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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hello Everyone,


I'm building a basement HT room which is 25'x12'x9' (lxhxw). The plan is to sound proof it using RC-1 Resilient channels and SAB (Sound Absorbing batting insulation, 3" thick). Then install two layers of sheet rock on the RC1 channels.


However, I'm looking for something like the ASC WallDamp damping sheets that are two sided adhesive to put between the RC1 and drywall and the drywall sheets.


Wondering if anyone knows of any other material than the branded WallDamp. They want an arm and a leg for their stuff.


I found that Capitol Materials sells RC1 and SAB pretty cheap. I can do the whole room for about $300 bucks. not bad and worth it.


But have not found good damping material yet. Any sugestions?


As to why? without the doublesided damping, the drywall will rattle against the RC1 which ain't good. the damping gives it some more sound proofing and glues everything together nicely.


Thanks in advance

Farid
 

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Hello Farid,


This is my first post after lurking for weeks here. I had the very same question as you and I am in the process of constructing a dedicated HT and music listening room in my basement. I am building my room to the exact specifications as ASC uses, but I have taken the time to locate all the same materials, but from less expensive sources. By the way, if you call ASC they will send you samples of all the components in the IsoWall system (dRC-1, dRC-2, floor felt, perimeter gasket).


I am pretty sure the WallDamp material is supplied to ASC by a company called Polymer Technologies located in Newark, DE. The PT product that gets relabeled as WallDamp is a product called Polydamp ADA. It is available for purchase from PT at roughly $2/sq. ft. This is significantly less than ASC charges per sq. ft., but it is still not cheap. For my room, the Polydamp ADA will still cost about $700.


The one problem you may have is that PT will probably not sell to you directly, at least they wouldn't sell to me. However, they will sell to my employer, so that's how I'm planning to purchase the material.


One other small issue is that you will have to purchase the material in sheets. I forget the exact size but it was something like 54x42 or something like that. You will also have to cut it yourself as PT wants an arm and a leg to die cut to the ASC spec sizes (even though they already do that for ASC!).


You can reach PT at 302-738-9001. I wouldn't mention that you know that they supply ASC. Just ask for a sample of Polydamp ADA. I'm sure they will send you one no problem.


Good Luck!
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Hi rwalton,


Thanks for the info. I'll try calling them to see what they can do. I've also got to call capitol materials and see if they have anything like it.


It seems to serve two purposes, one is damping sound, the other is to glue the sheets of rock to the rc1 and the two sheetrocks together, so they don't resonate and vibrate against each other.


It seems that if we're putting little square on the sheetrock, it doesn't do much dampening, unless it was the whole wall. So to me its main point seems to be gluing everything together.


I was thinking if that is the case, using liquid nail to glue the rock to RC1 should be ok. Although I haven't seen any suggestions like that.


Have you found anything else that is similar to wall damp and has double sided glue?


Thanks
 

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I used wall damp but not RC. I had some discussions with an engineer from asc in regards to how to use it and how it works. The dampening doesnt work by compression of the product. It works by the sheering movement of the 2 layers of rock. Thats why its sticky on both sides. It quite effectively sticks to the rock by the way.


When the sound pressure hits the first layer of rock it causes a microscopic movement in a sheering manner in relation to the layer behind it. THis movement or vibration is transmitted through the wall damp material and converted to small amounts of heat.


You might be surprised by the actual material. It is not limp as I expected rather its more like a thick roofing felt. Its very easy to cut with a pair of scissors and so if you can get it in sheet form it wont pose any problems for you.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Hi rwalton,


I called PT. They do sell directly now. but with a $250 minimum order. Oddly enough, he wouldn't give me price per sheet! and says that depends on the square footage. He though it was 54x40" sheets, but he wasn't sure.


So, next question is, how big of a squares and how many to put down per sheet rock. I gotta do some calculations, but if you've done that already, please let me know.


Thanks

Farid
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Well, did some calcs and for my room I'm gonna need about 6 sheets. at $2 per sq ft avg cost with a 54x40 sheet being 15' per sheet. That gives me $30 per sheet. so its $180 bucks for me. Their min order is $250, which would be around 8.3 sheet.s so lets say 9 sheets.


