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which one is a better choice 4500 or 3700?
Better is all in the eye of the beholder, so that is up to you.

We don't know all the specs of the 3700 yet to make a full comparison, but it will likely be the 3600 plus HDMI 2.1 (which is what this thread is all about) being the main addition.

Read dfa973's full comparison and make your own choice:
Gain/Loss comparison of Denon AVR-X3600H vs X4500H

Plus the 3700 will likely cost more at release than the 4500 does now.
 
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Plus the 3700 will likely cost more at release than the 4500 does now.[/QUOTE]


yes youre right. However if earc works flawlessly, then maybe 4500 at a discounted price would be an excellent choice.
 

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what about 4500 vs 3700?
As @Baff already said, we need to know the X3700H features in detail to make a true comparison.


I couldn't imagine average Joe picking up an amp on Amazon to replace their 10 year old Onkyo... only to be faced with a computer based Dirac setup! Imagine if a firmware update then proceeded to nuke your Dirac setup like it does with Arcam!
Amen to that!

Dirac needs to be at the same level of friendliness as Audyssey is right now to be integrated in a an average Home Theatre.
 

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On a very quick look at the DSPs used in the Denon/Marantz units and for Dirac - both Audyssey and Dirac run on Analog Devices SHARC processors ADSP-213xx or ADSP-214xx chips, so D+M can convert from Audyssey to Dirac if they want, but probably it will take more than a compatible DSP for D+M to do that... ;)
Isn't there the other issue of the mic needed for measurements? The mic currently supplied with Audyssey isn't good enough for DIRAC.
 

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Dirac is well and truly niche - to the point that even many enthusiasts struggle to use it the first time they get a receiver with it.

I couldn't imagine average Joe picking up an amp on Amazon to replace their 10 year old Onkyo... only to be faced with a computer based Dirac setup! Imagine if a firmware update then proceeded to nuke your Dirac setup like it does with Arcam!

It would either jam up forums like this or clog up the returns dept at Amazon!

Maybe it would be a blessing, Denon may have the resources to bring the whole process onboard and in doing so make it easier.

Could be they are licensing the algorithms and intend to run them with their own interface on the AVR.
That would be something worth its weight in gold.
 
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Maybe it would be a blessing, Denon may have the resources to bring the whole process onboard and in doing so make it easier.

Could be they are licensing the algorithms and intend to run them with their own interface on the AVR.
That would be something worth its weight in gold.

Denon aren't in the business of developing their own room correction system - they pay a licensing fee for someone else to do that.
Dirac may get easier! Or, it may get more convoluted with multiple levels (Basic like you find on the NAD's out the box, 2nd tier like we see on Arcam etc... and then bass management optional upgrade etc).
It's geeky stuff for geeky theater fans, it is what it is.
 

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Denon aren't in the business of developing their own room correction system - they pay a licensing fee for someone else to do that.
Dirac may get easier! Or, it may get more convoluted with multiple levels (Basic like you find on the NAD's out the box, 2nd tier like we see on Arcam etc... and then bass management optional upgrade etc).
It's geeky stuff for geeky theater fans, it is what it is.

It really is too esoteric for the majority of users. Also, the support model is convoluted, as users have to contact Dirac directly for support of the PC application and their AVR/processor manufacturer for problems related to the hardware integration of Dirac.
 

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Denon aren't in the business of developing their own room correction system - they pay a licensing fee for someone else to do that.
Dirac may get easier! Or, it may get more convoluted with multiple levels (Basic like you find on the NAD's out the box, 2nd tier like we see on Arcam etc... and then bass management optional upgrade etc).
It's geeky stuff for geeky theater fans, it is what it is.

Hence the license part I spoke about - they don't have to develop the room correction algorithms (the hard part), just engineer it into the processor onboard and build a UI for onboard (The easy part which they do today for Audyssey).

They just need the minimum power to crunch the numbers with Dirac's algorithms on-board to feed the DSP with the proper filters.
They may need a bit more processor power than today but that's likely a small thing. I doubt Dirac "Crushs" a PC to run it, and cycles are cheap now.

This volume this would bring to Dirac is a huge, so I bet they would be bending over backward to win this contract.
 

