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Discussion Starter #1
I was recently browsing some sets at the local Best buy and was blown away by a few of the sets which made film content look like shot on video or "soap opera" like. After some research I found that several manufacturers including Sony feature this technology using different names to describe it. Reading through the posts it appears the top rated Samsung, the LED based 81 series, has an inferior implementation of the shot on video effect, at least compared to it's lesser models such as the 650.

The set I have my eyes on is the upcoming XBR8 however since it is LED based I am afraid the motionflow feature might get watered down. Anyone have any news of how the XBR8 will implement this feature in the XBR8 sets?
 

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The Cinemotion options cause this problem. I have no idea why anyone would use Cinemotion. Just turn it off and the soap opera effect is gone. It has nothing to do with the Motion Enhancer.
 

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Last year's Samsung 69/71 series had the most extreme "soap" look. They were the first of the 120hz generation and some say Samsung went overboard with the soap look & and its accompanying artifacts (hey you can turn it down you know). Samsung played it safe when the 650 came out because i can't get much the same look on that set (though it is there). But if you like the extreme soap look 69/71 is what you want. If the artifacts are too much just turn AMP to low.
 

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I think you might be a little confused about what's going on with the TVs you mentioned. The "Soap Opera Effect" is caused by a certain implementation of 120hz on an LCD display. Seeing as the old 81 series from Samsung wasn't 120hz it didn't have this effect. It does however utilize backlight scanning or "LED Motion Plus" which only dims the picture, but considerably improves the sets motion resolution. Also, the 650 and 81 series shouldn't be compared. They are within two completely different model lineups and have different features. The replacement for the 81 series is out now, and is called the 950 series and it does feature both 120hz and LED Motion Plus. So if you enable the 120hz on it you will get some of that "Soap Opera Effect."


The XBR 8 will use a similar feature set to the Samsung 950 series. It will employ 120hz and backlight scanning. Sony is calling this Motion Flow Pro, and it is only offered on the XBR 8...
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by animeXL /forum/post/14692135


I think you might be a little confused about what's going on with the TVs you mentioned. The "Soap Opera Effect" is caused by a certain implementation of 120hz on an LCD display. .

I think you may be confused.

120Hz is not the cause of the Soap opera effect,

Interpolation done by motionflow or AMP (auto motion plus) motion enhansers is the source of this effect.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by chadmak09 /forum/post/14692288


I think you may be confused.

120Hz is not the cause of the Soap opera effect,

Interpolation done by motionflow or AMP (auto motion plus) motion enhansers is the source of this effect.

That's what I meant when I said 'certain implementations,' I was only trying to give a simple answer, sorry for the confusion
 

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Discussion Starter #7
I just discovered that the new WINDVD 9 software DVD players includes a feature on the plus versions to produce the same effect. It's called ALL2HD. I downloaded a trial copy and it DOES work!!! You might have a hard time getting WINDVD itself to work though.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by chadmak09 /forum/post/14692288


I think you may be confused.

120Hz is not the cause of the Soap opera effect,

Interpolation done by motionflow or AMP (auto motion plus) motion enhansers is the source of this effect.

Indeed, many people seem to be confused on this; assuming 120hz is the source of artifacting and the SOE (soap opera effect) rather than the anti-judder implementation, though it's understandable, seeing as how all the major brands rather ambiguously market them as the same feature, or at least, don't make much effort to differentiate between the two (Sony, MotionFlow 120hz; Samsung, Auto-Motion Plus 120hz; Mitsubishi, Smoothmotion 120hz, etc.).
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by zulu934 /forum/post/14231753


I was recently browsing some sets at the local Best buy and was blown away by a few of the sets which made film content look like shot on video or "soap opera" like.

Hi Guys,


Just trying to educate myself before choosing a new set, but wouldn't one prefer video content to look like film.

Maybe I'm old school, but I'm finding my biggest deterrent with LCD over Plasma is that is that all the LCD screens look like over sized computer monitors, a big negative when watching movies over even broadcasts for that matter.
 

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I'm curious, Will we ever see those Motion enhancement features on Non 120hz TVs since you say it had nothing do with the the 120hz at all?


