[DarkFudge]

Guys which of these TVs does a better job with the SD images?



I know HD will be stunning on both but since 90% of TV out now is still SD and will be for a few years, I might want to choose one over the other based on it's SD image as well



How do they compare?



Also with Video game performance ( lag, refresh) which performs better?



thanks

 

[omeletpants]

Kuro. It's not even close

 

[sharpjunkie]

whichever one that you buy will have a superior image!

 

[doogiehowser]

SD on my Panasonic is very good. I watch lots of SD programming and am happy with how my Panasonic handles older SD shows. Zoom feature is invaluable for filling the whole screen without distorting the picture.


I saw the newest 60" Pioneer Elite at Best Buy and was not impressed. It was okay, but not as big a difference as 2 years ago where the Elite was much better than the competition. I remember back then seeing the Elite next to a LG plasma and 73" DLP and thinking how good Elite is. Last weekened I saw the Elite next to Panasonic and thought they were both very good but Pioneer was not worth the extra money.

 

[DarkFudge]

ok guys...I dont know how I could actually get 3 different answers with only 2 choices but I did!?


Which is it!?...please

 

[E-A-G-L-E-S]



Quote:
Originally Posted by doogiehowser /forum/post/12911329


SD on my Panasonic is very good. I watch lots of SD programming and am happy with how my Panasonic handles older SD shows. Zoom feature is invaluable for filling the whole screen without distorting the picture.


I saw the newest 60" Pioneer Elite at Best Buy and was not impressed. It was okay, but not as big a difference as 2 years ago where the Elite was much better than the competition. I remember back then seeing the Elite next to a LG plasma and 73" DLP and thinking how good Elite is. Last weekened I saw the Elite next to Panasonic and thought they were both very good but Pioneer was not worth the extra money.

What?

The Pioneers took a gigantic leap forward this year with the Kuro line.

Is this the same 60" Elite Pioneer that costco has for $3K? Funny, because even the 50"-768p-Elite is more than $3K

Darkfudge....I cannot speak for SD on the Panasonic, but Samsung has a nicer HD PQ in my experience and Sammy's are definitely not on the Kuro's level for SD or HD.

 

[hi im drummer03]



Quote:
Originally Posted by E-A-G-L-E-S /forum/post/12913433


What?

The Pioneers took a gigantic leap forward this year with the Kuro line.

Is this the same 60" Elite Pioneer that costco has for $3K? Funny, because even the 50"-768p-Elite is more than $3K

Darkfudge....I cannot speak for SD on the Panasonic, but Samsung has a nicer HD PQ in my experience and Sammy's are definitely not on the Kuro's level for SD or HD.

Samsung run great on HD but very poor on SD...Kind of like how a race car runs when its on race gas versus pump gas..

 

[discopaul]



Quote:
Originally Posted by E-A-G-L-E-S /forum/post/12913433


Darkfudge....I cannot speak for SD on the Panasonic, but Samsung has a nicer HD PQ in my experience and Sammy's are definitely not on the Kuro's level for SD or HD.

Hah. Don't believe the hype Darkfudge. The Sammy does very well here. Honestly for SD, I'd rank the 3 brands about the same. Most of the time on all these brands it's a function of the SD signal. Depending on it, you PQ will be fair to very good. Regardless, it can't match HD.

Since you're a gamer I still recommend LCD over plasma for those who game often. Despite the hype you're gonna hear, IR is still a weakness for Plasma technology.

If your mostly into movies I'd recommend the Sammy 5064 or 5084 plasma. The 3d like images and details are something the others can't match.

 

[E-A-G-L-E-S]



Quote:
Originally Posted by discopaul /forum/post/12913746


Hah. Don't believe the hype Darkfudge. The Sammy does very well here. Honestly for SD, I'd rank the 3 brands about the same. Most of the time on all these brands it's a function of the SD signal. Depending on it, you PQ will be fair to very good. Regardless, it can't match HD.

Since you're a gamer I still recommend LCD over plasma for those who game often. Despite the hype you're gonna hear, IR is still a weakness for Plasma technology.

If your mostly into movies I'd recommend the Sammy 5064 or 5084 plasma. The 3d like images and details are something the others can't match.

1. I owned the Samsung 5044 and 5084 and they are not as good with SD as the kuro.

2. IR is so minute on Pioneer's. This is actually one of Samsungs' weak points. More than Panasonic as well.

3. Are you saying the 5084 produces a 3D image that no other plasma can match let alone beat?

 

[swifty7]

I know that my 5265 lcd produces incredible 3d image more so than my previous Panny Plasma, but when it comes to SD it falters.

 

[discopaul]



Quote:
Originally Posted by E-A-G-L-E-S /forum/post/12913819


1. I owned the Samsung 5044 and 5084 and they are not as good with SD as the kuro.

2. IR is so minute on Pioneer's. This is actually one of Samsungs' weak points. More than Panasonic as well.

3. Are you saying the 5084 produces a 3D image that no other plasma can match let alone beat?

Yes I am, unequivocally!

 

[omeletpants]

I have owned Samsungs and Pioneer Elites and there is no question the Pioneers handle SD better. It's just a fact. BTW, I'm watching a Samsung 5053 right now and the HD is fabulous, but on SD it's not the match of the Pioneers.