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They just need the minimum power to crunch the numbers with Dirac's algorithms on-board to feed the DSP with the proper filters.
They may need a bit more processor power than today but that's likely a small thing. I doubt Dirac "Crushs" a PC to run it, and cycles are cheap now.
If Dirac can't find a way to be fully integrated into an AVR/AVC - with no external computational device required* - is dead in the water, literally, and it will stay niche of a niche for the rest of its life...

* I'm not talking about a smartphone or tablet...

Audyssey does not lack very much to be on the same level as Dirac - XT32 is very capable, cheaper, fully integrated, it just needs some love for better customization - more exactly, it needs a better Audyssey MultEQ Editor app - which, by the way, is made by D+M, not the Audyssey Labs...

And we return to Dirac - which needs to be more friendly with the owner, optimized, frugal, integrated, and I am not sure that D+M really wants to put the effort for this, based on their effort for the Audyssey MultEQ Editor app...

Squeezing a standalone Dirac in a receiver will be much harder than integrating and optimizing Audyssey.
 

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Reply in PM to keep on topic =)
 

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Hence the license part I spoke about - they don't have to develop the room correction algorithms (the hard part), just engineer it into the processor onboard and build a UI for onboard (The easy part which they do today for Audyssey).

They just need the minimum power to crunch the numbers with Dirac's algorithms on-board to feed the DSP with the proper filters.
They may need a bit more processor power than today but that's likely a small thing. I doubt Dirac "Crushs" a PC to run it, and cycles are cheap now.

This volume this would bring to Dirac is a huge, so I bet they would be bending over backward to win this contract.
Several factors for Denon if considering about implementing Dirac, these are:
  • Royalty $ cost
  • Software development $ cost & resources
  • Does having Dirac increase the sales potential
Conclusions...
Denon and Marantz are already paying significant royalties to Audyssey, Dolby, DTS, HDMI, Sonos. Also since 80% of the Denon AVR sales come from mid-range and lower price-range products, basic question is can these price-sensitive products afford the $ margin hit to add Dirac. Today Audyssey is well-accepted, yet many users still prefer to turn OFF. Sound United wanted to buy Onkyo because they had their own assembly factory in Malaysia which was very experienced for AVRs, as now they are paying significant $ to Inkel/Sherwood as a subcontractor. Over the last 8 years Denon and Marantz have struggled to be profitable as they try to gain market share compared to Yamaha which does have its own design group and assembly factories.. IMHO... The only way that Dirac works for D&M is that together with Dirac they prepare a business model that can cover the target development resources. The guys @ Sound United are smart and experienced, hopefully they will figure things out..

Just my $0.02... ;)
 

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Several factors for Denon if considering about implementing Dirac, these are:
  • Royalty $ cost
  • Software development $ cost & resources
  • Does having Dirac increase the sales potential
Conclusions...
Denon and Marantz are already paying significant royalties to Audyssey, Dolby, DTS, HDMI, Sonos. Also since 80% of the Denon AVR sales come from mid-range and lower price-range products, basic question is can these price-sensitive products afford the $ margin hit to add Dirac. Today Audyssey is well-accepted, yet many users still prefer to turn OFF. Sound United wanted to buy Onkyo because they had their own assembly factory in Malaysia which was very experienced for AVRs, as now they are paying significant $ to Inkel/Sherwood as a subcontractor. Over the last 8 years Denon and Marantz have struggled to be profitable as they try to gain market share compared to Yamaha which does have its own design group and assembly factories.. IMHO... The only way that Dirac works for D&M is that together with Dirac they prepare a business model that can cover the target development resources. The guys @ Sound United are smart and experienced, hopefully they will figure things out..

Just my $0.02... ;)

Reply in PM to keep from thread derail.
 

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Late to the party but thanks for gathering the infos guys.
Looking forward to get a x4700 or x6700h on release to address VRR (from my Xbox One X) + atmos unlike my x4500h.
 

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The only thing I know is that Marantz will also offer a HDMI 2.1 upgrade board for their AV8805.
But I do not know if there will be a new Marantz AVR this year.
 
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