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Cima Neve Horizontal Banding Question

I was hoping to get some opinions on my 16:9 135" Cima Neve screen that shows horizontal banding pattern (like a yellow jacket pattern of white/dark bands) during bright white scenes in the center of the screen. I got it last spring, noticed some banding with my old projector and partially attributed to the BenQ W1070 projector. Now with a JVC RS1000 sitting at 11' feet away it seems more obvious and I see it on every bright white scene. Tried to take a picture with white background attached, but my iphone does not really capture it well, seems more obvious on white sky scenes with panning. No issues with sparkles. If i pivot the projector the bands do not move and was seen on old projector as well so I'm convinced it's the screen.

1. Is this related to the gain of the screen or something else?
2. I ordered this from a local dealer, so I'll contact them next but wondered if others had any luck exchanging screens before (mine is now 6 months old) if they seem to have a defect.

Thanks for any thoughts. Overall happy with the screen, but for the money would like it to have no issues.
That doesn't sound right. Contact your dealer ASAP.
 

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The manual says to use 2" screws for the EZ-Mount bars, and 2-3/8" screws for the magnets, but they only sent me 1-1/2" screws for the EZ-Mount bars, and 1-3/4" screws for the magnets. Do I use the ones they sent me or do I go get new ones?
 

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The manual says to use 2" screws for the EZ-Mount bars, and 2-3/8" screws for the magnets, but they only sent me 1-1/2" screws for the EZ-Mount bars, and 1-3/4" screws for the magnets. Do I use the ones they sent me or do I go get new ones?
Source your own screws. Easy enough.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

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How does studiotek 130 do in a room with some scattered light from the projector? I currently have a JVC X35 and want to upgrade to a JVC NX5 or NX7. I have a 110” g3 Firehawk screen in an unfinished basement. Our remodel will have some dark surfaces but as it’s more a traditional family room, may have a lighter colored ceiling, though with non reflective paint. Other surfaces should be on the darker side.
So my question is how well the studiotek 130 would do in that environment. I’m very accustomed to the deep blacks of my x35 and firehawk g3 and my eye is totally drawn to that every time I compare with other screen samples (though I haven’t sampled the 130 yet) Would proper calibration of my projector give me blacks as good as I’m getting now with my firehawk screen? Or I’m just giving up a certain degree of black level with ST130?
 

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How does studiotek 130 do in a room with some scattered light from the projector? I currently have a JVC X35 and want to upgrade to a JVC NX5 or NX7. I have a 110” g3 Firehawk screen in an unfinished basement. Our remodel will have some dark surfaces but as it’s more a traditional family room, may have a lighter colored ceiling, though with non reflective paint. Other surfaces should be on the darker side.
So my question is how well the studiotek 130 would do in that environment. I’m very accustomed to the deep blacks of my x35 and firehawk g3 and my eye is totally drawn to that every time I compare with other screen samples (though I haven’t sampled the 130 yet) Would proper calibration of my projector give me blacks as good as I’m getting now with my firehawk screen? Or I’m just giving up a certain degree of black level with ST130?
Below are pictures I took changing screens.
Mine is the newest G4 material not the G3 ...............
The G4 is for improving 4K & HDR content.
















Terry
 

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The manual says to use 2" screws for the EZ-Mount bars, and 2-3/8" screws for the magnets, but they only sent me 1-1/2" screws for the EZ-Mount bars, and 1-3/4" screws for the magnets. Do I use the ones they sent me or do I go get new ones?
I went to the hardware store and got longer screws. All set! Thanks
 

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Below are pictures I took changing screens.
Mine is the newest G4 material not the G3 ...............
The G4 is for improving 4K & HDR content.

Terry
Terry, so do you feel your blacks are just as good moving from firehawk to studiotek 130? Or you’re accepting a slight loss of black level for better HDR brightness? And what projector are you using?
 

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Terry, so do you feel your blacks are just as good moving from firehawk to studiotek 130?
Or you’re accepting a slight loss of black level for better HDR brightness? And what projector are you using?
Here is the rest of the story.

1st off I don't have the ST130 G3 .............
I have the newest ST 130 G4.
Anyway, I am on hold at the preset time as I want to get my G4 and my JVC RS4500 laser projector Custom Calibrated for it.
That's going to happen maybe this month and if not certainly next month.
I don't think it would be fair for me to say anything on picture content until Chad B comes and does the Custom Calibrating.
From the Full article that Kris Deering did in Sound & Vision he didn't mention anything at all negative so my gut feeling is the G4 does not compromise on the Black-Level.
The reason I had the Stewart Firehawk was because back then I had several Runco projectors and to help with Black-Levels it was recommended to use the Firehawk.
That's the exact opposite recommendation for the current JVC RS4500 Laser Projector I have.

There are several members on AVS that have the new G4 material and I haven't seen even one mention loosing any Black-Level-Performance.

But the new G4 was designed for increasing overall performance of the newer formats 4K & HDR movies.

See my signature below for a complete list of my Components/Gear where it says to "Double Click" to view Full-Size.

