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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hello,


I am in a dilemma and desperately seek advice from AVS. Last week I purchased a Sony KDL-65W850A for my parents living room. This is the first time they have ever had a TV in their living room and it will now be their primary TV. The family will be using this TV to watch 80% Cable TV (Indian Dramas, reality shows, documentaries and sports (Hockey + Tennis) and then 20% movies (usually on weekends).


Now I am debating on what speakers to purchase. The way the house is designed, my parents said they will be listening at low to medium volume because otherwise the sound easily travels through the open townhouse layout. For this particular setup, I would like to shoot for the best bang for the buck. Speakers that would sound great with various quality sources. I figured any of these choices will be better then the built-in TV speakers or a sub $500 soundbar. Also, the receiver I will be probably purchase is the Denon 1613 ($200 on Craigslist Brand-New).


I do not mind waiting for sales. Today, the Pioneer FS52 are $87/each @ Amazon and the C22 is $67! Seems like a great deal! Another option, my parents bedroom have a Denon 1713 + Energy Take Classic 5.1 setup. My dad works from home and uses this all the time for music in surround sound. He listens to these health related audio tracks which he also uses for sleep and meditation. He is really happy with the setup, but I am debating if I should take the 1713 + Energy Take Classic setup down into the living room and then use the Denon 1613 ($200 on CL) + 2x Absolute Zero's and a sub since I think 2.1 makes more sense for music. He is REALLY happy with the Energy Take's, but then again he came from a crappy budget Sony HTIB system that was 8 years old. I figured if he does not like the 2.1 I can always purchase the rest of the Absolute Zero's down the road.


Also, I always hear great things about the P363 as great budget speakers too as they go on sale every once in a while for $107 each. Another thing I have been thinking about, purchase the FS52/C22 now and then wait for a good sale for a better receiver. Then next year get a decent sub.


Appreciate any feedback. I hope this was not too confusing!


Edit: My other big concern. Our cats scratch up everything. I am afraid if I get the FS52's that the cats will scratch up the front covers since they are cloth. Perhaps satellites would be better since I can wall mount them?
 

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I suggest the Martin-Logan MLT-2 system, which Amazon has for under $400.


That has better main speakers and a better subwoofer, and is a much better system all around IMO than the Take system.


The speakers are designed for wall-mounting, and the owner's manual outlines how to do it easily using common hardware.


For a nice receiver, I suggest the Harman-Kardon AVR700, which Amazon has for $207.


The Take system may be OK for the bedroom, but it would be inadequate for a larger room IMO; the main speakers are only 2.5 inches.


The Pioneer speakers have a major drawback; their sensitivity is VERY VERY low, which is not so good.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by commsysman  /t/1523872/urgent-pioneer-fs52-vs-e...-infinity-p363-vs-absolute-zero#post_24519063


their sensitivity is VERY VERY low, which is not so good.

Don't believe the sensitivity hype. Not really a factor in everyday life.


Besides the Martin-Logan MLT-2 is 88dB/2.83v/m and the Pioneer is 87dB/2.83v/m. Not much of a difference in real life.


Another thing is, those Martin Logan are more like "home theater in a box". They probably measure like Bose.
 

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IMO the MLT-2 is far better than the Take system, and the price is very good for what you get.


Comparing them to a cheesy HTIB system is a cheap shot and not accurate at all.


You are correct on the sensitivity of the FS52; I was thinking of the BS22, which is much lower.


They certainly SOUND a lot better than Bose.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AcuDefTechGuy  /t/1523872/urgent-pioneer-fs52-vs-e...-infinity-p363-vs-absolute-zero#post_24519156


Don't believe the sensitivity hype. Not really a factor in everyday life.


Besides the Martin-Logan MLT-2 is 88dB/2.83v/m and the Pioneer is 87dB/2.83v/m. Not much of a difference in real life.


Another thing is, those Martin Logan are more like "home theater in a box". They probably measure like Bose.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by commsysman  /t/1523872/urgent-pioneer-fs52-vs-e...-infinity-p363-vs-absolute-zero#post_24519190


Comparing them to a cheesy HTIB system is a cheap shot and not accurate at all. They certainly SOUND a lot better than Bose.

You're right. I stand corrected. It was a cheap shot and I take it back.



But the NHT Absolute Zero (+/-0.88dB FR) is a great sounding speaker.