So, rwalton, if you know how many sheets you want, we can combine it, I can order it and sell you the delta at cost since I will only need 6 sheets or so.


Please let me know asap.


Thanks
 

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Farid,


I don't have time right now to check/post any details, but your numbers seem a bit low to me unless you have a pretty small room. If you're shooting for installing to ASC specs, you need strips for each joint on the first layer of drywall, strips for the locations of the joints of the second layer of drywall, 4 inch squares every foot between drywall layers, strips on the RC-1 and RC-2, plus strips on the studs under the RC. When I get a chance I'll check my calcs again to see approximately how much this comes out to be in terms of sq. ft of WallDamp per sq. ft. of wall.


Also, I won't be ready for the WallDamp for at least another 8 weeks. Still framing and wiring at this point.


Rick
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Hi Rick,


I missed the strips for the sheetrock joints. Had everything else.


Keep in mind, my room is 25' x 12x 8 (lwh). However, the front wall (12x8) is not going to be sheetrocked. that is where the screen goes and I'm padding it down with SAB and leaving it covered with fabric.


The first 5 ft of the left/right wall are also going to be left padded with SAB and not sheet rocked. Idea is to leave the ront of the room completely dead where the front speakers go to avoid reflections, and first order side reflections.


I've got NHT T5 towers (where the sub is in the base of the tower of the front speakers), with 5 more M5s for center/surround/rears on a 7.1 setup. These speakers sound sweat. Driven by a pair of Bryston 9BSTs and an Anthem AVM20.


Anyway I digress. The left/right walls, now 20'x8' will be double sheet rocked. the ceiling (25'x12') will be single rock. The back wall is also single rock (12'x8').


Oh I forgot another thing though, the back wall will be using RC1/Wallpad on both sides, so that adds some more.


I think at $250 min, I'm going go get 8 or 9 sheets. I'll have to add the strips for the joints to the calcs.


Thanks for pointing that out.


Sounds like I'll finish first. In that case I'll give you an update on how the install went.


Farid
 

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The stuff you guys are talking about may be way better but I just used common fiberglass insulation behind my drywall, in the cieling too. Also bed comforters tacked in front of the walls and colored bed sheets for 'wall paper' over them to place movie posters, etc. Os
 

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Hi Farid,


Don't know if you have it or not, but I can email the .pdf of the IsoWall installation instructions. I downloaded it from the ASC site, but recently went back there and couldn't find it. It might have been removed. It is pretty detailed. It might mention other details you could have accidentally overlooked. Leave me an address via PM if you're interested.


BTW how do you like the AVM20? I haven't bought a Pre/Pro. yet and that one was on my list of considered options. Also thinking about a used Bryston SP-1. It's upgradeable, but I'm only planning on 5.1 at this point (maybe forever!).


Rick
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Hi Rick,


I don't have the PDF and would appreciate a copy. left you a pm with an Email address.


Os, your solution would also work, it just depends on how high end one is trying to get and how much of a perfectionist you want to be.


Rick,


haven't got the AVM20 yet, its in the mail and canada post has had it for two weeks, getting really anxious. the AVM20 got great reviews, has all the features of the SP1 and the Lex, is upgradable, supports multiple zones, does 7.1, includes all balanced outputs, handles component switching to HDTV res. has Svideo connection for all inputs, and some other very nice touches in software.


An audiophile friend of mine has it with the Bryston 9Bs, and Veritas speakers and they sound great. the 9Bs on an old yamaha and the NHT Evolution T5s and surrounds and they sound incredible. Can't imagine what the AVM20 is gonna do to it.


I also needed the multi-zone capabilities of the AVM20 to handle other rooms, as well as its IR inputs and repeaters.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Rick,


Any idea what material to use as a substitute for their ASC Wall Gasket (1/" thick by 2" I think) which goes around the wall to support wall edges for sheet rock to rest on?


Also, what about the wall bearing felt (1/4" thick I think) that goes on the floor and the sheet rock sits on. Still looking for the substitute for these.