Terry
 

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How does studiotek 130 do in a room with some scattered light from the projector? I currently have a JVC X35 and want to upgrade to a JVC NX5 or NX7. I have a 110” g3 Firehawk screen in an unfinished basement. Our remodel will have some dark surfaces but as it’s more a traditional family room, may have a lighter colored ceiling, though with non reflective paint. Other surfaces should be on the darker side.
So my question is how well the studiotek 130 would do in that environment. I’m very accustomed to the deep blacks of my x35 and firehawk g3 and my eye is totally drawn to that every time I compare with other screen samples (though I haven’t sampled the 130 yet) Would proper calibration of my projector give me blacks as good as I’m getting now with my firehawk screen? Or I’m just giving up a certain degree of black level with ST130?
I think for light scatter you should care about the base gain of the material. Let's ignore the optical coating for a second. If the base gain is say .7, you'd reflect .7x the projector's direct light back into the room. Then .7*.7 "bad" light would be coming off the screen from reflection off of white surfaces in the room (say the room is all white for this example). So you've attenuated the bad effect of the room by (.7 x .7) / (.7) = .7 (the denominator representing measuring relative to the direct image. And we're ignoring the infinite stack of further bounces which will further favor the lower gain.)

So I don't see how a base gain 1 screen like the ST130 could keep up with a screen like the Firehawk, unless your light colored surfaces are minimal.
 

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I think for light scatter you should care about the base gain of the material. Let's ignore the optical coating for a second. If the base gain is say .7, you'd reflect .7x the projector's direct light back into the room. Then .7*.7 "bad" light would be coming off the screen from reflection off of white surfaces in the room (say the room is all white for this example). So you've attenuated the bad effect of the room by (.7 x .7) / (.7) = .7 (the denominator representing measuring relative to the direct image. And we're ignoring the infinite stack of further bounces which will further favor the lower gain.)

So I don't see how a base gain 1 screen like the ST130 could keep up with a screen like the Firehawk, unless your light colored surfaces are minimal.
That's an interesting way to look at it.

Maybe a follow up question for the community is this - in a very good, but not perfect, room, where reflected light is minimized - how will black levels compare between the Firehawk and Studiotek 130? Once the image is calibrated to the screen, will black levels be comparable? Or will the Firehawk always be better? Do you start to lose some detail in darker scenes with the Firehawk compared to the studiotek?
 

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That's an interesting way to look at it.

Maybe a follow up question for the community is this - in a very good, but not perfect, room, where reflected light is minimized - how will black levels compare between the Firehawk and Studiotek 130? Once the image is calibrated to the screen, will black levels be comparable? Or will the Firehawk always be better? Do you start to lose some detail in darker scenes with the Firehawk compared to the studiotek?
Black levels can look just as good on the ST130. I did in fact go from a Firehawk to a ST130 G3 screen 5+ years ago -

" I have a dedicated theater, but it was setup more like a media room. My SIM Lumis throws an outstanding picture. Could I make it look even better? I owe a lot of this to Rich Harkness. I read his theater build thread and realized I'd become complacent regarding my theater. Rich explained how and why he had picked the Stewart StudioTek 130 G3 screen over the Firehawk G3 screen. I was using a Firehawk screen myself. So I got a sample of StudioTek 130 and devised a screen sample holder that would allow me to put the sample in front of my Firehawk. The blacks / contrast on the StudioTek looked terrible compared to my Firehawk. I grabbed a big " police " type flashlight ( lots of D cells - bright ) and stood at the screen. I did the " flashlight test ". Lots of things in the room reflected back onto the screen. First I decided to cover the beige carpet with black carpet rugs from Walmart. That worked well, but the ST 130 still didn't look as good as the FH. Then I had a giant rug made that covered the entire front 2/3's of the theater. Better. Next, I re-painted the ceiling and the side walls darker grey. Now the ST was starting to look as good or better overall than the FH. I then painted the back walls much darker, put a black MDF board in front of the popcorn machines glass case, hung black curtains and Protostar material on part of the back wall, and hung another red velvet curtain over a white closet door. Now the blacks on space movies etc. looked as good on the StudioTek 130 sample as they did on the Firehawk. I then switched screens.

I first replaced my 2.35:1 Firehawk with a 2.35:1 StudioTek, and I also replaced my 16:9 High Contrast Cinema Vision screen with a 16:9 Neve 1.1. The Lumis looks totally awesome on these screens ! Making my room décor and walls dark and switching to white screens was one of the best things I've done to improve my picture in my theater.

Update – the back walls and front soffit got painted with Rosco Black Velour paint – even less room reflections now. "
See my theater build thread for photos.
 

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Black levels can look just as good on the ST130. I did in fact go from a Firehawk to a ST130 G3 screen 5+ years ago -
That's incredibly helpful! Thank you very much for the time you took to respond. So sounds like good black levels on a white screen is primarily about the viewing environment.

