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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hello all I just thought I would post a update to some discussion on the DVDR-985. I got off the phone yesterday from talking to my Philips rep and asked about the problem of the menu being located to high on our tv screens when running in progressive mode and he filled me in on that when the menu was being put together in europe they accidently developed it on a pal tv so the menu would there for be off center on a US tv. The software fix is allready being worked on and will be available in a cd/dvd format, probably will be able to dl it allso? No time line, it shouldn't be to long their pretty quick on fixing small things like this.

Allso I burned a dvd from VHS and took it to my store and tried it on ALL the dvd players we sell. Results= FANTASTIC!!!

it worked in 95% of our dvd players. Here are the ones it worked on.

Tosh

sd4700

sd2705

sd3750

samsung

dvdn501

vdvm301

dvds221

dvdv2000 vhs/dvd combo

Philips

dvd793ch

sony

dvpnc600b

dvpns700

dvpns400d

dvpns300

panasonic

dvdrp56

jvc

xvs500bk

xvs300bk

sharp

dvs10

magnovox

dvd611

mintek

dvd2110

sylvania

dvc8500


Machines it didn't work on.

jvc xvfa95gd

panasonic dvdcv52k

panasonic pvd4752 dvd/vcr


Now I was able to have such great success simply by reading the manual and doing the little mode trick, (place the disk on the dvd tray of the recorder and hold the #3 key down on the remote untile tray closses and disk gets marked mode 3!!)) next I will take the same disk and put mode #2 on it and see if it works with the last three dvd players, I allso feel that there may have been a repair issue with at least one of the non working dvd players.


P.S. It allso worked in the dvd tv combo sets that I sell!


That's it hope this helps some of you who were looking at this machine.


Dean
 

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That's correct, Philips does develop everything on PAL first. Strange that they screwed up like that, though...


What does it mean when it's "mode 3" or "mode 2" ?


I have a few questions about the DVDR 985:


1. If you feed it interlaced TV source, does it deinterlace it and output it through the progressive output (even when not recording)? If so, does the image look ok, or not?


i.e., can I input SVideo through my sat receiver through the unit and keep the unit constantly hooked up on the progressive output?


2. If you feed it analog audio (i.e., the TV settings), and connect the digital (coax or fiber) to your receiver, does it convert the analog to digital by itself (or do I have to output both analog and digital connections - so that DVD playing works?


i.e., can I hear TV, DVD, everything by just keeping the coax/fiber audio connetion between the 985 and the A/V receiver?
 

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Shift in progressive mode has nothing to do with PAL. It is a BS anwser from customer rep. This only happens on progressive scan so it can't be disgn problem but screwed up firmware issue. I was the first to call Philips on this. They even replaced my unit for another one with the same issue.

There are other bugs with this recorder and picture quality is lower comparing to Pioneer and Panasonic.


oferlaor,


1. Yes it goes thru progressive and image is dependent on quality setting, because everything goes thru Mpeg encoder.


2. It converts audio to PCM but records AC3 on a disc. You can hear everything.
 

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Hey,


1. I thought that turning off monitor mode caused it to bypass the MPEG encoder...


2. Great! - so you basically have one fiber connection to the receiver and regardless of what you're watching (TV, DVD, recording, etc.) - you can hear everything, right? By AC3 - you mean Dolby Prologic (not 5.1).


I have to admit, this unit is quite tempting.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
>>There are other bugs with this recorder and picture quality is lower comparing to Pioneer and Panasonic.>>


Ugh.... can't agree with this at all, after making a copy from all my home vids from my Svcr to my 985 I can't tell one bit of difference between the source materiel and the original! I have my 985 hooked up via s-out to my big screen and also hooked up via prog out to my big screen that has been calibrated and looks fantastic.

This machine is almost to sharp in it's prog pic out, I can see pixls/dig artifacts in some dvds with not the best transfer/compression, but if I put on a dvd that is a supperbit, damn this thing shines, guess it's the Furdju chips set, sorry about spelling. If you arn't running prog out I think you are missing allot in picture quality.

Yes prog out even with s-in.

I have to run off to work, I will return and explain the modes after I get home.

Dean
 

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Sorry to be such a nag, but I'm still not clear on it. More questions:


1. Can I turn off monitor mode, so I can see SVideo in through progressive output without going through the MPEG decoder (i.e., no degredation of signal even when in LP mode)?


