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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Is this something unique to only my HT1000? Or is this universal for all displays which can accept DVI?

And why?


Bob
 

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Bob,


I had an HT1000 for a while and never figured it was a problem. I could adjust the individual RGB gammas and offsets, which to me was plenty good enough and is more flexible. You do have to go uncheck the 6500 selection to get into those individual adjustment controls, though.


--Darin
 

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The same bonehead that left out the ability to bypass scaling when 1:1 can be achieved.


I know, it's only in some displays, but I hate running into those crippled devices.
 

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Probably some CRT guy with friends trying to sabotage the NEC.:)


Most all have at least the Color and Tint disabled, some everything disabled on DVI like the NEC.


If a projector was calibrated correctly and there was a "standard" controls should't really be needed for DVI.
 

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The bone head of cost reduction?


One point to consider in the current HT1000 firmware, contrast and brightness are GLOBAL settings for ALL inputs. In order to address different input PQ needs, you have to make "picture" adjustments as needed.


However, the individual RGB gammas and offsets can be stored under the USER 1, 2, 3 & 4 memory banks.


Whatever NEC has up their sleeve in future HT1000 software enhancements, I hope the programmable USER modes are among the features retained and expanded.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Darin and Bytehoven,


I understand that I can set up different memories with different individual settings as an alternative. But what I'm experiencing is that some source material is hot and giving me crushed whites. When I'm connected via RGB I've found that I can usually help this by knocking down the contrast a little. Sometimes it's just that easy. Why shouldn't it be just that easy with DVI. I guess I don't understand why a firmware change could not afford us that adjustment with DVI too without having to make major changes elsewhere. Or why that would have been a cost reduction measure.


Bob
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by JimmyR
Probably some CRT guy with friends trying to sabotage the NEC.:)


Most all have at least the Color and Tint disabled, some everything disabled on DVI like the NEC.


If a projector was calibrated correctly and there was a "standard" controls should't really be needed for DVI.
CRT folks hold a special place in their hearts due to the wonderful PG and XG projectors that continue to offer compromised pictures. NEC is still a great company even though they are blinded by the light.
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by RobertWood
Darin and Bytehoven,


I understand that I can set up different memories with different individual settings as an alternative. But what I'm experiencing is that some source material is hot and giving me crushed whites. When I'm connected via RGB I've found that I can usually help this by knocking down the contrast a little. Sometimes it's just that easy. Why shouldn't it be just that easy with DVI. I guess I don't understand why a firmware change could not afford us that adjustment with DVI too without having to make major changes elsewhere. Or why that would have been a cost reduction measure.


Bob
Having seen the HT1000 schematics, I don't think they can simply turn on DVI processing features. The HT1000 has architecture limitations. I'm certain the HT1000 would need a firmware overhaul to incorporate a DVI image processing input stage. Maybe some one clever, could hack a mod, and the HT1000 is certainly a good enough platform for hackers. Look at the attention the LT150 received.


Also it ain't cheap. You'll find DVI is simply a by-pass function right to the scaler. Expanding the input stage to include manipulation of a digital signal requires extra goodies, and to have the process done well does not come with out a hit. How many third party boxes do you see that can manage a DVI input? Maybe just one, the Faroudja at $6k.


I think it's pretty cool, that we have Tom and others who have already played around and achieved some RGB gamma and offset setting recommendations. I plan to start with Tom's numbers, throw up my test patterns and see what additional tweaks work best for me on a 1.1 gain HCCV screen. I'll be sure to post some feedback.


IMHO, we have a better chance of finding an external sub $1000 DVI video processor, than having the current projectors firmware/software upgraded to handle the challenge.


Hey, maybe the D2 will expand on it's minor DVI scaling capabilities with some additional PQ controls. One can have hopes & dreams. ;-)


The real trick is cost. Now that HDCP seems to be making serious progress with the Marantz 8400 DVI output getting officially turned on, out board processors may soon follow.


We'll see...
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
If all that's true (and I'll have to take your word for it cause I'm a technical dummy) then I'll accept it. Don't like it. But will accept it. :)
 

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Quote:
Having seen the HT1000 schematics, I don't think they can simply turn on DVI processing features. The HT1000 has architecture limitations. I'm certain the HT1000 would need a firmware overhaul to incorporate a DVI image processing input stage.
The Samsung DLP rear projection has all of those features and more, and it's a consumer TV.

Quote:
Also it ain't cheap. You'll find DVI is simply a by-pass function right to the scaler. Expanding the input stage to include manipulation of a digital signal requires extra goodies, and to have the process done well does not come with out a hit.
I've found that alot of displays have scalers that kick on which I find annoying if it cannot be bypassed. (Sorry if I misunderstood your meaning). In fact, DVI at 1080i is scaled and most displays can handle it fine.

Quote:
How many third party boxes do you see that can manage a DVI input? Maybe just one, the Faroudja at $6k.
HD Leeza and a new ATSC Tuner/Scaler from Key Digital

Immersive Holo3DGraph+HD Aux and upcoming aSimilator

MDP-120+DVI daughtercard and upcoming MVS-500 ATSC Tuner/Scaler from MIT
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Tonight a major tragedy befell me, Kei. I sure wish you would try to help me through this trying time. I would go over to the HTPC forum for help but every time I do I feel like a fish out of water.


I went to play a DVD a little while ago and out of left field my HTPC decided to go on vacation.

It won't put a picture in the overlay. Not with Theater Tek, WinDVD or the ATI player. The DVD is playing and has sound but no video in the overlay.

A week or so ago I replaced my old Radeon VE with a 7500 and used the drivers on the disc which came with it. Everything went smooth. I've played a dozen or more DVD's no problemo. Everything AOK.

Then tonight all of a sudden no video. I looked at all the display settings and don't see anything that's changed. So the only thing I knew to do was to get rid of the drivers and download and replace them with the current Catalyst drivers. That all went smooth too. But still no overlay video.


I sold my Momitsu and shipped it yesterday. That was the only DVD player I had. And now I can't watch DVD at all. Oh woe is me.


Bob
 

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Robert,


No problem. I'd be happy to help. Are you only using VGA or DVI output from the Radeon? Or both?


Be back in a second...I have to reboot because my Outlook is acting up.

Ooops, that was wierd. I must have taken the server down with me when I rebooted.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Thanks so much, Kei, for taking the time to help me.


I have DVI connected to the projector and RGB connected to my PC monitor at the same time. When I first installed the 7500 and drivers from disk the default settings were not giving me DVI. I had to go in the display properties and change it to get both working. Don't even remember what I did but I think it was something to do with moving the two monitor icons around.


After reading your message I went right to monkeying around with that again. Moving the monitor icons and changing back and forth between

the "default display" and "multiple display" settings. Now the picture on my PC monitor only has a desktop background and nothing else. No desktop icons and when I open a browser window or anything else it's not there. BUT whatever I changed also gives me a DVD overlay with the DVI picture (the projector).

I know I should have waited until you coached me further along but didn't.


Bob
 

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I forgot to ask, when you loaded the Catalyst drivers, did you also install the ATI control panel?


P.S. I also sent you a PM.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Thanks, Kei. The tips you gave me in the PM got me in the right direction.

I'm now seeing DVD again. Hooray.


Bob
 

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Immersive Virtuoso PJ has full control over DVI. ;)
 
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