And don't believe the sensitivity hype. Not a big deal in real life. It is only a hype.
 

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Both the energy take classics and the Martin Logan mlt2 are small systems for very small rooms. The pioneers, not my favorite speakers, would be much better for anything med size room to larger! That price is hard to beat...
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·

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Originally Posted by Elihawk  /t/1523872/urgent-pioneer-fs52-vs-e...-infinity-p363-vs-absolute-zero#post_24520877


Both the energy take classics and the Martin Logan mlt2 are small systems for very small rooms. The pioneers, not my favorite speakers, would be much better for anything med size room to larger! That price is hard to beat...

Why is the Pioneer not your favorite? What else would you recommend? I keep hearing people not that happy with the Pioneer AJ.


I am starting to think I should save up a bit more. Shoot for a nice 2.0 setup and decent receiver for this year and get a nicer center + sub next year. Looking at Cambridge S30 & EMP E5Bi's.
 

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Get the Infinity P363 speakers and use them upstairs for stereo use.


Put the Takes downstairs with either Denon receiver.


No point having two sets of satellites speakers when stereo use is the main purpose upstairs.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZzBloopzZ  /t/1523872/urgent-pioneer-fs52-vs-e...-infinity-p363-vs-absolute-zero#post_24520965



Why is the Pioneer not your favorite? What else would you recommend? I keep hearing people not that happy with the Pioneer AJ.


I am starting to think I should save up a bit more. Shoot for a nice 2.0 setup and decent receiver for this year and get a nicer center + sub next year. Looking at Cambridge S30 & EMP E5Bi's.
Where do you keep hearing that?

 

For the price range...especially with the big sales going on right now...they seem to basically be a consensus slam-dunk everywhere I looked/read.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZzBloopzZ  /t/1523872/urgent-pioneer-fs52-vs-e...-infinity-p363-vs-absolute-zero#post_24520965


Why is the Pioneer not your favorite? What else would you recommend? I keep hearing people not that happy with the Pioneer AJ.


I am starting to think I should save up a bit more. Shoot for a nice 2.0 setup and decent receiver for this year and get a nicer center + sub next year. Looking at Cambridge S30 & EMP E5Bi's.

This is just my opinion. For the pioneer fs52, i found the highs to be tipped up and a bit sibilant, that was my biggest complaint with it. Others did not notice sibilance, perhaps it was just my pair. However, I noticed excessive sibilance in the center too, tested on many different sources. I remembered really liking my previous p362 for both movies and music but sold due to a move, so I ended up repurchasing the primus speakers. I much prefer the p363 as it has better dynamics, midrange, and bass. I think these are one of the best bargains in audio. I feel I need to spend a lot more to get a noticeable improvement on these.


I would skip the small satellite choices. Lately i prefer just 2.0 channel music listening. But maybe that's because I can't afford really nice dual subwoofers or have the space for them. I'm kind of confused why so many recommend bookshelf plus one subwoofer. I would go right to dual subwoofers or not even bother, but that's just me. If I was to do over, I would go dual sealed subs to save space. Also, many are happy with MTM horizontal centers too, I much prefer using a vertical positioned regular bookshelf as center.


Ultimately you will have to judge with your own ears. Many different speakers have rave user reviews all over the place, doesn't necessarily mean you will like them. However, you may be not that picky with audio and like almost everything as long as better than tv speakers.
 

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Right now with the sales on the Pioneers, I really don't see anything that offers better bang for the buck unless you just don't like the way they sound. If he is happy with the Energy Takes, then an actual full size speaker will put him over the moon. I would recommend the FS52 towers and C22 center, having a center is important for dialogue and will allow them to keep the volume lower and still maintain clarity. Also I would stick with the Denon receiver, having Audyssey Dynamic EQ and Volume will help with low volume clarity.


I am a big fan of NHT, but you can get the Pioneers for almost the price of one AZ, so it's tough to beat the prices right now. Best Buy will price match Amazon so you can pick them up in person. If you have a Frys near you, the Primus speakers go on sale often, but they just had one so I am not sure how long until the next.


What is your budget for a sub? If you went with the Pioneers, you are looking at $270 for the front three.
 