I think I'll just need to build it out as dark and light absorbing as my wife will allow and then do a proper screen material comparison. Right now, with an unfinished basement, probably getting a lot more reflections that I won't get once the basement is finished. I'm still not sure my wife will go for as many dark surfaces as you have, but I'll try. :) However, sounds like the Firehawk is still a great choice if I'll be left with some lighter surfaces/can't tame all the reflections.

Doesn't look like you utilize an AT screen either. Just haven't found one you like? Mike sent me some samples several months ago, but again, in my less than ideal conditions, hard for me to get a good read on them. I haven't found anything that is close enough to what I'm looking for visually.
 

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Black levels can look just as good on the ST130. I did in fact go from a Firehawk to a ST130 G3 screen 5+ years ago -
To the degree you're interested, I'd love your feedback, or others who are reading this, on the options depicted in the attached PDF.

For reference, I sit 11-12' away from the screen. Again, my current screen is a 110" Firehawk in a 3 3/8" frame. My ceiling height is 90" or so, after accounting for drywall ceiling and flooring. Wife wants cabinetry underneath the screen, but might be willing to forego that, but it's drawn as 18" high, which means the center speaker would sit right above it and have a "wall" that it reflects off of.

The PDF shows various scenarios with my 110" screen, a 2:1 screen and a 120" screen, in both standard and thin bezel configurations, and with the planned in-wall speakers (part of a 7.2.4 atmos configuration) as well as an option of replacing the center in-wall with the standard KEF R series center channel, which is less than 7' tall and it could be placed in front of the screen, allowing the screen to sit a little lower (the frame could overlap the vertical space of the speaker).

As noted on the drawings, I could also probably raise the cabinetry/shelving to the bottom of the screen and then hide the center channel in there (or talk the wife out of it altogether).

Obviously, an AT screen would solve these issues, but just haven’t found one that I can live with yet. Maybe once my basement is finished I can then sample the AT materials I have and will be more impressed.

I currently have the JVC X35 but plan on upgrading to the NX5 or NX7 (BTW, Craig, any specials on those right now?)

Also, I primarily watch movies, but that includes a good mix of classic Hollywood 4:3 films.
 

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To the degree you're interested, I'd love your feedback, or others who are reading this, on the options depicted in the attached PDF.

For reference, I sit 11-12' away from the screen. Again, my current screen is a 110" Firehawk in a 3 3/8" frame. My ceiling height is 90" or so, after accounting for drywall ceiling and flooring. Wife wants cabinetry underneath the screen, but might be willing to forego that, but it's drawn as 18" high, which means the center speaker would sit right above it and have a "wall" that it reflects off of.

The PDF shows various scenarios with my 110" screen, a 2:1 screen and a 120" screen, in both standard and thin bezel configurations, and with the planned in-wall speakers (part of a 7.2.4 atmos configuration) as well as an option of replacing the center in-wall with the standard KEF R series center channel, which is less than 7' tall and it could be placed in front of the screen, allowing the screen to sit a little lower (the frame could overlap the vertical space of the speaker).

As noted on the drawings, I could also probably raise the cabinetry/shelving to the bottom of the screen and then hide the center channel in there (or talk the wife out of it altogether).

Obviously, an AT screen would solve these issues, but just haven’t found one that I can live with yet. Maybe once my basement is finished I can then sample the AT materials I have and will be more impressed.

I currently have the JVC X35 but plan on upgrading to the NX5 or NX7 (BTW, Craig, any specials on those right now?)

Also, I primarily watch movies, but that includes a good mix of classic Hollywood 4:3 films.
So what is your proposed seating distance ? I'd try and not put cabinets up front - it will be a distraction. And I like a regular width frame myself. Also, I'd try to keep the center channel below the the bottom frame member. You might want to put " Protostar " black velvet material on the top of the speaker so it doesn't reflect back on the screen.
 

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So what is your proposed seating distance ? I'd try and not put cabinets up front - it will be a distraction. And I like a regular width frame myself. Also, I'd try to keep the center channel below the the bottom frame member. You might want to put " Protostar " black velvet material on the top of the speaker so it doesn't reflect back on the screen.
Just over 11'. The only reason to place the center channel in front of the frame, with some overlap, is to keep the center channel from being too low and the screen from being too high in my height constrained space, but I agree, it's not ideal.

I'm also thinking that maybe a 110" screen will be better for HDR content, vs a 120" screen, though I'd really like the 120" size.
 

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Just over 11'. The only reason to place the center channel in front of the frame, with some overlap, is to keep the center channel from being too low and the screen from being too high in my height constrained space, but I agree, it's not ideal.

I'm also thinking that maybe a 110" screen will be better for HDR content, vs a 120" screen, though I'd really like the 120" size.
Get the projector first, project different sizes on the wall, and use some painters tape to lay out different sizes if you have to !
 

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BTW, what is the flashlight test you originally mentioned?
Basically you stand in the pitch dark with your back to your screen, and shine a bright flashlight around your theater. See what reflects light back that lights up your screen. Those things will wash out your picture. Make those items darker / less reflective / black !
 
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