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The internetz are ablaze with the news that AACS 2.0 has been successfully cracked using an SGX exploit (not like Smurfs 2 which was due to bad keys):

Inferno (2016)
Patriots Day (2016)
La La Land (2016)

More to come... I can't believe that some people (very vocal people) didn't think this would ever happen. lulz
Given the nature of the sources being all related to piracy, I won't provide any links, but I'm sure if you searched for "aacs 2.0 sgx uhd" with a filter on the last week, you would find plenty to read from multiple reddit threads, doom9 threads, and torrent news sites.

No one specifically knows 100% if it's actually cracked or if this is a different workaround, but the group responsible (in the photo above) is claiming that they have found a way. Tip o' the iceberg, I says.
I'm not talking about rumours, we've heard about this SGX possible compromise for months now, I'm talking about proof that this is what's been used to crack AACS 2.0, which is what you incorrectly posted in your first post. AFAIK there has been no link established between the SGX vulnerability (which will be patched by Intel anyway, which means that unless you have one of the flawed processors you won't be able to decrypt and backup your discs) and the illegal release of a handful of titles by a group of pirates.

Until someone publishes code or releases software proving that AACS 2.0 has been cracked (i.e. that any original disc can be read with unlicensed software), it simply hasn't been cracked. It might be partially cracked, or it might simply be leaks of the files without any cracking taking place, just simple data theft. No one knows, as you correctly say in your second post.

Please, let's discuss here ways in which AACS 2.0 prevents legitimate owners from making backups of their original discs. I have no interest in knowing that a group of thieves somewhere can illegally share intellectual property online, and that other thieves are happy to download that content without paying for it. I certainly don't want to read anything about this on AVS Forums, as I believe it's correctly against the rules.

So until we can indeed make legitimate backups of our original discs, AACS 2.0 hasn't been cracked. Anything else should be discussed elsewhere. :)
 

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Yes copying the full protected iso to a HDD is possible (all the folder are there, even the AACS one). But the only thing you can do with it , is seeing the menu in PDVD17.
When you try to play the main m2ts: blackscreen on any player.

Thanks.

I guess you would need all the SGX compatibility requirements to be met to not see that black screen from PowerDVD (Kabylake and Intel iGPU, Windows 10) when playing an encrypted ISO, so that doesn't tell us anything.

I don't understand why, if Imgburn can create an ISO of the original disc, the m2ts file isn't playable by an unlicensed player supporting HEVC such as MPC-HD with LAV/MadVR, but I guess I'm missing something or am misunderstanding how AACS 2.0 works.
 

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Thanks.

I guess you would need all the SGX compatibility requirements to be met to not see that black screen from PowerDVD (Kabylake and Intel iGPU, Windows 10) when playing an encrypted ISO, so that doesn't tell us anything.

I don't understand why, if Imgburn can create an ISO of the original disc, the m2ts file isn't playable by an unlicensed player supporting HEVC such as MPC-HD with LAV/MadVR, but I guess I'm missing something or am misunderstanding how AACS 2.0 works.
I wish someone with SGX hdmi 2.0 mobo would try to play a protected iso (ripped from a non-certified uhd-bd drive) in PDVD17 to see what happen.

my mobo/cpu is SGX compliant but my mobo only hdmi 1.4 :(

Once Nvidia update their driver to support uhd-bd playback, i will try for sure.
 

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I wish someone with SGX hdmi 2.0 mobo would try to play a protected iso (ripped from a non-certified uhd-bd drive) in PDVD17 to see what happen.

my mobo/cpu is SGX compliant but my mobo only hdmi 1.4 :(

Once Nvidia update their driver to support uhd-bd playback, i will try for sure.
Thanks, when you do test this please report back here.
 

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I wish someone with SGX hdmi 2.0 mobo would try to play a protected iso (ripped from a non-certified uhd-bd drive) in PDVD17 to see what happen.

my mobo/cpu is SGX compliant but my mobo only hdmi 1.4 :(

Once Nvidia update their driver to support uhd-bd playback, i will try for sure.
It's more complicated than that. You can rip BD's with protection too, but PowerDVD won't play them. AnyDVD added that a while back, to rip a BD with the protection intact, but that still requires AnyDVD running to play it, even in licensed players. I'm not really up on why, but I think it has to do with the rip missing something that's required, probably something from the physical drive.
 