 

[discopaul]

Well, I'm not gonna post...again, the test reports that show the SD for a kuro as average at best.

I know if something is repeated often enough it's accepted. This meme that the the Pioneers/Kuro have superior SD is simply not true but I know perceptions often takes precedence.

 

[discopaul]

Oh what the hell, I'll post 'em again.


Here's Ultimate AV review of the Kuro 5080 SD:

Its video processing performance with 480i sources, however, was more mixed. On the HQV Benchmark test DVD it earned only a fair grade on the second jaggies test and showed visible deinterlacing artifacts on both the waving flag test and the 2:2 (video) cadence testin any setting of the PureCinema control. But it passed the first jaggies test, captured 3/2 pulldown, did well with mixed content (a video scroll over a film background), and sailed through the Gladiator Coliseum flyover test (chapter 12).

http://ultimateavmag.com/flatpaneldi...ro/index1.html


Here's the AV review of the Kuro 6010 SD:

Its performance with 480i sources, however, was disappointing. On the HQV Benchmark test DVD (SD), in any setting of the PureCinema control, over either HDMI or component, it did only fair on the second jaggies tests, failed the waving flag test with clearly visible artifacts, was slow to capture and hold onto 3:2 pulldown, and failed the 2:2 (video) cadence test. It also did poorly with mixed content (scrolling video lettering over a film background). Its deinterlacing was slightly worse than the PDP-5080HD's, and that had been marginal at best.


In fairness, however, good 480i program material, as opposed to my torture tests, rarely showed artifacts. And be honest with yourself; how many 480i sources do have that you plan to feed directly into the PDP-6010FD, without first scaling them or at least deinterlacing them at the source?

http://ultimateavmag.com/flatpaneldi...60/index3.html


I'm not saying that the Pannies and Sammies are better. I'm just saying not to get caught up in the marketing and whiz bang hype which often leads many to believe some performance advantage where there really isn't.

 

[iamkoza]

you think you'll be watching sd 90% of the time... until you get the tv and realize you are only surfing between the HD channels and not even bothering to look at the SD channels

 

[E-A-G-L-E-S]



Quote:
Originally Posted by discopaul /forum/post/12914299


Yes I am, unequivocally!

I'll say one thing, you are a great Samsung customer, lol.

 

[E-A-G-L-E-S]



Quote:
Originally Posted by discopaul /forum/post/12914609


Oh what the hell, I'll post 'em again.


Here's Ultimate AV review of the Kuro 5080 SD:

Its video processing performance with 480i sources, however, was more mixed. On the HQV Benchmark test DVD it earned only a fair grade on the second jaggies test and showed visible deinterlacing artifacts on both the waving flag test and the 2:2 (video) cadence testin any setting of the PureCinema control. But it passed the first jaggies test, captured 3/2 pulldown, did well with mixed content (a video scroll over a film background), and sailed through the Gladiator Coliseum flyover test (chapter 12).

http://ultimateavmag.com/flatpaneldi...ro/index1.html


Here's the AV review of the Kuro 6010 SD:

Its performance with 480i sources, however, was disappointing. On the HQV Benchmark test DVD (SD), in any setting of the PureCinema control, over either HDMI or component, it did only fair on the second jaggies tests, failed the waving flag test with clearly visible artifacts, was slow to capture and hold onto 3:2 pulldown, and failed the 2:2 (video) cadence test. It also did poorly with mixed content (scrolling video lettering over a film background). Its deinterlacing was slightly worse than the PDP-5080HD's, and that had been marginal at best.


In fairness, however, good 480i program material, as opposed to my torture tests, rarely showed artifacts. And be honest with yourself; how many 480i sources do have that you plan to feed directly into the PDP-6010FD, without first scaling them or at least deinterlacing them at the source?

http://ultimateavmag.com/flatpaneldi...60/index3.html


I'm not saying that the Pannies and Sammies are better. I'm just saying not to get caught up in the marketing and whiz bang hype which often leads many to believe some performance advantage where there really isn't.

Disco...I had the 5084 and 5080 in my living room at the same time...please stop saying that I or anyonew that knows the Pineer is better are just following the group and don't know for ourselves

 

[discopaul]



Quote:
Originally Posted by E-A-G-L-E-S /forum/post/12917792


Disco...I had the 5084 and 5080 in my living room at the same time...please stop saying that I or anyonew that knows the Pineer is better are just following the group and don't know for ourselves

I know, please don't confuse me with measured results that reflect poorly on Pioneer. Just the results that show Kuro has lower black levels

 

[discopaul]



Quote:
Originally Posted by E-A-G-L-E-S /forum/post/12917778


I'll say one thing, you are a great Samsung customer, lol.

I accept that. I'm not trying to bash Pioneer just attempting to put them back down to earth. I think they are fine but I find the fanatacism for them here WAY OVER THE TOP. As a result some people may be disappointed when things go wrong because the expectations are set way too high for them.

 

[E-A-G-L-E-S]



Quote:
Originally Posted by discopaul /forum/post/12918383


I know, please don't confuse me with measured results that reflect poorly on Pioneer. Just the results that show Kuro has lower black levels

You call it fanboyism, but it is just fact