2. Can timer mode record from SVideo sources, or just from tuner?


3. I understand that you have to turn off the recorder for it to enter timer mode (and record stuff that's on the timer recording lists). If you turn the unit off, does that mean you can't see anything through progressive out?


Damn, that'll do it for me. I don't have any way of using the unit unless I put it in serial between my plasma and my SVideo source.


If #3 is a problem, then I have no way of setting a timer (once I do, regular TV watching will be impossible).


Back to the drawing board :(
 

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oferlaor,


#1. No

#2. Yes

#3. Yes you do have to turn it off, so yes to part2


BTW, there's a bug with the timer system. If you have daylight savings turned on, you have to set the timer for an hour earlier (even though the clock shows the correct time)...
 

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I have sent content from my sony DV cam on cam3 on my 985 firewire to

firewire. Has anyone been able to export XP pro files on computer in

dv format or anything else to 985. Its not supposed to work that and can

only do one way from camera to 985, however, with XP Pro seems there

should be a way as it sees digital devices??? Sending a 1080i to

985 in any setting knocks it down quite a bit using component in to

985 and progressive out to HDTV monitor must be because of the

mpg encoder and it won't just pass the signal thru when the 985 is turned

off it must on to pass the signal thru which sucks. I like the unit, however.

I get much better results with copying content in 1080i from my

HDTV monitor thru coax in thru pvr on computer and then copy to 200i and

when played back on 200i to vga imput on HD monitor looks like

original 1080i to me with no loss on monitor or when I see it when I

get it back from the VGA out on the monitor coming back and showing up in the pvr window on my computer monitor!!! also when i send dvd signal

on my combo vcr/dvd player from coax out on unit using an a/b switch

thru this chain there is no copy guard on the analog signal but then

it gets bosted to 1080i before getting recorded and looks better than the

original as it gets kicked uo to 1080i from 480...its a beautiful thing!

:) :) :) :) :) :) :) :)
 

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***

Sending a 1080i to 985 in any setting knocks it down quite a bit using component in to 985 and progressive out to HDTV monitor.

***


You can record the HD image using 1080i as an input?


I know this would knock the image down to 480 for recording if it worked... but the question is does the recording happen as anamorphic? Can you tell the player that you are recording an anamorophic image? So that if it were played back on a 4:3 TV the image would then have the 33% line drop to make people not look stretched?


Interesting that you can't use the unit as a straight line doubler like a DVDO. HAving to set the Mpeg Encoder to effect the quality... Ohh well. I guess that is one of those functions that helps make sure you get a recording of exactly the same quality as what you see at the time.
 

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The image shift problem on the 985 is as a result of the "TV" Philips used to set the scaling for the Faroudja chip. Pal / NTSC had nothing to do with it.


Since Philips is notorius for have some of the worst "overscan" on their European built & designed CRT products in the industry, the settings that they made for the progressive scan output on the 985 was perfect on their current model 34" (with it's overscan problem). However, when the 985 was connected to other non Philips TV sets (be it Projection or Direct View) the menus were way too high.


Now according to my engineer buddy @ Philips, there is a Firmware upgrade fix to make this a moot issue. Remember the issues with the Q50???? Sound Familiar???? You think they (Philips Europe) would have learned the first time.


I am told the firmware upgrade is being tested to fix this problem & that it may address other little bugs in the machine. ETA...???? Soon I hope.


Side Bar Comments:


As for picture quality on the 985 versus Pioneer & the Panasonic, this is what I see on my 3 units. In other words, IMHO...


Pioneer DVR7000: If you are in the VR mode on the Pioneer where the Variable Bit Rate is being used, there are times the Pioneer appears a bit sharper than the Philips. But not many. And there are times when the horizontal peaking is being SO over driven that the edge detail is worse than dragging my nails down the chalk board. It is also important to note that Disc you are making is NOT compatible with almost 30 million DVD players on the market when you record in the VR mode. If you decide to switch over to the VM or compatible mode & only want to record up to 2 hours "compatible", IMHO, the Philips wins hands down. In the VR mode on the Pioneer the Variable Bit Rate Indicator is unable to be used. Also, I hate having to FINALIZE every time I want to try the Disc in another player. Finalize then UN-Finalize, Finalize then UN-Finalize...AH! The Pioneer DOES have the Firewire Output, that is a plus for the computer person who goes back & forth editing. But that's not me. (NOTE: I also heard that thery STOPPED manufacturing this unit because of a Playback issue. So there maybe some kind of recall being announced on this model & the OEM piece that they were making for Sony in Japan, too, so I get to send this baby in for repair or replacement...oh joy!)