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I agree and will clarify my statement. About three years ago, I demo the first generation Pioneers vs Polk Monitors versus Infinity Primus...and just didn't like th Pioneers very much (they just didn't seem as clear and detailed as the other two speakers). Now, that was the first generation, so grain of salt #1. These are generation 2! #2, as pointed out by several in this thread, about the best quality you can get for the low prices you are listing!
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Farley1  /t/1523872/urgent-pioneer-fs52-vs-e...-infinity-p363-vs-absolute-zero#post_24521298


Where do you keep hearing that?


For the price range...especially with the big sales going on right now...they seem to basically be a consensus slam-dunk everywhere I looked/read.

What I meant to say is that people love this speaker, but then as they get more experience, they wish they started one tier above such as the Cambridge S30, Ascend 170 SE, EMP Tek E5Bi etc. This is what I gathered anyway from reading around.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Transmaniacon  /t/1523872/urgent-pioneer-fs52-vs-e...-infinity-p363-vs-absolute-zero#post_24522079


Right now with the sales on the Pioneers, I really don't see anything that offers better bang for the buck unless you just don't like the way they sound. If he is happy with the Energy Takes, then an actual full size speaker will put him over the moon. I would recommend the FS52 towers and C22 center, having a center is important for dialogue and will allow them to keep the volume lower and still maintain clarity. Also I would stick with the Denon receiver, having Audyssey Dynamic EQ and Volume will help with low volume clarity.


I am a big fan of NHT, but you can get the Pioneers for almost the price of one AZ, so it's tough to beat the prices right now. Best Buy will price match Amazon so you can pick them up in person. If you have a Frys near you, the Primus speakers go on sale often, but they just had one so I am not sure how long until the next.


What is your budget for a sub? If you went with the Pioneers, you are looking at $270 for the front three.

The more I think about it the more I am starting to realize other factors.


The Take Classic's fit perfectly in my fathers bedroom. I do not know where I would place full bookshelf speakers if I were to replace them. I suppose up top next to the receiver but then that would be one foot above ear level... don't think that would be worth it then.


For the price, the Pioneer's do seem like a great buy but wonder if family will be happier overall if I were to get a bit higher quality bookshelf down the road when I have more saved up. Plus I am afraid the cats will scratch up the FS52. These speakers will never be replaced so figured throwing down an extra $200-300 could get me bit better sound overall. I am debating if there ever will be a sub in living... they don't want anything too loud. Have a beefier system in basement with Sierra-1 LCR, 170 Se's as surrounds and PSA XV15 sub. Perhaps just do a 3.0 setup using nice bookshelfs? or maybe just save tons of money and get the Sony 260H soundbar, it will still sound better than TV speakers. Technically, I did go $620 over budget with this TV purchase and $1540 over budget on basement sound system (but damn was it worth it!).Easy to spend money on here, think I am getting addicted to speakers!


I purchased a Denon 1713 + Pioneer FS52 for GF's bedroom and was real happy with the sound but that as for music. Can't recall how they sound with movies.
 
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I would take some time then to figure out the physical size requirements, decide what you want to go with (2.0/2.1/3.0/etc.) and how much you want to spend.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZzBloopzZ  /t/1523872/urgent-pioneer-fs52-vs-e...-infinity-p363-vs-absolute-zero#post_24523179



What I meant to say is that people love this speaker, but then as they get more experience, they wish they started one tier above such as the Cambridge S30, Ascend 170 SE, EMP Tek E5Bi etc. This is what I gathered anyway from reading around.
I won't argue against that.

 

I have had mine exactly one month, and I already think I know what I want to replace them with. 

 

However, what I'm looking at for replacement/upgrade is on the order of $1,100 for the front stage (left/center/right), and I basically paid the current sale price for my Pioneers, which means about $250, including tax, for the entire front stage. 

 

If I was going to be "stuck" with these for a year or more before I could afford to upgrade, might rather have spent more money.  But since I hope to upgrade in a big way this year (by September at the latest)...they are perfect for me. All depends on what you want and how long you want it for, and your budget, as always (with any purchase in any facet of life). 

 

I do anticipate using these speakers somewhere in the house for a long time. and an extremely happy with what I got vs what I paid. (then again I'm a noob so maybe I'd be happy with anything that isn't under sized HTIB)
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
What speakers do you plan to upgrade to Farley?
 
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I really liked the Pion 22's.


However, I often turned them way up and they sounded better loud when I removed the drivers and dampened the interior walls.
 

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