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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hey all,


Check out this link about the future of HBO, these companies don't want ReplayTV and TIVO because they want to offer the same kind of services but charge money for it. Rather than work with someone already doing this they want to create their own system so they can charge you even more money for the features that should be provided for free if they have this ability.

http://www.hboondemand.com/


I really am starting to hate these companies, no matter what great programming they may provide. I can't believe that people can order Band of Brothers through this system when they aren't even releasing it on DVD until November. WTF!!!


TimT
 

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Actually my cable company already offers something like this (Insight Digital). I've never used it, but supposedly I can start any pay per view film any time I want. Rewind, etc.


I assume they've got so many hard drives available, or one per film. . .
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Here is my problem with it. HBO wants you to pay 4 dollars a month for a special service on top of HBO and Digital Cable. But if two people who own ReplayTV's and also subscribe to HBO try to swap a show that say, one of them missed recording, then thats illegal and the company that makes the device that makes that possible should be put out of business. If HBO provided said service for free with your subscription, then I wouldn't have a problem with it, but since it's a clear attempt to get more money for the simple ability to timeshift, when you can do the same thing with a Replay is very obnoxious. Does this mean that I'm gonna have to pay an extra 4 dollars for each channel that I want this ability with. Do the math, thats gonna add up to a pretty penny. And what about the fact that HBO Owns Cinemax, am I gonna have to pay a fee for Cinemax if I already pay for the same service with HBO? Not to mention that they control what you can and cannot timeshift / download.


TimT


My point is if HBO Can make that service, then Replay should be able to provide the same type of service without the threat of being sued every 6 months.
 

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Sorry, but I can offer MY content any way I want. That doesn't change if someone else is violating the law. A book publisher can make their books available in print, on the web, and in audio format. It's still illegal for you to distribute the content contrary the the law.


I'm not siding with HBO. Just showing that your "they do it with their own content so anyone can do it with their content" logic is flawwed.
 

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RandyL712 I think you are missing the point of the argument. It's not about sharing with someone who didn't pay.


So forget about sharing outside the home network for this one. It's about timeshifting. If HBO is going to charge extra for on-demand timeshifting and next thing you know attempt to inhibit us doing it ourselves for only the normal monthly charge? Sound impossible?


I hope so, but don't get too comfy.
 

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I would not put it beyond the entertainment industry to do something like that, but if you look at the site, it says that you can still tape shows, but the need to do so will be a lot less given the ability to get access on-demand.


Another way to look at this is to ask if you would be willing to pay someone $/month (or whatever) to anticipate what you will want to see from HBO and tape it for you. Even with 2 replays, I still end up with a few things that I either forgot to set for recording, or the channel didn't get set right, or something.


Personnally, I've always thought that the future of the PVR is to become a media server, that provides both the ability to time-shift and the ability to access on-demand programming. The 4xxx series is a step closer to that, but there's still a lot of room for adding additional functions like on-demand service.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
I agree that the PVR will probably become a centralized home media server, or the PC will, or some hybridized version thereof. My point is that HBO is joining up with other media companys to use the Law to determine that future simply because they are paranoid about the minority of people who pirate shows, such as the ones that are broadcast on HBO.


With the exception of a small few in hollywood and the media industry nobody innovates anymore, they stifle innovation in the name of protecting their copyrights and intellectual property.


Heres a little history lesson.


When TV came out, the movie industry was in an uproar, they were worried that because people could watch movies in their home that nobody would go to the theatre any more. Did the movie studios in that day Sue the TV studios to keep them from making TV's, or sue them into only showing programs during the week to force people to go to the movies during the weekend? No. They created cinemascope and a few other technologys to draw people back into the theatres. While I'm pretty certain that people wouldn't have stopped going to the theatres, I'ts actually nice that the movie industry took up the challenge and innovated.


Flash Forward to the 70's, Video Tape arrives on the scene after it's been used only in Broadcast of television programs. Home VCR's are seen by the Movie Industry again as the END OF THE WORLD!!! They even tried to get a Ban on them saying that, my god people will copy movies (which was possible before the advent of the most annoying technology in the world, Macrovision) And still people copied movies. There are always ways around copy protection (any copy protection). Did we all stop going to the movies, No we didn't, in fact, in the 70's and 80's, the movie studios continued making money, certain movies started to make hundreds of millions of dollars. And what happened? The movie industry started making even more money off of Video Tape, because of Rentals. In fact it's become a billion dollar industry, thats right billion, and I'm probably being easy on the amount of money they make.


Then comes laserdisc, which wasn't really that big a deal to alot of people because they couldn't record on them. So alot of people never ended up buying them. Still, alot of them were sold over the years and a pretty big rental industry for that market grew up as well, but a new thing cropped up with LD's, the special edition. As it turned out people were not only interested in the movie itself, but trivia, deleted scenes, and especially audio commentary by the director, or actors, etc.