Panasonic DMRE20: This unit is hard to compare becase there is no Progressive Scan capabilities on this unit & it is missing a Firewire Input. With NO Firewire INPUT, my new Canon Mini DV Camcorder is being wasted on this unit. In the 480i mode using the line doubler on my TV, the Panny has a softer picture which would be less forgiving with regards to artifacts. Seeing how the only way it can "re-record" is with a RAM disc, I don't really count this in the picture quality discussion. The DVD-RAM ONLY plays on this machine. Yes, the picture quality is very good, BUT... I along with many people like my dad don't have a DVD-RAM drive on my computer or in his living room. I believe RAM has many cool features (Time Slip & Packet Recording), but the format (IMHO) is a little too late in the DVD game. Looking at the DVD-R feature. It is OK. That damn finalizing is gonna be the death of me. It took me 25 minutes the other day to finalize a DVD-R disc. Next time I will put more information on the disc even if I have to record snow. In the 1 & 2 hour modes the picture is pretty good. Once again it is 480i going though a line doubler so the picture is softer not revealing the artifacts. I don't use the 4 & 6 hour modes, especially the 6 hour mode...it only records one field at a time. I usually leave that mode for my "Martha Stewart" archiving:D The fact that no -RW exists for this model is a bad thing for me. I know prices of DVD-R's are down but even @ $2 a disc that ads up when I am playing around.


Philips DVDR985: Well, I have too admit even with the "picture menu" issue on this unit I like it over all 3. NO FINALIZING & Compatibility with that little trick (changing modes to #2 or #3) when the DVD won't play on other brand of DVD players is pretty slick. The picture quality is very good on the 1 & 2 hour modes. 3 hour was pretty good. I recorded the last game of the Stanely Cup (with VBR turned ON) in the 3 hour mode & was satisfied with the results. And as for the 4 hour mode... "archive purpose" only...again Martha Stewart. I like the component video input for making back up copies of my DVD's & the Faroudja picture (eventhough off center) kicks total butt. I would like to talk to the guy who put that stupid piece of plastic on the front covering the Firewire input. You think for a $1000 bucks Philips could have maybe used a bread tie to hold the door on...Come ON!


Any way, I spend WAAAAAAAAAY too much money on electronics & these are ONLY my opinions. This technology is pretty cool. Go see for yourself.
 

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Some corrections to LB's post above and my likes/dislikes. I own both the Panasonic DMR-E20 and the Pioneer DVR-7000.


Pioneer: You only have to finalize DVD-RW discs for certain machines. I can play unfinalized -RW discs in my Panasonic RP-91. You don't need to UN-Finalize, in fact you can't. That option is ONLY for -RW discs finalized in another brands machine. Not sure what this sentence means, "In the VR mode on the Pioneer the Variable Bit Rate Indicator is unable to be used."


Panasonic: You must be thinking of the Pioneer when you said it takes "It took me 25 minutes the other day to finalize a DVD-R disc." The Pioneer finalize time does vary but the Panasonic ONLY takes 4 minutes to finalize any DVD-R regardless of the amount of material recorded. You can't/don't need to finalize DVD-RAM discs.


My likes/dislikes of the two above. If the Pioneer could use the VBR recording modes on DVD-R then it would be the Perfect dvd recorder. I like it better than the Panasonic mostly for the incredible amount of flexibility over recording noise reduction and picture settings. That and the fact that I can get DVD-RW discs for $1.79 each now. I like the fact that Panasonic has 4 CBR modes and VBR modes (albeit via timer) for DVD-R. I like the Titling screen WAY better on the E20 than the 7000. The black level issue does bug me on the E20. Also, the 16:9/4:3 flag for recording on the Pioneer is way nice for recording 16:9 material downconverted from HD. For the price the E20 can't be beat but the true videophile will appreciate the features on the 7000. I can't wait to see what features these things have in five years time.


I must add that I think the 7000 has a soft picture. I view all my recordings on my RP-91.
 
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