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It's more complicated than that. You can rip BD's with protection too, but PowerDVD won't play them. AnyDVD added that a while back, to rip a BD with the protection intact, but that still requires AnyDVD running to play it, even in licensed players. I'm not really up on why, but I think it has to do with the rip missing something that's required, probably something from the physical drive.
Do you mean even in unlicensed players? And do you mean protection or encryption? these are two different things. That licensed players can't play a protected BD ISO, I understand, but you can't make the ISO of a bluray without AnyDVD or similar to first decrypt, hence allowing access to the data on the drive. Then this ISO might still be protected (for example with BD+) but it's not encrypted anymore, because AACS 1.0 was bypassed in order to access the data on the disc in the first place and create the backup. Licensed players won't play the ISO if they detect it's a copy, because the encryption (AACS 1.0) is gone but the protection (BD+, Cinavia) is still there. But unlicensed players don't care about that and you can play the m2ts file of a protected backup without any problem. You just can't burn the ISO and expect the backup to work in a licensed player, because it's still protected. But it's not encrypted anymore. Encryption is related to hardware/driver/OS. You simply can't access the data if the software trying to read isn't either licensed to do so, or has a way to circumvent the protection.

This is why I don't understand how Imgburn can create and ISO of an original UHD Bluray when it's not able to bypass the AACS 2.0 protection.

At the moment, for the end user, I thought the only way to access the content on the disc was to use an SGX protected path, which on a PC means PDVD 17, Kabylake, iGPU and supported drive. That means you can watch, but not backup the data. I thought that AACS 2.0 would prevent unlicensed software (such as Imgburn) from accessing the data on the disc. But once the data is off the disc into an ISO, even if it's a protected ISO, unlicensed players shouldn't have any problem playing the m2ts file, because they don't care about enforcing any remaining protection (BD+, Cinavia etc). And I don't see how it can be an ISO and still be encrypted. Why would Imgburn decrypt (and how?) to then re-encrypt? It doesn't make sense to me.

To access the data on your original disc, you first need to decrypt it, which I thought was impossible to do until AACS 2.0 is cracked. This is why I'm scratching my head. I thought imgburn would not be able to copy the data from the disc due to AACS 2.0, but then even if some protection remains, I thought that unlicensed players wouldn't care about it, the same as they don't care about BD+/Cinavia because they don't rely on the menus to access the file on the disc.

Clear as mud, huh?

Anyway, I don't have a BDXL burner or a UHD Bluray PC drive, so I can't test this, but I'm clearly missing something.
 

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Do you mean even in unlicensed players? And do you mean protection or encryption? these are two different things. That licensed players can't play a protected BD ISO, I understand, but you can't make the ISO of a bluray without AnyDVD or similar to first decrypt, hence allowing access to the data on the drive. Then this ISO might still be protected (for example with BD+) but it's not encrypted anymore, because AACS 1.0 was bypassed in order to access the data on the disc in the first place and create the backup. Licensed players won't play the ISO if they detect it's a copy, because the encryption (AACS 1.0) is gone but the protection (BD+, Cinavia) is still there. But unlicensed players don't care about that and you can play the m2ts file of a protected backup without any problem. You just can't burn the ISO and expect the backup to work in a licensed player, because it's still protected. But it's not encrypted anymore. Encryption is related to hardware/driver/OS. You simply can't access the data if the software trying to read isn't either licensed to do so, or has a way to circumvent the protection.
AnyDVD allows you to make a copy of a Blu-ray without removing AACS, presumably this is similar to using ImgBurn to make an ISO of a UHD BD. However that ISO, with AACS intact, is not playable in anything, as I understand it. That ISO required AnyDVD running to remove the AACS since even licensed players are not able to do that. I believe a licensed player needs to use keys stored in the drive (or something like that) to decrypt the disc, so if the disc isn't in a player it can't be decrypted by licensed software.

This is why I don't understand how Imgburn can create and ISO of an original UHD Bluray when it's not able to bypass the AACS 2.0 protection.
It just copies the encrypted data off the disc into an ISO. It's not useful for anything of course, it's still encrypted. Same thing as if you don't rip it, you can put a UHD BD disc into a compatible drive, and you can see the filesystem and all the files, but you can't play them or do anything useful with them they're all encrypted. You can do the same thing with a Blu-ray Disc or DVD, but without something to decrypt it, you've just read/copied a bunch of scrambled files.
 