Then in the middle of the 90's, technology had come far enough that an entire 2 hour movie could be fit onto one CD sized disc, with room to spare and room to grow with future expansion of the standard. Now this is my favorite part, Instead of everybody getting behind one standard, focusing on the security of that standard, making sure that all the players, etc worked together. What do some of the largest studios in hollywood do? They decide they don't like the idea of the new standard and they set out to develop their own version of it. Some of you probably know it already, but the two standards were called, DVD and DIVX.


DIVX was the brainchild of movie studios and no kidding here, LAWYERS!!!. They made a competing standard that was inferior in almost every way to DVD, it didn't have the ability for full motion menus, none of the first generation DIVX movies had any of the special features that the first Gen DVD's had. But you know why the studios loved it? Well, built into each and every DIVX player was a modem, and what you did was, you "bought" a movie, and I use the term bought loosely, but you only paid about 4 to 6 dollars for it. This was basically renting it, because a few days after watching it for the first time, you couldn't watch it any more. If you wanted to watch it again you had to, thats right, PAY, AGAIN!! What if you wanted to buy a movie, and own it. Well guess again, you couldn't actually own a DIVX, even the so called GOLD edition DIVX titles, were really only loaned to you, and the studios could revoke that at any time. Now this is not new, alot of legalese on most of the things you buy say something along the same line, I mean just cause you own a copy of star wars doesn't mean you can sell the rights to it or anything. But here is the real kicker, the studios had this great idea that, take disney for example, Disney releases Beauty and the Beast on DIVX. Joe Shmoe buys Beauty and the Beast on DIVX because his daughter loves it and constantly wants to watch it with her friends. Joe buys the Gold version of the DIVX title, the one he can watch over and over without paying, and he pays 24.99 or somewhere about there. Now it's a year later, and good old Disney Corp. decides as they do often, to re-release a movie. This time it's, you guessed it, Beauty and the Beast. Well, thanks to the lovely DIVX system and the fact that once a week or more your DIVX player checks in with Big Brother and makes sure you can watch what the studios say you can watch, Disney flips a switch and turns off all the copies of Beauty and the Beast that are out there (This is no joke, Disney planned on doing this, good luck finding proof of it though now). Now comes the big week where Beauty and the Beast is in the movie theatre, and Joe Shmoe is being pestered by his little girl to go see it, but since he owns it he tells her we'll watch it tonight. Joe pops in his DIVX disc and whoops, the DIVX player tells him this title is locked out. Now Joe Shmoe ends up taking his daughter and maybe 3 or 4 of her little friends out to go see Beauty and the Beast, and that 24.99 movie just ended up costing him another 30 - 40 dollars, give or take.


These are the same people who are trying to keep you from digitally doing anything with any media at all in the privacy of your own home. They want to keep you from ripping music to your MP3 player. They want to keep you from digitally recording shows. They try to strong arm companies into spying on you so they can see what you little theives are stealing from them. Bad consumber, Bad , Bad.


They have already forced a new connection Format for HDTV, that incorporates encryption, so that if they want, they can make it so that your PVR can't record a certain show. Now I can understand doing that on DVD's, so that you can't just pop a DVD in and record it and then send it to your friend, but they really just want you to just sit in front of the TV and be good little sheep.


And when they do deem you worthy of new technology such as "HBO on demand", they take 5 years to roll it out, and then they charge you extra for it.


They claim that Replay is evil because you can skip commercials. A few years ago the broadcasting companies started putting little logos in the corner, just to let you know what channel you were watching it said, no problem. Then as the technology became possible, they started putting small little animations on them to show what channel you were watching. Even though every 10 minutes there were about 3 minutes of commercials telling you what channel you were watching. Now it's not just a little logo, it's a full fledge multimedia advertisement, that runs somtimes 3 to 5 seconds into the beginning of the show you are watching, and which might be advertising the show you are watching!!! and while it used to be just slightly annoying now it's starting to really be almost like commercials after the commercials. DVRS have only been around for the past couple of years, trutfully. So how do they explain that these things have been getting worse for the past 3.


Well it's time for bed, but for all of you people out there who think that the studios are right because giving a copy of a movie to a friend is bad. Try and think how many times youve done that in your life, 5 - 10 - 15 maybe. Thats not really alot, and how many times did you make money on it. Probably none, except the friend maybe paying for the video tape, which by the way a small donation to the MPAA is dropped off so that they can get back some of the money you just stole from them. But they won't advertise that too much. Same thing goes for the Audio CD-R's that most set top CD Recorders need to work, portions supposedly go to the artists. How much you wanna bet NONE of that money makes it to artists and instead just goes to the studios.