Could Auto Motion Plus be added to Samsung HDTVs that are 60hz?
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by TygerClaw /forum/post/14695428


I'm curious, Will we ever see those Motion enhancement features on Non 120hz TVs since you say it had nothing do with the the 120hz at all?

No need to wait, the Sony V4100 does it and its a 60hz set.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by rob80b /forum/post/14694381


Hi Guys,


Just trying to educate myself before choosing a new set, but wouldn't one prefer video content to look like film.

Maybe I'm old school, but I'm finding my biggest deterrent with LCD over Plasma is that is that all the LCD screens look like over sized computer monitors, a big negative when watching movies over even broadcasts for that matter.


The "look" will depend greatly on the input....cable, satellite, DVD, Blu. Then you have the option to enhance that image with whatever technology is built into the Tv. Just turn that tech off and you will be fine.
 

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So this thread confuses me a little. It sounds like some people DESIRE the soap opera effect? I think the soap opera effect is incredibly distracting and looks terrible.


So if I were to get a Sony XBR# system, what do you toggle to get rid of this effect? When I went to a store playing a BluRay (all BluRays I've seen in store tend to have this problem) I tried to play with the settings but couldn't get the effect to go away.


So to keep it simple.. how about this:


For both Samsung and Sony televisions, what are the exact steps I can perform to get rid of the soap opera effect if I were to walk up to one in the store?
 

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I think a feature such as this would only appeals to those who want smoothness in the video.


But for those who are hardcore Film buffs, They will turn off the feature cause it takes away from the movie look since film is at 24fps.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenaf /forum/post/14695846


So this thread confuses me a little. It sounds like some people DESIRE the soap opera effect? I think the soap opera effect is incredibly distracting and looks terrible. ?

Alot of people feel this way. It feels unnatural to them.

I like the feature for sports and gaming.

but not for film. It tends to make a movie look like a home video.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenaf /forum/post/14695846


So if I were to get a Sony XBR# system, what do you toggle to get rid of this effect? When I went to a store playing a BluRay (all BluRays I've seen in store tend to have this problem) I tried to play with the settings but couldn't get the effect to go away.?

you should turn off the motionflow. This will get rid of that videolike look.


But be aware that motion blurr will become evident. Thats the only downside, The AMP and motionflow are pretty good at reducing motion blurr. When they are off , motion performance suffers.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenaf /forum/post/14695846


So to keep it simple.. how about this:


For both Samsung and Sony televisions, what are the exact steps I can perform to get rid of the soap opera effect if I were to walk up to one in the store?

Sony: turn off motionflow


Samsung: Turn off AMP (Auto motion plus)
 

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But let me make sure I'm understanding this right..


If I "turn off" the Motionflow or AMP, I am just turning off the.. what am I turning off? I'm NOT turning off 120hz, am I? And for an XBR7, I would NOT be turning off the 240hz, right? I am just turning off the.. processing that makes it look smoother?
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenaf /forum/post/14696836


But let me make sure I'm understanding this right..


If I "turn off" the Motionflow or AMP, I am just turning off the.. what am I turning off? I'm NOT turning off 120hz, am I? And for an XBR7, I would NOT be turning off the 240hz, right? I am just turning off the.. processing that makes it look smoother?

These sets run at 120Hz fulltime, irrespective of whether you have interpolation turned on. If AMP/Motionflow is off they'll simply repeat frames which has no visible effect on the picture with a sample and hold display.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenaf /forum/post/14696836


But let me make sure I'm understanding this right..


If I "turn off" the Motionflow or AMP, I am just turning off the.. what am I turning off? I'm NOT turning off 120hz, am I? And for an XBR7, I would NOT be turning off the 240hz, right? I am just turning off the.. processing that makes it look smoother?

AMP and motionflow are basically just motion enhansers that use interpolation. This adds duplicate frames in to "Smooth" out the motion.

Unfortunatly it creates some artifacting.


The 120hz will be working regardless to whether motionflow or amp is turned on or off.
 

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AMP kicks ass.
 
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