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AnyDVD allows you to make a copy of a Blu-ray without removing AACS, presumably this is similar to using ImgBurn to make an ISO of a UHD BD. However that ISO, with AACS intact, is not playable in anything, as I understand it. That ISO required AnyDVD running to remove the AACS since even licensed players are not able to do that. I believe a licensed player needs to use keys stored in the drive (or something like that) to decrypt the disc, so if the disc isn't in a player it can't be decrypted by licensed software.

It just copies the encrypted data off the disc into an ISO. It's not useful for anything of course, it's still encrypted. Same thing as if you don't rip it, you can put a UHD BD disc into a compatible drive, and you can see the filesystem and all the files, but you can't play them or do anything useful with them they're all encrypted. You can do the same thing with a Blu-ray Disc or DVD, but without something to decrypt it, you've just read/copied a bunch of scrambled files.
Thanks for the clarification, that makes more sense now. So the encrypted ISO is a bit like a zip encrypted with a password, and we don't have the password. All the data is there, but it's not readable.

So this means that as long as you don't plan to play the disc with PowerDVD using a protected SGX path, any BDXL player can be used to backup the disc itself, encrypted for now but possible unencrypted at a later stage? That would be good news, as I'd rather spend £60 on an LG than £240 on a Pioneer, as I'm 100% that putting an SGX compliant HTPC together isn't in my near future... If I'm one day able to create a backup of my discs, I'll want to play the files with MPC-HC/MadVR, not PDVD.
 

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So until we can indeed make legitimate backups of our original discs, AACS 2.0 hasn't been cracked. Anything else should be discussed elsewhere. :)
Well these thieves, as you put it, are defeating the system as a whole and making backups of actual discs. Whether AACS, as a part of that system, was cracked or not isn't necessarily relevant if the outcome is successful backups of discs. Like I've said a couple times now, the method is not known, but the outcome is. I look forward to seeing/hearing/learning more!
 

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So this means that as long as you don't plan to play the disc with PowerDVD using a protected SGX path, any BDXL player can be used to backup the disc itself, encrypted for now but possible unencrypted at a later stage? That would be good news, as I'd rather spend £60 on an LG than £240 on a Pioneer, as I'm 100% that putting an SGX compliant HTPC together isn't in my near future... If I'm one day able to create a backup of my discs, I'll want to play the files with MPC-HC/MadVR, not PDVD.
You'd have to go look at the AnyDVD feature to know. But IIRC you can't decrypt and encrypted ISO at a later date? That doesn't make sense to me, but that's sticking in my mind for some reason.

I just wouldn't waste time ripping anything until we can do it properly. No point wasting hundreds of GB's of HDD space for something that may, or may not ever be usable.
 

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Well these thieves, as you put it, are defeating the system as a whole and making backups of actual discs. Whether AACS, as a part of that system, was cracked or not isn't necessarily relevant if the outcome is successful backups of discs. Like I've said a couple times now, the method is not known, but the outcome is. I look forward to seeing/hearing/learning more!
Yes, you've said it a couple of times, but which outcome? Being able to steal intellectual property that doesn't belong to you? At the moment, that's the only outcome.
Yes, I call them thieves. I do not know how to call them differently. They are releasing stolen intellectual property illegally. If you don't call them (the "pirates") thieves, how do you call them? And if you don't call thieves people (the leechers) who use something that doesn't belong to them and that they haven't paid for, how do you call them?
The method is relevant if it relies on stolen/leaked keys and not on AACS 2.0 cracking, which hasn't been confirmed in any way, as you have yourself acknowledged.
Until AACS 2.0 is cracked, and until this method is used in software, we have no way to make usable backups of our original discs.
Again, the fact that some thieves release illegal content is irrelevant to this discussion.
I am aware that there are some people who rob banks or sell drugs and make a lot of money doing so. That doesn't help me to make some money legitimately. So please could you leave the "scene" out of this discussion?
I do not see how some thieves having access to some stolen/leaked keys (until a link is proved between the release of these illegal downloads and the cracking of AACS 2.0) is going to help us back up our original discs or use another player than PDVD 17.
It will become relevant when/if software publishers offer tools allowing end users to make legitimate backups of original discs, or to use the player of our choice to play our legitimately purchased content. That's when we'll know that AACS 2.0 has been cracked in a meaningful way. Until then, all we know is that there is one more illegal way to acquire digital content.
I understand that you want to look forward to seeing/hearing/learning more about that, but please could you entertain that part of the discussion outside of this thread?
One last time, there is no room for it here, it violates the forum rules.
 