I got the samples and price sheets from ASC. Boy are they proud of their stuff!


Thanks for any help and pointers.
 

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Farid,


Here are the substitute parts I'm planning to use:


For the perimeter gasket, the ASC material appears to be identical to the material used by concrete contractors as "expansion joint". I called a local industrial supply warehouse and they sell this material in 4x10 sheets. They're about $25/sheet, way less than ASC's stuff. You can also find this material at Home Depot, but only in 4 inch wide strips and fairly expensive in that form factor.


For the wall bearing felt, you can get similar material (actually much better with high wool content) from McMasterCar.com. They aren't what I would call cheap either, but ASC's price is even more I believe.


ASC should be proud of their stuff. They seem to have about the best system going as far as I can tell, but their price is a killer. However, if one is interested enough to take the time to locate the substitute material (and in some case "exact" substitutions), you can save yourself a bundle. In my case the ASC estimate for my room was roughly $5K (not counting drywall, screws or labor). I estimate the substitute materials will be about $1100. Yes, I do have to do a bit more work (cut WallDamp strips, rip the concrete gasket etc.), but for a savings of $4K, it's worth it to me. I can buy a boatload of music/DVDs for that savings and still have a "top of the line" room.


I'm at the wrong computer at the moment, but I'll send the IsoWall .pdf when I get a chance.


Rick
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Hi Rick,


Can't find any part#s or material matching expansion joint (everything seems to be for pipes). Also McMasterCar has tons of stuff, but didn't se anything resembling bearing felt.


Do you have part#s or mfg/item#s for these that would help me find them directly?


I'm trying to order the Polymer ADA stuff today but now they are telling me they won't ship until january which blows it out of my schedule. Trying to see if they can expedite that.



Thanks for all your help.
 

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I have a 19Lx17wx9h HT room under construction. I called ASC for a quote on Iso Wall. The quote was $2900 plus $300 shipping. Thanks to you guys I have saved about $2,200.00.


I am doing all resilient channel, double rock, walls and ceiling. Got 19 sheets of Polydamp ADA for $570.00. Instead of wall bearing felt, I got 2" rubber vibration pads to sit the drywall on from Super Soundproofing, Inc. (don't have number but they have a web site). Forty of them placed every two feet cost $60.00, total. Also got tubes of acoustic caulk from them. Got the resilient channel from a local building supply for $110.00. The only thing I bought from ASC was the perimeter gasket. It is sold in 100 foot linear runs for $48.80, so three of them cost about $150.00.


By the time it is all said and done, I have gotten the exact same materials ASC quoted me, for a total delivered price of less than $1,000.00.


The only thing I have not found yet is dense acoustic insualtion material. Any suggestions for suppliers?
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Twitchy,


I was just gonna order the gasket look alike and the felt strips from McMaster. but they run more expenvsive for the gasket than ASC, so perfect timing on the Email. I'm gonna call ASC instead.


Where did you get the 2" vibration pad, and do you have a part#?
 

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What are these items you guys always mention and are they used for non theatre rooms too?: GOM, ASC, ISO WALL, BATTING, RC, POLYDAMP ADA SHEETS, GASKETS, SOFFETS, RESILIANT CHANNEL?? I'm not sure they mention these a lot in the fancy HT Interiors magazines. Os
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
I ended up ordering F-3 Felt material from McMaster.com, it was rather expensive ($35 for 25' section), but I think I like that better than the individual vibration pads. here is the info:


4 EA 87395K652 - F-3 Gray Felt Strip $34.75 EA today

Adhesive Backed, 1" WD, 1/4"

Thick, 25' Length


I did get the gaskets from ASC since the price for something similar from McMaster was double that. However ASC price for the felt was $100 for 25' which was ridiculous.


So, thanks to everyone for all the help. Now I got the gasket, felt, RC1, and RC2 (for ceiling). Ordering the Poly ADA, and we're good to go. All for much cheaper than what ASC wanted.


All it takes is some leg work and knowledgable friends on AVS. Thanks again
 
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