue? Thanks!

It cannot do anything with the dts ma. It does not have the processor. dts ma is a in essence zipped format. Unless the player can unzip it it will not touch it. It is mandated that all disks contain a legacy track. Therefore there is a dts ma and a dts track on the disk. The player has no capability of doing anything with the ma track.

it is like someone sending you an e-mail with a zipped attatchment but you do not have winzip on your computer. If the software isn't there it cannot be opened.

What you are hearing is the lossy dts (higher bitrate than on a standard dvd) being converted to pcm out the analog.

I could be wrong on this part but i think the 95 has Burr Brown analog chips.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by madkaw /forum/post/13370429


Not true, Rambo First Blood has a DTS HD Track, I have it at home.

You are right, I was looking for DTS-HD HR, I didn't notice that it isn't expressed that way, but is instead simply DTS-HD.
 

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Originally Posted by OzzieP /forum/post/13370277


The Denon decodes DTS-HD MA internally, and the 94TXH may process it via 1.3 HDMI but it is not decoding it unless your blu-ray player can send the signal bitstream to it. (Per Pioneer Teck)

Of course you named the only $2000 exception. To be 100% correct I should've said there aren't any Blu-ray players that decode DTS-HD MA for less than $2k.
 

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My Pioneer contact just confirmed, that the 95 will NOT output decoded TrueHD or DTS-HD HR via analog outputs.


"Right now the analog outputs the legacy stream. We looking to add this feature via a firmware upgrade."


Lets hope they add it in the future.


Speaking of which, I'm just about done with my review of the BDP-94FD, are there any other concerns you guys think I should include or other question for Pioneer?
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by KungFuHamster /forum/post/13369495


Help...Maybe someone with more techno-know-how can help me here...


I have a 95FD and my AVR is the 94TXH, connected via HDMI. What setting should I be using for audio? I mean do I have the DVD player decode and send to AVR or just send raw from DVD and let the AVR decode. If anyone can give me specific settings I would appreciate it. Thanks much.

On the 95FD the audio output should be set to Auto, this will bitstream anything that needs decoded to the AVR.
 

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Originally Posted by bdraw /forum/post/13373518


My Pioneer contact just confirmed, that the 95 will NOT output decoded TrueHD or DTS-HD HR via analog outputs.


"Right now the analog outputs the legacy stream. We looking to add this feature via a firmware upgrade."


Lets hope they add it in the future.


Speaking of which, I'm just about done with my review of the BDP-94FD, are there any other concerns you guys think I should include or other question for Pioneer?

So the firmware will install winzip ;-) I guess I was optimistically listening. Could very will be. I honestly thought it sounded better. I can't believe though, that a $1000 blu-ray player has a better dolby digital decoder then a $2500 surround processor... But I could be wrong.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by HTMan34 /forum/post/13372864


All of the earlier Lionsgates movies contained a DTS-HD HR track on them, but they have since switched over to 7.1 PCM.

Not quite true — some earlier titles (Punisher, Saw, for instance) have a DTS-ES track. Some have DTS-HD HR (Condemned, Saw 2 & 3). Saw IV has DTS-HS MA. 3:10 to Yuma has PCM. So they are all over the map.
 

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bdraw
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Right now the analog outputs the legacy stream. We looking to add this feature via a firmware upgrade."

Ask them:

Why does the chart in the manual page 44 say otherwise?

Why is it when you ask pioneer support they say in unison that it does decode it and send it via the analogs as multi-channel PCM(5.1)?

What is a legacy track, and why does the manual not say that?

 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by madkaw /forum/post/13372980


It cannot do anything with the dts ma. It does not have the processor. dts ma is a in essence zipped format. Unless the player can unzip it it will not touch it. It is mandated that all disks contain a legacy track. Therefore there is a dts ma and a dts track on the disk. The player has no capability of doing anything with the ma track....

Not quite true here. What you've described is how Dolby True HD and standard Dolby Digital are coded on a disc, not DTS-MA. DTS-MA consists of a single track with standard DTS as a 'core' plus an extension. If a player can't internally code the DTS-MA track, it will simply extract the core and output that signal. There's no need for a separate standard DTS track. This is according to the really good explanation of the various audio codecs at HDD:

http://www.highdefdigest.com/news/sh...Explained/1064


Russell
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by bdraw /forum/post/13373518


My Pioneer contact just confirmed, that the 95 will NOT output decoded TrueHD or DTS-HD HR via analog outputs.


"Right now the analog outputs the legacy stream. We looking to add this feature via a firmware upgrade."


Lets hope they add it in the future.

If they really do it... this is GOOD NEWS !!!

Thanks...
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by madkaw /forum/post/13372980


It cannot do anything with the dts ma. It does not have the processor. dts ma is a in essence zipped format. Unless the player can unzip it it will not touch it. It is mandated that all disks contain a legacy track. Therefore there is a dts ma and a dts track on the disk. The player has no capability of doing anything with the ma track.

it is like someone sending you an e-mail with a zipped attatchment but you do not have winzip on your computer. If the software isn't there it cannot be opened.

What you are hearing is the lossy dts (higher bitrate than on a standard dvd) being converted to pcm out the analog.

I could be wrong on this part but i think the 95 has Burr Brown analog chips.

Can the Pioneer 95-FD send the DTS MA track via HDMI 1,3 to an AV receiver or to an external processor? If so, then I will consider buying a new AV receiver with that capability. Thanks!
 

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Originally Posted by MF70 /forum/post/13379292


Can the Pioneer 95-FD send the DTS MA track via HDMI 1,3 to an AV receiver or to an external processor? If so, then I will consider buying a new AV receiver with that capability. Thanks!

Yes it can and it does. I have it hooked up to a Pioneer Elite VSX-92TXH and it does it.
 
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