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You'd have to go look at the AnyDVD feature to know. But IIRC you can't decrypt and encrypted ISO at a later date? That doesn't make sense to me, but that's sticking in my mind for some reason.

I just wouldn't waste time ripping anything until we can do it properly. No point wasting hundreds of GB's of HDD space for something that may, or may not ever be usable.
No, that's not what I meant. I don't plan to make unusable backups (you are correct that you can't decrypt an encrypted ISO at a later date).
What I mean is that if current BDXL readers can create now a backup of an encrypted disc, they should be able to create later a backup of a non-encrypted disc, as there is nothing that seems to prevent the data from being physically accessed. So I could buy now a £60 BDXL drive so that I can read the content of the disc (including the disc ID) to catalog it properly with MyMovies, and use that drive to create an ISO or BD Folder when/if our backup tools are updated.

Apart from the LG WH16NS40, do we know which other LG models can read UHD Bluray structure (up to 100Gb/triple layers)? Does the more recent BH16NS55 do it too?

I don't care if a drive isn't compatible with PowerDVD17, I just want a drive that can, when/if it becomes possible, create an unencrypted backup of my discs so that I can store my original away safely and use the software of my choice to play my content. Given your explanation and kwhite666 data, it looks like a new Pioneer costing four times as much isn't necessary for that application, and that a WH16NS40 (or possibly a BH16NS55) would give me the same benefits.
 

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No, that's not what I meant. I don't plan to make unusable backups (you are correct that you can't decrypt an encrypted ISO at a later date).
What I mean is that if current BDXL readers can create now a backup of an encrypted disc, they should be able to create later a backup of a non-encrypted disc, as there is nothing that seems to prevent the data from being physically accessed. So I could buy now a £60 BDXL drive so that I can read the content of the disc (including the disc ID) to catalog it properly with MyMovies, and use that drive to create an ISO or BD Folder when/if our backup tools are updated.
I wouldn't bet on it. It should be true, but who knows if whatever eventual solution appears (if ever) will need a drive with keys or not. Maybe there's something in the drives with the Ultra HD Blu-ray sticker that's necessary, maybe not, we just don't know.

Yes, you've said it a couple of times, but which outcome? Being able to steal intellectual property that doesn't belong to you? At the moment, that's the only outcome.
Yes, I call them thieves. I do not know how to call them differently. They are releasing stolen intellectual property illegally. If you don't call them (the "pirates") thieves, how do you call them? And if you don't call thieves people (the leechers) who use something that doesn't belong to them and that they haven't paid for, how do you call them?
Copyright infringement is the correct term. Or pirates is even correct. "Thieves" is not necessarily correct and is an inflammatory term that serves more to push people into their fighting corners than to promote an open discussion.

Now I'm in no way condoning copyright infringement, quite the contrary, but backing into the "thieves" mindset is the easy way out.

I do not see how some thieves having access to some stolen/leaked keys (until a link is proved between the release of these illegal downloads and the cracking of AACS 2.0) is going to help us back up our original discs or use another player than PDVD 17.
It doesn't help us directly, but it indicates that there is "work" being done, and being done with success. I have more hope for an "end user" solution knowing that it seems possible to circumvent AACS 2.0, than without that knowledge.

Until then, all we know is that there is one more illegal way to acquire digital content.
I understand that you want to look forward to seeing/hearing/learning more about that, but please could you entertain that part of the discussion outside of this thread?
One last time, there is no room for it here, it violates the forum rules.
Discussing that it's happening doesn't violate the rules, it's news, it's happening. We're definitely allowed to discuss that UHD BDs have released and what the implications of that are. What does (or would) violate the rules is if people were posting links to those files or discussing how to get them, or how to (more than in a general sense) how to do it themselves.
 

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Yes, you've said it a couple of times, but which outcome?
The only outcome that matters to me is being able to take my purchased UHD discs and back them up onto my own server for playback across my house. What other people do is up to them, just give me the tools. Approval not required.

or how to (more than in a general sense) how to do it themselves.
... With the exception of the nonstop discussion in this thread and forum about MakeMKV, AnyDVD, etc. :D
 

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The internetz are ablaze with the news that AACS 2.0 has been successfully cracked using an SGX exploit (not like Smurfs 2 which was due to bad keys):
If a SGX exploit is the method being used, then that doesn't mean AACS 2.0 is cracked.
SGX can be fixed/updated, so that method would be useless on future discs after that.