I could go on all night.


But it's time for bed. Night all.
 

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Hey Tringle, what you lack in number of posts you sure make up in size and quality of the posts;) ;) ;)

Unlike KenL.......:D :D :D :D :D
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by BaysideBas
Hey Tringle, what you lack in number of posts you sure make up in size and quality of the posts...

...Unlike KenL.......:D :D :D :D :D
Or number of :D used by BaysideBas?


But KenL has to agree here.


t_tringle is not only right on the money but quite articulate as well! :cool::cool:
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by KenL
Or number of :D used by BaysideBas?
How else is KenL going to know how hard to laugh?:p
 

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But a lot of my old Criterion Laserdiscs are showing LaserRot. :(
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by BaysideBas
How else is KenL going to know how hard to laugh?:p
Perhaps by IF (or how) funny it is? :D


(Now KenL relies on the excessive emoticons as a small cue just because a few...often taking a single post out of context... get so confused by the relentless annoying inappropriate wisecracking... well you know: the Ankle Biting?) ;)
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by toots
But a lot of my old Criterion Laserdiscs are showing LaserRot. :(
So LaserRot isn't a myth... hummm.. I heard about it years ago but didn't think that it was real..


bummer...
 

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Well, it was a bit of a nasty joke.


I don't know about "LaserRot Classic," but for a while, 3M was using some sort of glue that tended to rot discs. Unfortunately, at the time, 3M was the high-end presser of choice, so the really expensive discs from Criterion tended to be affected the most. In other words, my cheap LDs are in fine shape, but the "baked to a golden brown in hardwood ovens with tender loving care" discs are kind of rocky.


I've also got one CD where somehow, there's an air encroachment around the hub, that's pretty much obliterated the first couple of tracks on the disc. The discoloration of the aluminum is unmistakable. I'm assuming this is just a sealing/oxidation problem.
 

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Well same here on some CD's. I had two early (and expensive) import CD's that developed Rot oxidation (from the outer edge in) That was one time when "D/L a clean rip" was a lifesaver.


On the important one, I just got the one bad track and recreated the whole work in CoolEdit Pro.
 

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I want to defend DIVX. Compared to renting a movie at Blockbuster, it's a great alternative. Compared to Netflix, it's not as viable but useable nonetheless.


I was one of the first to buy a DIVX player, a ProScan (and later a Panasonic 5 disc) and loved the service. I bought about 20 movies ($2 or $3 each, so let's say $60 max) and whenever I wanted to, I watched them! No need to go to the store, no need to return anything.


The only downside came when rumors began that studios might release certain titles to DIVX only and not release the same titles to regular "Open DVD". That's a bad thing, I can agree. But I liked DIVX. I was always ticked off that they didn't have many widescreen titles, but hey, it was darn convenient.
 

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DIVX was created by Circuit City and its lawyers, not the film studios. Some people (Steven Spielberg in particular) felt that the added security DIVIX offered was a good thing. He expected to offer his titles as DIVIX Gold discs (as well as the PPV ones).


As for HBO on Demand, it is not a PVR, it is a Pay-Per-View service with the added ability to do show control. They are charging you $4 to be able to get any show they have or will play during the month any time you want it.


While it has never been fair use to make copies for others of shows that one has recorded, the studios would not care if what you were talking about was really the only sharing that was done. Looking at PlanetReplay, one can see that a substantial number of the programs their are recorded PPV programs, that one party is clearly not paying to see. This is what concerns the studios most.


/carmi
 

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I enjoy my ReplayTV, my Tivo units, and my VCRs, but I do believe that TV will change over the next ten years into exactly what HBO on Demand is doing.


Imagine your cable or sat provider giving you search capabilities or menu selections where you can access a database of any movie ever made, any series ever made, any sports event ever made, and push your chosen show to you with full pause, FF, and Rewind capabilities.


This is convenience and convenience is king.


When this happens, and it certainly will, my Tivos and Replay will find a home on a shelf somewhere, right along with my VCRs.
 

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Except that when my cable company gives it to me:


it'll have advertising on every page of the interface, including every time it changes channels. Half of it will be advertising telling me how effective the advertising is, and how I can buy some.


it'll have IMPORTANT MESSAGES sent to me daily about shows I'm not interested in on channels I may not even get (and they're in a position to know!), mixed into the same message stream that very occasionally tells me about new channels being added or new firmware versions


it'll be SLOW. oh so very slow. You'll wish they had a spinning watch icon to display during the time it takes to get the "please wait" box on screen. You'll be given a two-hour window in which you can expect your remote button press to be noticed.
 
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