Pirates are always first and then come anydvdhd, dvdfab or makemkv to make money from it.
Actually not true, Slysoft (AnyDVD) were the first to fully "crack" AACS & BD+ protections.

It's more complicated than that. You can rip BD's with protection too, but PowerDVD won't play them. AnyDVD added that a while back, to rip a BD with the protection intact, but that still requires AnyDVD running to play it, even in licensed players. I'm not really up on why, but I think it has to do with the rip missing something that's required, probably something from the physical drive.
Original pressed discs have a BD-ROM mark containing necessary data (Volume ID) for decyption/playback.
That's what is missing and why you can not play the protected ISO in a licensed player.
 

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If a SGX exploit is the method being used, then that doesn't mean AACS 2.0 is cracked.
SGX can be fixed/updated, so that method would be useless on future discs after that.



Actually not true, Slysoft (AnyDVD) were the first to fully "crack" AACS & BD+ protections.
1- But if they (pirates) don't update their mobo's bios, they should be good to continue ?

2- I thought doom9 user muslix64 was the first to crack AACS protection in December 2006, and then Anydvdhd was released in February 2007.
Or is he the creator of anydvdhd ??
 

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1- But if they (pirates) don't update their mobo's bios, they should be good to continue ?

2- I thought doom9 user muslix64 was the first to crack AACS protection in December 2006, and then Anydvdhd was released in February 2007.
Or is he the creator of anydvdhd ??
1. Playback software could be updated and the old version not be able to play new discs. The new version could refuse to play any disc without having a patched SGX update, so that method would be no good anymore.

2. muslix64 didn't "crack" AACS, he found keys stored in the memory of a player.
This method isn't sustainable as future player update fixed it and the old exploited player version couldn't play new discs.
Also he wasn't a pirate either, he shared his method so everyone could use it and rip their own content.

Slysoft (AnyDVD) actually fully cracked AACS first meaning it could decypt any disc including new ones.
At first they were accused of stealing the doom9 known keys and methods and commercializing them, however this was proven not be true when new discs came out that AnyDVD handled (others methods didn't).
Then came BD+ discs that again Slysoft defeated, this time months before doom9 and years before DVDFab.
 

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If a SGX exploit is the method being used, then that doesn't mean AACS 2.0 is cracked.
SGX can be fixed/updated, so that method would be useless on future discs after that.
But it might last long enough for developers to get the information they need to find a more permanent solution.

Slysoft (AnyDVD) actually fully cracked AACS first meaning it could decypt any disc including new ones.
Did they? Because AnyDVD still needs constant updates, and a connection to the opd to decrypt new discs.
 

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But it might last long enough for developers to get the information they need to find a more permanent solution.
Yes absolutely.
We don't even know what method is being used anyway. It may have nothing to do with a SGX exploit.
What doesn't make sense to me is if I was a pirate and had managed to crack AACS 2.0 (or even just able to find a key from any current disc), I'd go out and get the latest and greatest UHD discs and upload them to show off my accomplishment.
Unless what I have doesn't work on all discs and I have to randomly try it on different discs until I find one that works - the pirate releases mentioned here in my opinion seem to fit that.

Did they? Because AnyDVD still needs constant updates, and a connection to the opd to decrypt new discs.
Yes they did, their AACS decyption is always done online for unknown discs (this is on purpose, to stop prying eyes), it takes a couple of seconds for it to get the necessary data and decypt, then the known keys are added to the local database in future releases (so no OPD needed)

New releases are required to fix other protections (and a lot of DVD's still) and to add built in local support for new known AACS discs since the last release.
 

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Yes absolutely.
What doesn't make sense to me is if I was a pirate and had managed to crack AACS 2.0 (or even just able to find a key from any current disc), I'd go out and get the latest and greatest UHD discs and upload them to show off my accomplishment.
Unless what I have doesn't work on all discs and I have to randomly try it on different discs until I find one that works - the pirate releases mentioned here in my opinion seem to fit that.

Maybe they don't want too much attention because like the rumor says, it may be fixed by an update.
I really hope this lead to a definitive crack of AACS 2.0 so i can use my htpc/madvr to playback my uhd-bd.

thanks for the info you provided.
 
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